Last season it was a fact of life that the Niners had a great defense and the Raiders had an atrocious one.
The Niners ranked fourth in yards allowed and second in points allowed. Exemplary. The Raiders ranked 29th in yards allowed and 29th in points allowed. Putrid.
But there was one key stat in which they were similar – opponents’ passer rating.
The Niners graded out towards the top of the league – No. 5. They held opposing QBs to a 73.6 rating.
But here’s what surprised me when I looked it up: The Raiders ranked 11th. They held opposing QBs to a 81.3 rating. That’s pretty good.
Now that they’ve replaced Stanford “The Human Pass Interference Penalty” Routt with Ronald Bartell, they should be even better against the pass. And if new coach Dennis Allen can eliminate half the penalties and get his defense to stop the run, the Raiders could have a good defense this season.
One more thing: The Seahawks ranked 6th, holding opposing QBs to a 74.7 rating. They accomplished this while getting below-average pressure on the QB – just 33 sacks all season. Their defense is young and they just added a sub-package defensive end – Bruce Irvin – whom Pete Carrols hopes will be his Aldon Smith. They could be an elite defense this season.
I put this out for your information. I find it kind of interesting. I hope you do, too.
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Grant,
One of the reasons why Seattle had good stats against the pass is they’re in NFC West. Which team in the NCF West has a starting QB that scares you? Do you know what this stat is for games they played outside the division (for both the Niners and Seattle)?
Having said that, I think both Seattle and the Rams have upgraded their defense. The NFC West will be a tougher division – at least on the defensive side.
I’ll tally that up for you.
Other reasons the Seahawks had a good opponents’ passer rating: Brandon Browner, Richard Sherman, Kam Chancellor and Earl Thomas.
And imagine this: Next season, Anthony Davis will have to block Bruce Irvin on passing downs, not Red Bryant. Irvin should be a much tougher assignment.
The NFC West is developing into one of the best defensive divisions in the NFL. 49ers and Seahwaks already have really good defenses, and the Rams and Cards defenses are coming on. The offenses are still mediocre, and the team that develops a potent offense first will be the one that goes on to dominate the division for a few seasons. Thankfully I believe the 49ers are ahead in this game at the moment.
Excatly Grant. Seattle defense will be top 5 this year. That’s a scary looking unit they’re building over there. Two stud young safeties. Two tall(6’4 and 6’2), physical, pressing CBs. A good UT in Mebane, a underated Red Bryant at DE and Clemons on the outside. And they added Jason Jones, who should help their pass-rush at DT in their sub package. They get a MLB to tie it all together(they drafted one I really liked in Bobby Wagner) and the NFC West will claim two of the better defenses in the league this year.
What do you think of the Cardinals defense? They recorded just as many sacks as the Niners did last regular season (42), and their opponents’ passer rating (82.5) ranked 13th.
And what do you think about the Rams defense? They just added two very talented CBs – Finnegan and Jenkins.
Not very high on the Cards. I see alot of holes in that unit. I think Rhodes is liability at FS. They have no one opposite PP, and even he didnt look as good as advertised last year at CB. I’m not sold on Acho and Schofield on the outside. Campbell is a beast and their D-Line looks solid on paper but Dockett has been very up and down lately. Even though they go into a second year in Horton’s scheme, Im not sure I’m buying that they’ll be improved. I just dont see enough playmakers. Good defenses have a abundance of playmakers. When I look ours, I see playmakers everywhere. I look Seattle’s, playmakers all throughout their secondary, and along the D-Line. When I look at the Cards I see Campbell, Wilson, maybe Dockett…..and thats about it.
Rams added some nice talent through the draft but they still have a ways to go. Chris Long is a stud. Lauranitus is a vastly over-rated pile jumper. Finnergan should be a good player for them, but he’s not the same guy that was considered one of the better CBs in the league a couple of years ago. Just not alot of veteran talent on that team. All their talent is young and inexperienced.
“The Seahawks ranked 6th, holding opposing QBs to a 74.7 rating.”
Good info, thanx.
But more important (& just asking): What rating did Seahawk Pass-D have against Alex Smith & 49ers?
Very easy to look up. Go to NFL.com and look at Alex Smiths game log
No real shock Grant.
Turnovers win and lose games. Not passer ratings. The Niners D got a lot of TO’s. The Raiders didn’t. Especially true when you look at the TO Margin.
No HC has ever gone into or out of game saying “We need to keep that Passer rating low, or else we are in trouble.” They do go into and out of games talking an awful lot about TO’s (whether they be the ones they got or gave away).
Turnovers, turnovers, turnovers. Ignore everything else, look at who won that single battle, and you will have the winner a lot more than not.
Turnovers are the only stat that has any meaning in my football brain.
@unercenter
I know. I wish Grant would focus on them a lot more instead stats. The #1 reason the Niners won so many games last year was because we won the TO battle virtually every game. The #1 reason we beat NO was because we won the TO battle setting us up for all those scores and preventing at least an easy 3 on that first NO possession. And the #1 reason we lost the game with the Giants is because we didn’t get any TO’s and we gave up 2 on ST. If that game had ended with a TO margin of 0, we win that game. If it ended with a TO margin of +3 (the 2 Int’s DG prevented and the 1 fumble the refs screwed us on) we win that game by a landslide.
Turnovers are everything. You get them, you win. You give them up, you lose.
Of course, you’re correct.
But turnovers fluctuate from year to year. These stats indicate to me that the Raiders could have a quick turnaround and be good on defense this season, and that the Seahawks D could go from good to great.
The Niners D should remain great, barring injuries.
The Seahawk D will go from good to great. Not because of this, but because they are going to be great. Flat out.
And there are teams who are typically in the top every year in TO’s. And those teams are the ones who we call great.
The Raider D sucks. All you have to do if you have a QB who has any legs is send your WR’s deep. The DB’s back will be turned with the safeties helping them out because the DB’s suck, and have a QB who can get by the LOS and run for 20 yards. That is what Tebow did.
And the Raiders have never done well against the rush for the last decade or so. So, no need to pass it if you can get 4-6 yards a pop running the ball. And most teams can.
The only way to lose to the Raider D is if YOU lose it. They most certainly will lose it. You just have to not suck, and Ta-Da! You’ll beat them.
This is a whole new Raiders defensive scheme and mentality. Dennis Allen is a good defensive coordinator. He’ll cut down the penalties.
Stopping the run is mostly about discipline and desire. Allen’s good at instilling that in his players. Plus, he’s probably going to run some 3-4 this season which will help their run D.
Grant
It is always a “whole new defensive scheme”. Every year. And, what happens?
“We will stop the run.” My grandma can run thru the holes they leave. They are the worse team in the NFL at maintaining their rushing lanes in the past decade.
“We will not commit stupid penalties.” Haha!
“We will tackle.” Who? You do know who the opponent is, right?
Every year it is the same Grant. Every year. And this year due to the stupid decision of the Raiders to trade for a QB who chooses to “throw it up” over the QB who actually had them at a winning record, they have no picks. Their #1 pick a few days ago is MIA (or at least he be, especially if the team wants to improve their MLB position) and nothing changes.
This is the dawning of the post-Al Davis era. They’re going to be a different team.
And Carson Palmer’s going to throw for 4,000 yards.
In 2010 The Steelers had a TO margin of +17
In 2011 the Steelers had a TO margin of -13
Guess which year they went to the Super Bowl?
Look at the playoff teams from just about any year. A super majority of them will have the teams who were in the + end of the TO battle. In the NFC this past year, the Niners and GB lead the conference in TO margin. The #1 TO Margin team in the AFC and #3 in the whole NFL were the Pats.
3/4 of the best record teams in the regular season went 1,2, 3 in TO Margin. That is not a shock. That is expected. And come playoff time, how often did the team on the – end of the TO battle win?
TO margin has no carryover from year to year, as you just demonstrated. I’m trying to project next season.
Carson Palmer will also throw 25 Ints as well. He stank it up last year.
He threw 25 picks in ’05 and ’06 combined. Why won’t he have the best season of his career in ’12? He’s got a ton of talent around him on offense.
Alex Smith threw 9 Int’s (and at least a few being after he was hurt) in 2011 and 2007 combined. What does that have to do with how good he is now?
Palmer has stank since his shoulder injury. AS has actually porgressed upward while Palmer has progressed downward.
There is a reason why no other team came remotely close to offering the Bengals what the Raiders offered for him. I think the next best offer was a single 5 round pick. The Raiders without Palmer won games. The Raiders with Palmer lost games. And Palmer didn’t help win down the stretch. The Raiders had the lowest or near to it scoring in the 2nd half and especially 4th quarter. That is money time for a QB. Can you do it under pressure? Palmer didn’t. He hasn’t for a number of years now.
Now they play in the wretched AFC West, so he might win a few games here and there. But the Raiders are not scaring anybody of any real power in the NFL. Why would they? Just don’t screw up, because they (including Palmer) will, and hand you the victory.
Turnovers and holding opponents QB to a low passer rating are equal stats in my book – neither of them are “the bottom line”.
Most important stats are points for and against, and at the end of the game are the ONLY stats that count.
:-)
Jim Harbaugh would say the only stats that count are the Win – Loss record…
:-)
..-turnovers are the bottomline ….
DS,
thanks for the great football knowledge. Sorry if I don’t agree with you, I seldom do.
You Alex first guys always want to point to the lack of importance in terms of passing production. You find different methods of defending passing mediocrity. I call BS on DS.
A QB’s Quarterback rating is important as long as the right stats that feed that rating are being focused on. Example, a high completion rating that fails to score or move the chains is worthless.
The only way to survive with that type of passing offense is to have a beast of a running back, or a beast of a defense.
What is most important especially with a pop gun QB is moving the chains and time of possession IMO. Look at these turnover differentials and you make up your mind.
Houston +7
Giants +7
Ravens + 2
Bengals Even
Saints -3
All of these teams were towards the middle of the pack in terms of T.O. differential. They did not get into the playoffs based on turnovers, instead they made it because they were well rounded teams that played defense, got some turnovers but also moved the ball on offense and scored. I would take every starting QB from any of these teams over Smith. Flacco is a toss up. All of theses teams got better production at QB than Smith even though he did a better job of “protecting” the ball.
Now the Niners, they were world class in terms of turnover differential. They were +28. No that is not a typo. Just imagine how good they could have been had they actually received consistent production in their passing game….
Houston was +7
@Bay
Three of the top four teams last year had a defense and it was defense that won the Super Bowl. Passing is great fun to watch but at this point its still defense that wins championships. Passing ratings to me are meaningless at this point, its trying to change but as of yet it hasnt. I agree with you that the type of info going into the ratings is important to give it meaning. Give me turnovers, which is a very variable stat as you cant count on it, and a good defense you will win more then you lose. Granted if the Niners had a good offense they would of been 19-0. Dont laugh at that, we were close to that without a good offense. The Niners had a decent offense and one that I am not quite comfortable with yet. It should be much better this year regardless of who the QB is.
Fully agree. If you look at the Cowboys game, unfortunately defense and coaching mistakes cost us that game.
If you look at the Cardinals game, poor safety tackling poor play calling and poor play from our QB lost that game for us.
Against the Ravens unfair game scheduling coupled with a terrible call and bad QB play cost us that game.
Basically what I am saying is the defense looking back was almost perfect and had to be. They didn’t receive much help except for Akers. That has to change this year.
The on stat that I don’t mention as much with Smith is sacks. The Ravens game game more than any other highlighted unneeded sacks. That game more than any demonstrated an area that Alex needs to step up more than any IMO. He needs to trust his read, step up in the pocket and take the shot. Last year I count roughly 10-12 sacks that were not on the Oline, but on Smith for not pulling the trigger and hanging on too long to the ball.
2nd year in the system that stat alone should improve.
That Raven game to me is the one that stands out more then the other losses. Now QB sacks, your right on the money with that. Its a tell-tell sign that something is wrong. Your right that AS doesnt pull the trigger soon enough. With that on slaught the Ravens did, AS should of adjusted his game to take care of the problem and he did not. The two things AS could of done was get rid of the ball quickly or roll out to help avoid pressure and he did neither. I dont place much importance of that travel thing, short work week , bad calls, eh the good teams win those kind of games.
@Bay:
The Ravens game game more than any other highlighted unneeded sacks. That game more than any demonstrated an area that Alex needs to step up more than any IMO.
You’re kidding, right? You’re going to blame Alex Smith for the o-line’s matador performance against the Ravens? The Ravens abused the right side of the 49ers’ line the entire game, particularly once Chilo came in to play.
Last year I count roughly 10-12 sacks that were not on the Oline, but on Smith for not pulling the trigger and hanging on too long to the ball.
Can you name them, or did you just make that number up?
The assertion that Smith takes too many sacks because he holds onto the ball too long is not supported by the facts. Here is a link to Football Outsiders’ charting of sacks allowed in 2011, which breaks down sacks by how quickly they occurred: http://www.footballoutsiders.com/under-pressure/2012/under-pressure-violence-rams
If you read the article, it explains that sacks which occur 3 seconds or longer after the snap are not blamed on the o-line, but are thought to be the responsibility of the QB (indecision) and/or the receivers (not getting open). I would add that sometimes the defense just plays good coverage. Anyway, if you look at the numbers for the sacks given up by the 49ers after 3 or more seconds, you will see that the 49ers are right at the league average. Actually, the 49ers numbers are slightly better than average (2.6% vs. 2.7%).
Where the 49ers did poorly was in giving up quick sacks (those that occur in less than 2.5 seconds), the sacks that are considered the line’s fault. The 49ers gave those up at almost twice the rate of the league average (3.3% vs 1.8%).
The problem in 2011 wasn’t with Smith for not pulling the trigger and for hanging on too long to the ball; it was with an offensive line that had serious pass protection issues.
How anyone can look for any type of analysis on the Ravens game is beyond me. Based on a very short week, travel across the country, a bad call on a chop block, and a drop by Ginn that might have put us within reach of winning and people are blaming Alex?
Bayarea, your a moron, plain and simple! Stop with the biased opinion already!
I guess cut and paste Claude and PrimeAlex forgot that Smith himself admited after the game that hung on to the ball too long and took sacks.
Harbaugh called him out on it after the game as well. They also called him out for not seeing a completely wide open Delaney Walker on a wheel route to start the game. Roman called it out over the head set.
You want to contest these too Claude?
@claude
“The assertion that Smith takes too many sacks because he holds onto the ball too long is not supported by the facts.”
How precisely is this determined?
If a QB holds onto the ball and does not get rid of it, and is sacked, then he is blamed. If a QB holds onto the bll, and does not get rif of it, and that extra time gets a WR open and the QB and WR make the play, we all go “YAAAA! Way to keepthe play alive and give your receivers time!”
If the QB gets rid of the ball to avoid getting sacked, then we sit here and say “He didn’t make a play.”
If the QB holds onto the ball instead of running for a nice gain of say 6 yards on 1st down and decides to throw it instead, we get mad at him if it is incomplete and happy if it is complete.
The point being that at the time it is happening, we don’t know what will happen. Thi is all done in hidsight. All us fan and media types just sit here and say what the QB should have done instead of what he did do. Well, duhh. The QB would do it differently as well if he could use such hindsight as we do here.
Way too much is made of what AS should have done. And not nearly as much to what AS did do (6 comeback wins, 4 on te road)/or chose not to do (throw the ball into coverage for a pick). The Niners won games. He did more right than he did wrong. If it were the reverse, the Niners would not have won nearly as many games.
Yeah clown that was Alex sticking up for his teammates, especially his offensive line who did not show up and left him out to dry.
See if you were a real fan you would have recognized that after the Ravens game the line and offense came together. Why you ask dummy? Cause they (oline)took light to Harbaughs comments about them and Alex and wanted to play better for him for not throwing them under the bus! Wake up clown and start seeing the Niners for who they are: the consumate team playing for oneanother lead by their leader Alex Smith!
Hey Prime,
you want to talk football lets talk football. You want to name call I can do that too. I have no respect for you anyway. You are an a$$monkey. You have no value on this blog and probably no where else either.
Go spread your hatred elsewhere. Adios loser.
Bayarea, why dont you just come back at Prime with his comments on the team rallying around Alex after the Ravens? The name calling is his bad but it sounds like you got nothing in rebuttal except for calling names back with nothing football related to counter his argument.
I think Prime Time is right it that the Ravens game galvanized the team after what they had to face on a short week and the attention building up. The Niners should have won that game but it was a bad call on the TD brought back by Teddy Ginn. The offensive line did get better after that game and I think the playcalling got better too with less attmepts downfield knowing there was no legitimate deep threat. They stuck to the strength of their personnel and got Hunter more involved.
Bottom line Bay, you come back at these fanatics with football talk and they have no choice but to oblige, but if you come back with nothing but namecalling, they are like a rash that doesnt go away.
Latino,
I prefer not to dialogue with Prime at all. He inserts himself into my conversations.
Good football conversation will never happen between the two of us for several reasons.
First his IQ is lower than the year in which I was born.
Second, he is top three on this blog in terms of spewing straight hate.
He can go to hell for all I care.
Smith himself admited after the game that hung on to the ball too long and took sacks.
What else was he going to do, throw his offensive line under the bus like Jay Cutler?
Harbaugh called him out on it after the game as well.
Really? That’s what you remember? Matt Barrows reported something a little different. In discussing the nine sacks that the 49ers gave up to the Ravens in a conference call with reporters, Harbaugh blamed most of them on scheme or guys getting beat physically and then said, “[a]nd maybe two other ones where Alex could’ve got the ball out quicker.” (Emphasis added.)
What else did Harbaugh say? Glad you asked. He identified “three or four more (plays) where Alex was slippery as heck” and escaped pressure. Clearly anticipating your claim of missing open receivers, Harbaugh also noted that several times, Smith was flushed from the pocket as receivers were getting open downfield.
Source: http://www.sacbee.com/2011/11/26/4080770/harbaugh-spreads-blame-for-six.html
That’s what you describe as Harbaugh calling out Smith, saying that Smith maybe could have avoided 2 out of 9 sacks by throwing the ball sooner, but also noting that he managed to avoid 3 or 4 other sacks?
They also called him out for not seeing a completely wide open Delaney Walker on a wheel route to start the game. Roman called it out over the head set.
I didn’t say that Smith never held onto the ball too long or that he never missed an open receiver. I just contested your assertions that it was a common occurrence and the reason for the large number of sacks given up by the 49ers. Random plays here and there do not a pattern make.
I notice that you have nothing to say about the sack data. I’m not surprised. You are all about statistics when they support your subjective analysis, but ignore them when they disprove it.
Heat this clown Bayarea is one flavor, one channel and one voice: HATE AGAINST ALEX SMITH. This is all he knows and cares about, he can’t look objectively at anything football related. He thinks it’s all based on one position and one position alone, the QB.
You can’t reason with this used cars salesman because he has one focus, blame Alex! It’s sad but true.
@Claude Cojones
he managed to avoid 3 or 4 other sacks
Alex has a tendency of looking at the pass rush more than looking downfield at his receivers. If he gets out of trouble that he created for himself, then who’s fault is it?
Nickrow, when you have 8 guys coming at you from the right side and no downfield seperation, thats Alex getting himself in trouble?
Thats the playcalling, the lack of downfield presence, the oline not blocking and yes, Alex not making a better intial read and blitz pickup.
How the sacks fall all on Alex as you claim is ridiculous. Its a team game, everyone needs to work together, why is it always on Alex?
Prime who is really a clown? Me for having an opinion and not swaying from it? Staying true to myself. Or you, a guy who name calls, is filled with hate and posts under multiple names in attempts to show the room that others back your weak ideas?
You are a nut rash plain and simple.
Latino,
sharing is caring. If you don’t see it, then it’s pointless to describe it to you.
There was once football being discussed here?
Million $ question: “Can there be again?”
@NickRow:
Oh look, another unverifiable subjective bit of disinformation from me-too-Nick. Care to provide any evidence of this “tendency”?
Absolutely you, you are the biggest clown ever because your opinion can’t objectively face facts. You say Harbaugh called out Smith’s play against the Raven when in reality it was the opposite. See you make stuff up to prove your opinion and that’s wrong. That game was nowhere near Alex fault, insted you use it to highlight some bogus inefficiencies in his game. Look deeper into the entire game and things leading up to it.
Like I mentioned, the travel, the bad call on the TD comin back and the Olines dismal play. You can’t and wont admit any of those things, insted you put it on Alex all the time and this is why you continously get bioch slapped on this blog.
But Again using the same double poster card which is weak and calling names without having the stones to counter my point.
Your a stone thrower who can’t man up cause your biased fairweather fan. You wanna talk football, bring it, tell me again how the Ravens game was Alexs fault?
@bayarea, all I have seen you do is turtle to claudes and primes comments, you talk smack but cant back it up, all I hear from you is cant but no facts to prove it.
BTW, I never said you could use my rash analogy. LOL.
@Bay:
Prime who is really a clown? Me for having an opinion and not swaying from it?
I wouldn’t call you a clown, but I also wouldn’t wear stubbornness as a badge of honor. You refuse to reconsider your opinions even when presented with facts that tend to disprove them.
So then you are agreeing with me that Prime is a clown? lol
Sorry Claude there is no other way to describe this guy other than clown cause he’s a joke, plain and simple.
But dont worry he thinks he is being true to himself, that’s the little lady in him, being real about his deep inner feelings. Give me a break! Look at the game in its entirety and some haters might clue in that it’s the ultimate team game, insted these “clowns” are looking to the glory days of their precious Montana and Walsh and hoping that one day it can all be like it was, sorry new era, new game, can’t make those comparisons anymore. You know that song, glory days, pass you by glory days……
Where is the rebuttal Bay?
Guess nobody wants $1 million then.
DS I think we are waiting for Mr. Inner feelings/ true to himself to talk football and discuss the Ravens game and how the loss was all on Alex?
That is 2x in the past few days Latino that you get in the middle of something. Should have just taken my advice and leave it be.
…yea..where is the rebuttal Bay…..?????
just copy and paste as you always say Bay……..
….excellent stuff as usual from Claude:
@Bay:
The Ravens game game more than any other highlighted unneeded sacks. That game more than any demonstrated an area that Alex needs to step up more than any IMO.
You’re kidding, right? You’re going to blame Alex Smith for the o-line’s matador performance against the Ravens? The Ravens abused the right side of the 49ers’ line the entire game, particularly once Chilo came in to play.
Last year I count roughly 10-12 sacks that were not on the Oline, but on Smith for not pulling the trigger and hanging on too long to the ball.
Can you name them, or did you just make that number up?
The assertion that Smith takes too many sacks because he holds onto the ball too long is not supported by the facts. Here is a link to Football Outsiders’ charting of sacks allowed in 2011, which breaks down sacks by how quickly they occurred: http://www.footballoutsiders.com/under-pressure/2012/under-pressure-violence-rams
If you read the article, it explains that sacks which occur 3 seconds or longer after the snap are not blamed on the o-line, but are thought to be the responsibility of the QB (indecision) and/or the receivers (not getting open). I would add that sometimes the defense just plays good coverage. Anyway, if you look at the numbers for the sacks given up by the 49ers after 3 or more seconds, you will see that the 49ers are right at the league average. Actually, the 49ers numbers are slightly better than average (2.6% vs. 2.7%).
Where the 49ers did poorly was in giving up quick sacks (those that occur in less than 2.5 seconds), the sacks that are considered the line’s fault. The 49ers gave those up at almost twice the rate of the league average (3.3% vs 1.8%).
The problem in 2011 wasn’t with Smith for not pulling the trigger and for hanging on too long to the ball; it was with an offensive line that had serious pass protection issues.”…
….talk football Bay….
Prime,
You know the answer before bay even posts it. As do you claude. If Latino can’t figure that out soon, can’t much do anything anyway.
If anybody here really thinks you can change a persons mind, you best be acustumed to failing a lot. Because you will fail. A lot. A blog is meant more for discussion and arguing than it is for initiating one to change anothers mind. I don’t expect to change your mind or bays. But when the exchange reaches a certain point it is best to stay away from that person.
OkPrime,
lets just stick to stats. Smith had 140 total yards in that game passing.
Put lipstick on that pig…..
…cmon DS…you insult me…….this is tame compared to my stuff…..
…imagine if I wrote Bay’s ………
In that Raven game adjustments needed to be made. The line didnt make that adjustment, Alex didnt make that adjustment, the play calling didnt make that adjustment. There are things that one does when one is being overwhelmed and no on did anything. There is really no excuses for the loss tho some point to travel on a short week and bad calls. You have to be a good enough team to overcome those things. I always go back to the 81 season NFC championship game, Niners had I think 6 turnovers and Lott got nailed on a bad call, we all know who won.
@oneniner
Sorry man, but you were late to this one.
I can write something that would not be that different from you or bays posts if I wanted.
That would be a good writing asignment in an English/writing class. 2 polar views. Kinda fun I imagine. But not on a blog though.
:- )
@undercenter
What are you talking about “no adjustments were made”. At every level there were.
AS managed to fall back, right, left, forward on all those sacks. That is an adjustment.
The WR’s adjusted plenty as well. From TG TD called back to Edwards adjusting his route from a sure TD to a sure Int after AS threw the ball. To TG dropping a perfect pass on 4th down. How many more WR adjustments did you want?
The OL adjusted as well. Why there were times guys ran around them to sack AS since they didn’t get in their way very well. There were times they ran thru the OL. Then best of all, there were times the OL literally stood around not making an attempt to block the DL allowing free lanes to AS.
The RB’s made adjustments as well. Which unblocked defensive player do I block? “None” seems fair, so in this day of treating all equal, that option was chosen. And when they did, it was called a penalty to negate a TD. No adjustments. Hmm. That is plenty of adjusting undercenter.
The playcalling had plenty of adjustments as well. Sometimes they actually called a play. Other times AS made stuff up on the dirt with bottlecaps/rocks simulating players. But due to everything wanting to look like everything else, the players got confused as to who was which rock/bottlecap they were so they just ran in circles a lot.
And who can blame them all? They hadn’t eaten their turkey dinner yet
I blame the lack of turkey myself.
The OL
@DS
You cant have turkey when the stuffing has been knocked out of you.
DS Im not here trying to change anyone’s mind, but if people make certain assertations and cant back it up, then whats the point of the discussion. Bay made a claim about the Ravens game being pinned on Alex, that was it. Then he brings a weak attempt at 140 yards that game. Well did he watch the game or just look at the box score the next day?
Either way I think we as fans that support the entire team want to know why certain forty niner fans criticize and have substantial facts to not back it up, not 140 yards passing. That again is a weak assessment when all things considered, the Ravens have a great defense, road game on 3 days rest,maybe really 2, oline was playing like swiss cheese, and we had horrible playcalling, and a TD that was called back and shouldnt have. Those are facts brought to the table by claude and prime, and myself, then, nothing back from Bay.
Also dont tell me to stay out of anything Mr. Post one hundred times a day, your up in everyones jock commenting on every single thread, remember you said, if I have something to say I will, if i dont, I wont. Yeah, practice what you preach.
I’m not saying that Alex lost the Ravens game. The running game was non-existant and in-game adjustments were not effective. Nonetheless, Alex did contribute to some of the sacks in that game.
Bay, stats are for losers!
Latino
You can take my advice or not. I have another rule.
When I reach a certain point, I don’t read a persons post anymore. Thus, I won’t reply. I can hold both practices at the same time. Can’t reply to what I don’t read.
And you are looking childish bringing up my number of posts as an issue. What all those like you don’t get is that you are allowing this to happen. You tire of my posts? Simple solution for you. Don’t answer/reply to mine then. If you choose not to do this, then you are the problem as well. I’m not replying or posting to myself that often. You like to make observations. You should have made that one by now if you are any good at observing. So hush up about it. Pot, is this kettle?
DS, now your in the advice giving business I see. I get what your saying but usually on a blog there is a thread and in order to follow the discussion its a good idea to read every other comment within that thread so you have an idea of where it going. Unfortunaltely for all of us, that means having to read every other one of your comments because seriously, for every one thread, your on it 90% of the time. So in theory, its impossible to ignore you.
Latino
I manage to do it fine. And two times just today, people brought me up on a thread where I was absent (had no desire to post till they brought me into it) or not commenting on the recent discussion. So, their fault. Didn’t you observe that?
I actually don’t read all the posts from anybody. Some I read most. When you took exams, did you answer all the questions in order, or did you skip those you didn’t know? I am an expert at skipping stuff/ignoring others. Not that hard. I won’t be sad/mad if you/others do. I’ll get over it. And if you simply reply to a single persons post in a thread, you don’t need to necessarily read the whole thread.
Just some more advice. Which you can take, or not and consequently get mad about nothing.
grant i do’nt know the formula for passer rateing. is it mostly percentages or total yrds/total td’s etc because if it is more heavily weighted toward total yards etc. then the teams with terrible run defenses are going to have lower passer rateings could that be part of the reason the raiders and seahawks appear to have better pass defenses
@old coach:
Here is link to an explanation for calculating the NFL’s QB raitng formula: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Passer_rating
As you will see the rating is based upon four statistics:
completion percentage
yards/passing attempt
touchdowns/passing attempt
interceptions/passing attempt
@Claude thanks for the link. it looks to me that the teams that let the opposition run all over them will have lower QB ratings against them
old coach:
I don’t know about that. The QB rating doesn’t focus on the overall accumulation of yards or passing TDs, but rather on the per attempt numbers. I cannot think of a reason why a defense that is getting run on all day would be better against the pass on a per attempt basis. Given that the defensive players will have been conditioned to expect a run on most plays, it would stand to reason that they might get burned more on play action.
Note the one thing missing from that.
Decisin making. The most important attribute a QB can have, which can turn a game for or against your team with a single play. The thing I hear actual QB’s discuss.
Can’t use a scale to grade something when the most important factor is not even a variable. If this were done in any non-sport, it would look foolish and really, completely useless. Joe Theisman said that 70% of being a QB is managing the game (AKA decision making). How can one dismiss 70% of the job?
Seacocks are far from being good as long as they got kevin kolb 2.0 MATT FLYNN.. haha scot mcclueless is stil not wise at choosing qbs. Raiders are ten years from being descent if they can keep their first rounders and not trade em to teams for 30 year olds. AND THE 49ERSS?????? SUPERBOWLL BABYYYYY
Seahawks at home (that is half their games) are REALLY good with Grant as the QB. Something about that place. Only question is how good can they be on the road. And a smart tough defense will travel well. We know. We saw it firsthand with our team.
That defense is good and their secondary is their strength. Once they learn how to pack that defense for road games look out.
The Niners and Seahawks are the class of the NFC West. Which ever team can win the majority of their road games will win the division.
Don’t dismiss AZ either. Who did beat us. They have a very good D as well with a yung shut down CB and afront 4 who can get to the passer. What other teams can make such a claim? Once Kolb got out, they won. If the HC is stupid, he will have him continue to start. If not, Skelton is the starter, and Skelton beat us. Not many did.
In two years, the NFC West has gone from the jok of the NFL to the strongest division. Nobody will want to play an NFC West opponent. This division is a lot harder than it was last year (or appeared to be to those who only look at stats).
NFC West is definitely much improved, but the AFC North is still the hardest division in my book.
Agreed Scooter. All four teams have solid defenses (Cinti and Cleveland are underrated IMO).
I’m not sure how the Wheeden experiment will play out for Cleveland though. That seems like a classic boom or bust.
Hmmmm….
Pitt and Baltimore are definitely good. But the Pitt D needs an overhaul. The first Pitt vs Baltimre game, the Balt RB (Ray Rice I think it was) ran for a 30+ yard TD.
I called it a TD after Rice had ran 3 yards because Pitts all-world safety missed the tackle. When that happened, I knew nobody could catch Rice. The Bronco playoff game proved it. If TP didn’t make the play, nobody on D did.
Pitt always gets lots of TO’s. But last year they didn’t. Why? Because they didn’t swarm like normal. And when a D swarms, good things happen. Pitt has an aging defense and were slow. Thus they didn’t swarm, no TO’s, weren’t as good.
The Ravens are also aging on D. How much longer will they stay on top?
The Bengals may have had a great year, but it is not uncommon for a sudden good rookie QB to take a step back in year 2. See Rams QB Bradford. If a rookie handles things well, then he sorta has an advantage. Other teams haven’t seen him, so they don’t know what to do, but he knows. After1 year, defences have film and a whole year to plan on stopping him.
And Cleveland still sucks. They are not scaring anybody.
So, the 2 top teams in the division are seemingly on the downturn. Cinci may or may not get better. I’ll call that a wash. And Cleveland..well is Cleveland.
The AFC North may end up with a better record, but I think the West will still be tougher (teams will fear having to play them more). With 3 teams who finished the 2nd half of last season with each getting at least 5 wins out of the last 8 (that takes into consideration the many divisional games where obviously 1 team will win/lose) this division of ours is scary.
who cares? The D was good before last year, but since there was no O, they ultimately carried the whole team. Just having some offense last year we almost made it to the super bowl. ( check out the last time a team made it to the superbowl with 1 third down conversion in the second half) this year the D will not have as much pressure as the team should be able to score more and more often. We added scat backs, WR’s have a whole training camp for the OL, and return Gore and Davis. Playing ahead is Bill Walshes plan, remember trading to get Fred Dean to rush the passer in the 4th? He anticipated having a lead and the D keeping it. On paper at least, we are in for a good year.
Our offense is soo potent now. Aj crabs moss n manningham. Not to mention vernon gore hunter and lamichaelll jamesss. Oh ya and kyle williams
“And if new [Raiders] coach Dennis Allen can eliminate half the penalties and ….., the Raiders could have a good defense this season.”
Hilarious, Grant..
Interesting discussion. Great defenses are an important component to championship teams but that isn’t the only thing. Here’s a list of the last 5 SuperBowl QB matchups:
Eli v Brady
Rodgers v Big Ben
Brees v Peyton
Kurt Warner v Big Ben
Eli v Brady
Every one of these games featured elite QB’s – perhaps every one of these will be in the Hall of Fame . Now let’s look at the defensive ranking in terms of points allowed for Super Bowl winning teams over the same span:
Giants – 25th
Packers – 2nd
Saints – 20th
Steelers – 1st
Giants – 17th
3 out of the last 5 Superbowl winning teams were not even in the top half of the league in points allowed. IMHO strong defense and a strong running game can almost guarantee a winning season with a trip to the playoffs. You can’t win the SuperBowl or even make the big game with an average QB. That position is the most important position on the field.
“They” don’t want to hear that lol.
…Dude…are you saying Alex Smith is an average QB?…..if you are going to call him out at least have the guts to write his name….
………..welcome back Houston 9er ……..your hatred of Alex is nothing new (Note: Houston 9er was my ninermd previous years, very skillful at knocking AS without mentioning Alex)….
….I would think by now you saw the 2011 season, …….they did say it takes you guys down south two hours to watch 60 minutes……….I think its better you comment after watching your boy Alex Smith reach the NFC championship…….
Yeah onelame. Calling Smith average is a real hateful thing to say. Even though his rank was below average. But I guess when He’s all you care about, it could hurt some feelings. Dude your Pathetic. And DS…. Shut your piehole. I know your dying to stick up for this clown. Since you love making me out to be a stat w*ore all of a sudden and not coming with facts. Keep scrolling down!
md
I don’t know what pies or holes or even bringing me up from out of nowhere have to do with oneniner or even football but a good shrink might be able to make all those connections. Whenwas the last time you saw one? Because your comments recently…make 0 sense.
PS I wasn’t interested in this thread, but since you can’t live without me, I’m here for you. Thruout all the therapy sessions, I’m here for you.
Ds. What part of shut your piehole didnt you get? Arguing with you could make a Navy Seal insane. Your’re not as smart as you think you are. You just have the time time play on a computer all day and search every stat you can think of. When it comes to flat out Football sense, your that “it?” on the bottom of a dog pile. Everyone piles on because you make it soooo easy.
….piehole???……dat is sum straight up gangstar talk!!!!
How come you don’t have he guts to use your name?
@Houston
You are absolutely spot on. The odds of winning a Super Bowl are much higher with an elite QB. If a team has an average QB, the team has to compensate by playing lights out D, solid special teams, and get some breaks along the way.
All good points, Houston. Couldn’t agree more!
Hopefully we will continue to see dramatic improvement at the QB position this year – whether it be Alex or one of the young guns waiting in the wings. Seriously – screw three and outs and settling for FG’s inside the 20 – they need to be more aggressive next year and start running up the score on other teams if they want the opportunity to get back to the playoffs and win the SB.
The Niners won’t have the luxury of playing conservative offense next year, not with their schedule.
One of the key reasons for those three and outs was a lack of weapons, something the FO addressed with vigor this offseason. I expect big things from this offense!
9ergirl, couldn’t agree more. There is a reason they added talent to the offense – WR’s and RB’s. Now they have talent and the RZ and 3rd down conversation rates will improve. Looking forward to August.
By the way, have you noticed how silent Camp Alex (i.e. Primetime, DS, Claude Cojones, Ribico, LSD, FDM, OneAlex, etc) is regarding your point of elite QBs and winning Super Bowls? They can’t refute it and that explains the silence.
Now Ds wants to forget about the “elite” talk from last year and talk clutch. LOL This person loves talking in circles.
Seriously now md.
I keep coming up in your posts while doing nothing. This thread had nothing to do with AS clutch or elite, at least not the part I discussed. Keep things in the right place.
Does your wife like it that you are so obsessed with supposedly another woman on a blog that you need to bring her into discussions she wasn’t a part of?
Look at your mini-novels you wrote to me this past week. From a time not so long ago, such epics were written to wuu another to fall in love with them.
You need to look at the things you write and look them over carefully. If a spouse of mine wrote those things from out of nothing as you have the past week, I call up a therapist to meet with them about their strange behavior.
lol. You’re kidding, right Nick? 5 years is such a HUGE sample. Superbowls have been played with (and some won with) middling QBs such as David Woodley, Jim McMahon, Tony Eason, Doug Williams,Boomer Esiason,Jeff Hostetler, Stan Humphries, Neil O’Donnell, Drew Bledsoe, Chris Chandler, Brad Johnson, Trent Dilfer, Kerry Collins, Rich Gannon, Donovan McNabb, Matt Hasselbeck, Rex Grossman….Oh, let’s not forget 4 time winner Terry Bradshaw, nobody’s idea of an “elite” QB.
Nice try Ribico. That’s a weak argument. I didn’t say that an average QB could not win a Super Bowl, but rather the odds go way up with an elite QB. If you want a large sample size, take a look at this list and tell me what you think.
Super Bowl I – Bart Starr
Super Bowl II – Bart Starr
Super Bowl III – Joe Namath
Super Bowl IV – Len Dawson
Super Bowl V – Johnny Unitas
Super Bowl VI – Roger Staubach
Super Bowl VII – Bob Griese
Super Bowl VIII – Bob Griese
Super Bowl IX – Terry Bradshaw
Super Bowl X – Terry Bradshaw
Super Bowl XI – Ken Stabler
Super Bowl XII – Roger Staubach
Super Bowl XIII – Terry Bradshaw
Super Bowl XIV – Terry Bradshaw
Super Bowl XV – Jim Plunkett
Super Bowl XVI – Joe Montana
Super Bowl XVII – Joe Theismann
Super Bowl XVIII – Jim Plunkett
Super Bowl XIX – Joe Montana
Super Bowl XX – Jim McMahon
Super Bowl XXI – Phil Simms
Super Bowl XXII – Doug Williams
Super Bowl XXIII – Joe Montana
Super Bowl XXIV – Joe Montana
Super Bowl XXV – Jeff Hostetler
Super Bowl XXVI – Mark Rypien
Super Bowl XXVII – Troy Aikman
Super Bowl XXVIII – Troy Aikman
Super Bowl XXIX – Steve Young
Super Bowl XXX – Troy Aikman
Super Bowl XXXI – Brett Favre
Super Bowl XXXII – John Elway
Super Bowl XXXIII – John Elway
Super Bowl XXXIV – Kurt Warner
Super Bowl XXXV – Trent Dilfer
Super Bowl XXXVI – Tom Brady
Super Bowl XXXVII – Brad Johnson
Super Bowl XXXVIII – Tom Brady
Super Bowl XXXIX – Tom Brady
Super Bowl XL – Ben Roethlisberger
Super Bowl XLI – Peyton Manning
Super Bowl XLII – Eli Manning
Super Bowl XLIII – Ben Roethlisberger
Super Bowl XLIV – Drew Brees
Super Bowl XLV – Aaron Rodger
>>take a look at this list and tell me what you think.
I’d say a quite a large number of teams with non-elite QBs were successful in winning.
Bradshaw (4), Stabler, Plunkett, McMahon, Simms, Williams, Hostetler, Rypien, Dilfer, Johnson.
I’ll tell you what I really think – this is a stupid discussion – not many teams with *average* players, QB or not, are going to make it to the SB.
Thanks for being ‘objective’ Ribico. That’s a true sign of a Smither.
Nick, the only thing that stands out in this thread is that it takes great players to win Superbowls. Well, duh – film at 11.
That’s something “Smithers” and “Haters” can agree on.
@NickRow:
I’ve never accused anyone of claiming that Alex Smith is elite.
If I improperly lumped you in with jordan, Bay, TIM, etc., I apologize. Then again, why are you focusing on and arguing about elite QBs?
I freely admit that that having an elite QB increases a team’s chance of winning the Super Bowl. Can you identify anyone who has said that it doesn’t? I don’t think you can, which means that this is just another straw man.
Why is it some people have the same debate over and over and over and over…etc….etc..etc..etc..
YAWN!
Definition of insanity, Sgt.
:P
Especially considering the NFL settled the debate for us just a month ago.
That’s an interesting tactic. When you can’t refute the facts or don’t want to accept them because of your love for Alex Smith, then you resort to diversion instead of addressing the issue
For a change, it would be refreshing to hear a Smither say that having a elite QB dramatically increases the odds of winning the Super Bowl.
@msc
What debate?
The one that rages on here which really has no bearing at all on the team, but people think it does? For those that matter and actually have a say in the discussion, it’s over with.
And it would be nice to hear a person posing as a Niner fan to admit that AS can win a Super Bowl. If you don’t think he can’t do it after last year, there is no hope for you.
@NickRow:
That’s an interesting tactic. When you can’t refute the facts or don’t want to accept them …, then you resort to diversion instead of addressing the issue
You mean like you did yesterday on the sacks issue? Once people started presenting actual facts and challenging you to do the same, you couldn’t run away from that discussion fast enough.
Or Nickrow likes to use his famous “your a double poster card” as evidence that no way two people could have the same opinion. He always uses this when people come back at him with facts. Just like Bayarea calls names and vanishes, just like 23 with his Buwhahahahahaha, and lemons with his well the organization wanted Manning, that shows how much they beleive in Smith crap.
Point is the haters have nothing more to add to their hate bashing cause Alex has improved and will continue to improve and the organization itself is upgrading the positions around him. They can’t handle the fact that all arrows are up and they will be proven wrong once again!
@Prime:
Even better is the stubborn refusal to admit they were wrong in saying that Smith would never be any good and that the team could never win with him as QB. That’s what the debate has been about, and those guys were wrong. Instead of acknowledging their error, however, they now try to pretend that the debate has always been about the “Smithers” insisting that Alex Smith is elite. Yet, when challenged to provide evidence of all those alleged Alex-is-elite claims, they cannot do it.
@Claude
You can’t back up that claim as I’ve never accused anyone of claiming that Alex Smith is elite. However, it would be refreshing to get an admission from a Smither that the odds of winning a Super Bowl go way up with an elite QB.
Hey Primetrash,
I don’t disappear. Been here longer than you have. Nick you bring up a good point. Smithers this last year were quick to call Smith both Elite and Pro Bowl worthy.
When it was brought up that Harbaugh was using psychology to boost him up they were all up in arms.
It was proven at the end of the year that Smith was neither Pro Bowl worthy or elite.
Guys like Cosell and Lombardi were vindicated in their assessment of Smith. Especially so when the front office low balled his offer and attempted to replace him with Manning an aging vet coming off a neck surgery. Primetrash you want to talk about a disappearing act? You, Claude, DS and oneniner went “poof” that week. Either disappeared completely or posted about 80% less than your norm.
The final vindication for Cosell who regularly called Smith “average” was when the entire NFL showed no interest as Smith desperately tried to shop himself around.
Hopefully he can be more of a contributor this year. If the obnoxious supporters were hooting and hollering after the marginal numbers he put up this last year, imaging the trash talk we will hear when he raises his game and becomes a middle of the pack QB. But I’ll gladly take it if that means we are winning and he is part of the reason why…..
>>Smithers this last year were quick to call Smith both Elite and Pro Bowl worthy.
Ummm, care to back up that claim, Bay? That is not something I remember. I do remember a discussion after *Smith’s coach* called him “Elite and Pro Bowl worthy” but it sure didn’t originate here. If you want to ridicule Harbaugh as a “smither” then that’s your right as a paying fan.
Oops, replied to the wrong comment. This belongs here.
@NickRow:
I’ve never accused anyone of claiming that Alex Smith is elite.
If I improperly lumped you in with jordan, Bay, TIM, etc., I apologize. Then again, why are you focusing on and arguing about elite QBs?
I freely admit that that having an elite QB increases a team’s chance of winning the Super Bowl. Can you identify anyone who has said that it doesn’t? I don’t think you can, which means that this is just another straw man.
@Bay:
But I’ll gladly take it if that means we are winning and he is part of the reason why…..
That’s cr@p, and you know it. The team went 14-4 last year, Smith was part of the reason why, and it drove you insane. You could not enjoy the 49ers’ success with Alex Smith as QB because it proved you wrong. Your ego wouldn’t let you enjoy the 2011 season, and your continuing Smith-obsession on this blog makes it clear that you won’t enjoy a successful 2012 if Smith is the QB.
“That’s an interesting tactic. When you can’t refute the facts or don’t want to accept them because of your love for Alex Smith, then you resort to diversion instead of addressing the issue.”
What facts? What tactic? What love? What issue?
Big leap there.
I think what he’s saying is what a lot of us feel but haven’t necessarily said: The argument is old and stale.
It’s tiring and I agree with him: YAWN.
@Adam
It’s stale.
That makes 2 of us.
Bayarea the best thing for the human race and more specifically this blog would be if you vanished for a long time. How long? Well lets just say as long as you have been using Cossell as an ally to try and convince real 49er fans that Alex can’t win. Tired, old and boring, you know, the story of your life.
Dude I feel so bad for you cause now your going to have to go thru another seaon witnessing Alex chalk up “W”s. Then we will have to hear you say I’m so glad Alex is playing at a high level and winning, just like you said after the Saints game. Then as soon as they lost to the Giants you retort back to your fairweather fan act.
Guy, your so predictable and pathetic, I laugh at fans like you!
But Prime Time, these guys are just stating their opinion of Alex. To what I say, what fan believes the worst and hopes they are wrong. How do you watch a game, does it go like this:
Bayarea: “Oh my God Alex is terrible”
Announcer: Touchdown 49ers, Alex with a strike to Davis for a TD.
Bayarea: Hmmm, the 49ers scored but Alex got lucky there, he still is terrible.
Announcer: “49ers win”
Bayarea:”Oh no, what do I do, all along I have said Alex is terrible, but he just won another game and is getting better, oh, whatever, my ego means more, Alex I still hate you”
@NickRow
Who said I was a “Smither”?
It is rather old this endless debate. Alex was good last year, and played a role on a TEAM sport. Did he contribute to to overall sucess of the niners lat year, I would say yes. That makes me a Smither? or is does everyone have to agree with you point of view…
Latino, no it goes like this:
Bayarea: I’m a loser and I don’t know why.
Shrink: your right, now get out of my office, I can’t help you
I do find them interesting, thank you.
Grant like your take on the craphawks, because theyre rivals. But I could give two dumps and a flush about the Raiders. Just my take. =-)
Off-Topic:
I thought some of you might enjoy having this link to a live view of construction of the new stadium.
http://www.newsantaclarastadium.com/live-view
Thanks claude
Grant,
If you hate the 49ers so much go find a new job! Geez your negativity is getting old. I will no longer click on press democrat link. Lately you have been digging so deep to find something negative towards the 49ers. No wonder the players don’t respect you. Good luck to you, seems like daddy’s gravy train will be ending soon for you.
GC, good reads today but I don’t understand the Raiders piece. This is a 9er blog and there is a divisional relationship with the hawks but the Raiders??! Unless you added the Raiders in for Stan? LOL
Anyone see the bizarre move made by Tampa today. Signing Dallas Clark and announcing the want to trade or inevitably release Winslow. I have no desire for Winslow but I cant for the life of me think of what the Bucs are thinking on this one. They traded a more productive player for an injury prone one. Clark has played 16 games only once in 9 years and still doesn’t match the production of Winslow when healthy. My guess is there is something we aren’t hearing yet about why the Bucs are so eager to replace Winslow with someone that truly isn’t an upgrade.
Winslow is added baggage with a history of being a malcontent. They are trying to clean it up in TB after a horrible year.
I’d understand it more if they were just cutting or releasing him but to sign Clark doesn’t make much sense unless it’s strictly about personality. Both players are rarely healthy and both only have a year or two at most left in the league so I guess they figure Clark is the lesser of the two evils, suppose it also depends on how much they are paying him compared to Winslows numbers.
Interesting to note, Winslow had more receptions and almost as many yards as Vernon Davis last year.
@hank
Keep in mind that Winslow didn’t seem to do much in terms of helping the team win during their, what was it, 10 game losing streak. The Bucs were beat up a lot. A lot of games were not close after they beat NO following their loss to us.
If Winslow was all that, his leadership role would have kicked in to at least keep the Bucs relevant as a team. If Winslow has had issues in the past, last year sealed it for him as a Buc.
TB has a hard-charging new coach coming from college who wants enthusiastic buy-in from his players. Winslowe didn’t show up to work out with the team (working out at home instead) and then didn’t show for OTAs. He said he’s been to them before.
New coach trying to change the culture and introduce a new offense and demanding commitment. KW should’ve been there acting like a team leader, instead he did the opposite. It would stick in JH’s craw too. I think this is new coach sending a message to the rest of the team with FO approval.
The GOAT and the hill.
http://blog.sfgate.com/49ers/2012/05/21/jerry-rice-still-runs-the-hill/
Can’t keep a good man down…
He still thinks he can play and you know I bet he still could play.
Not so sure about that, it’s been 8 years since he couldn’t crack into the starting line-up for the Broncos and retired rather then be a back up. I’m guessing that tank is bone dry.
Could this be the OL come game day?
http://blogs.mercurynews.com/49ers/2012/05/21/goodwin-joins-offseason-program-offensive-line-closer-to-full-strength/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+49ersHotRead+%2849ers+Hot+Read%29
“How swiftly Caesar had surmounted the icy Alps and in his mind conceived immense upheavals, coming war. When he reached the water of the Little Rubicon, clearly to the leader through the murky night appeared a mighty image of his country in distress, grief in her face, her white hair streaming from her tower-crowned head, with tresses torn and shoulders bare she stood before him, and sighing said:
‘Where further do you march? Where do you take my standards, warriors? If lawfully you come, if as citizens, this far only is allowed.’
Then trembling struck the leader’s limbs; his hair grew stiff and weakness checked his progress, holding his feet at the river’s edge. At last he speaks:
‘O Thunderer, surveying great Rome’s walls from the Tarpeian Rock –
‘O Phrygian house gods of Iulus, clan and mysteries of Quirinus who was carried off to heaven –
‘O Jupiter of Latium, seated in lofty Alba and hearths of Vesta –
‘O Rome, equal to the highest deity, favor my plans.
Not with impious weapons do I pursue you. Here am I, Caesar, conqueror of land and sea, your own soldier, everywhere, now, too, if I am permitted. The man who makes me your enemy — it is he who be the guilty one.’
Then he broke the barriers of war and through the swollen river swiftly took his standards. And Caesar crossed the flood and reached the opposite bank. From Hesperia’s forbidden fields he took his stand and said:
‘Here I abandon peace and desecrated law.
Fortune, it is you I follow.
Farewell to treaties.
From now on war is our judge.’”
Hail, Caesar: We who are about to die salute you.
Hmmmm. Somebody preparing for a final exam in their Classics class?
Grant Cohn is to the Press Democrat what Chris Chase is to Yahoo Sports.
Yes. They both have media passes and you don’t.
..The Buccaneers have announced that tight end Kellen Winslow has been shipped to the Seahawks for an undisclosed 2013 draft pick……..DAMNMIT!!!
You’ve got to think they’re going to a two-tight end offense in part to try to deal with Aldon Smith.
Good move by the Seahawks. Don’t look now, but their 2 TE’s were more productive in 2011 than the 49ers’.
Improved pass rush, improved passing game, they are going to be tough in 2012.
Winslow will have a TOUGH time with Aldon, I really, really like that matchup.
Zach Miller will be the blocking TE, and Winslow more of the receiver.
Right, so Winslow primarily should line up on Aldon’s side of the formation, correct?
Sure, but he will be utilized like how you wanted to use Fleener. He will be moved all over. In the base D, he will be a tough matchup in coverage for Smith.
You’re right.
Didn’t the Redskins invent the H-Back in part to slow down Lawrence Taylor in the ’80s?
I’m having trouble seeing these two going mano on each other. Would you hire KW to block Aldon? Do we hire Aldon to cover? Nah. They’ll be moments in the base D, but not a regular diet. The more they use Winslowe as a blocker, the better for us. I don’t think he’ll like mixing it up with Aldon and Justin. And like TO, if you shut Winslowe out early in the game, he’ll lose interest and disappear.
Also in many 2 TE sets the 2nd TE is in the wing or H-back position on the same side as the Y, or will line up as a FB like Walker does sometimes.
They’re not going to go one-on-one. If Okung struggles with Aldon, Winslow may have to help out.
Great knowledge Grant. Yes he did. And, as you just stated, they will motion him around to set up the blocks, etc and help the tackle out.
This was a good acquisition by Seattle.
The Seahawks are stacked – I just don’t understand what they’re doing at wide receiver.
Can try going into a pirate mode where the d-line doesn’t fully line up until right before the snap so the O-line doesn’t have enough time to identify who to block. With the problems their o-line has had and Winslow new to the system this could create enough of a hesitation for Aldon to get past from time to time.
Baldwin did a nice job as a rookie, and Tate is improving. The addition of Winslow will help open those outside guys up to more single coverage, and they like to control the ball with the run.
Sounds very familiar…
I like Baldwin, but I don’t like Tate or any other receiver on their roster. Rice is a beast when he’s healthy, but he’s had surgeries on both shoulders and three concussions in the last year.
@Grant, Jack:
We are talking about Kellen Winslow, Jr., right? Not the father, but the son?
What’s with all the concern?
Sorry for screwing up the html.
Claude,
He put up numbers equal to Vernon Davis last year. He now will have a better QB getting him the ball, and the Seahawks offense can pose some challenges to opposing defenses.
@Jack:
I am not saying that Winslow is terrible, but I don’t think he is a difference maker like Vernon Davis is.
Do you really think Winslow is in Davis’ class as a TE?
I am not sure why you are so certain that Matt Flynn will be a better QB than Josh Freeman. I don’t think we have sufficient data even to conclude that he will be better than 2011 Josh Freeman.
Seattle needs much better play from its offensive line to pose a real challenge to good defenses.
Again, I am not saying that Winslow cannot help the Seahawks. I just don’t think that his presence is a source of great concern. Bruce Irvin, on the other hand, scares me more than a little bit.
Claude,
It’s not just about Winslow, but his combination with Zach Miller. It gives them a dimension they did not have last year. They just added 75 catches and close to 800 receiving yards to their offense.
Couple that with their improving defense and they are becoming that much more dangerous.
@Jack:
Fair enough. We’ll see how it plays out.
The Seahawks have a major question mark at QB. That’s going to limit their production on offense, but it never hurts to have more playmakers on offense. Seattle – with their improvements on defense – will be tougher this year. If they get get consistent QB production, they may challenge the Niners for the division title.
Seattle could steal a page from Harbaugh’s playbook. Tough, opportunistic defense. Offense that emphasizes two TE sets, power running, and a low-risk passing game. “What’s Your Deal?”
Winslow is a great pick up for Seattle. He’s got a bad attitude, but he’s a very good player. He’d be more highly regarded if he hadn’t been seriously injured in a car crash early in his career and then hampered by playing for the Browns and Bucs.
One position they didn’t really address this offseason was receiver, now they’ve added a good receiving TE that will complement Zach Miller well. Doug Baldwin, Sidney Rice and Golden Tate isn’t exactly the most imposing trio of WRs, but with Winslow and Miller that is a solid enough unit to complement their very good running game and strong defensive unit. The real question mark is at QB – if Flynn plays anywhere approximating ok, Seahawks will be dangerous.
@Scooter:
Winslow wasn’t injured in a car crash. He was trying to do front wheelies on his motorcycle, crashed it in a parking lot, and tore up his knee.
He’s also the guy who told everyone “I’m a fnckin’ soldier!”
He’s a special kind of stupid.
Your right, it was a motorcycle accident.
I’m not saying Winslow is the sharpest tool in the shed, but he can play football. I wouldn’t want him on the 49ers because of his attitude, but he’s a dangerous adversary…
49ers showed last season what you can do with a great defense, good running attack and a serviceable passing game. If Flynn is able to limit errors and be a passable QB the Seahawks will be tough to beat.
Interesting take on why Tampa shipped Winslow out.
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/05/22/goal-of-winslow-trade-may-have-been-helping-freeman/
Sweet! Now Willis\Bowman can light that overrated punk up. Carlson is better than him.
The dude can play but seems like he’s got a bit of “me 1st” ‘tude. He’s probably as physically gifted as his Dad but doesn’t appear to have as much heart and certainly hasn’t been as productive.
He sure did get into Schiano’s doghouse in a hurry. Apparently he skipped the voluntary OTAs.
To go from a pro-bowl caliber season to being traded for a conditional 6th, plus the fact that Schiano is being very close-mouthed about it tells me something happened in the locker room.
hah! sorry Brotha – didn’t see your post above. I think I just repeated what you said.
‘oneniner’,
The c-hawks are still unproven at the QB position. The last QB who had some success throwing to the TE was Hasselbach to Carlson. Unless M.Flynn blows-it-up, the hawks will have no feathers to fly.
But the hawks have been a tough team to beat at home, and Marshawn was the first RB to run over a 100 yards on us. Other then that, we take the west with little resistence from our divisional competition.
Are you forgetting about the one team in our division that actually did beat us? How is it that AZ is getting ignored? They have a shut down CB who is one heck of a threat as a returner, and the best WR in the game.
And, oh yeah. They beat us.
@DS
“Are you forgetting about the one team in our division that actually did beat us?”
Did they beat us or did we beat ourselfs?
@undercenter
Now, now. Can’t do that. How many other teams fans said the same thing when we beat them? If we do that, no team beat any team ever.
No. The Cards beat us 1 out of 2 times. And considering we only lost 4 out of 18, that means something.
Ever hear Pats HC speak about the opposing teams players? I’d swear every QB is JM. Every WR is JR. Every MLB is PW. If you didn’t know better, you’d think the Pats had to play an All Time Greats team every week.
It is the job of the HC to make sure his team won’t overlook any team. And that starts with the notion that “We lost because we beat ourselves” disappears as best as possible.
The Cards won that game. No luck involved. And if our team thinks that the Cards were lucky or we beat ourselves and don’t respect the other team (Cards), we’ll lose both games against them this year.
undercenter,
They beat themselves in that Arizona game. The total failure in the Red Zone let the Cards hang around despite the defense putting them in great field position over and over.
You have to credit the Cards for making the plays to win, but that game should have been a blowout.
@Jack
Failure in the red zone and some defense laspes were the reasons. Of course you have to give the Cards credit but sometimes you beat yourself and in that game and the Cowboys game the Niners beat themselves.
Completely agree with you on that undercenter.
Cant call Peterson a “shut down” corner. Gave up 14 catches for 183 yards to Crabtree. If Crab is a bad as you say he is and he was able to embarrass him like that then there is no way PP is a “shut down” guy.
Adam707,
You are correct. Peterson was not a shut down corner last year. He has a lot of potential, and should be improved this year.
The Cardinals, and Seahawks are going to be much tougher outs this year.
@Adam707
Peterson in Game 1 stank. MC owned him. Then just a few weeks later, Peterson did quite a bit better. Enough to get the announcers to bring up how fast and well he learns.
And 185 yards in two games agaisnt a rookie CB when you are the #1 WR vet on a team is not earth shattering either. JR would get that in one game against a rookie.
Nice bit of “editing” Adam707.
MC’s stats in game 1
7 catches for 120 yards
MC’s stats in game 2
7 catches for 63 yards. Almost an average of half that of game 1.
Peterson has a huge up arrow on him. I remember when everybody here wanted to draft him. Then when the Cards nabbed him, we suddenly didn’t want him. Interesting.
Peterson will improve more this year than any Niner WR will improve from last years performance. So, those stats may go down quite a bit.
But who cares about the stats. Watching the game, Peterson improved a lot in just 3 weeks. You must have noticed it. And Peterson did the same thing down the stretch. He got better as the year wore on.
Im not saying Peterson isn’t good or anything. Im just stating to DS that MC, a WR he has knocked MANY TIMES, tore up PP. If Peterson is classified as a shut down corner then MC is much better than DS credits him. I also think his defensive play is overlooked because of his spectacular ST play.
I dont think our division will be the pushovers everyone thinks we are. SEA and ARI both played very well towards the end of the season. I think as a combined record our division will finish better than the NFC south, AFC west/east/and south.
Concurred Adam.
PP has the potential to become a shut down corner, but has yet to do so. That is all i was pointing out.
@Adam707
What I said about Peterson is the same thing many others have said. Supposed experts. Take from them what you will. But the majorty at this time think Peterson is better CB than MC is a WR at this time. When people talk about Peterson, it is no different from how they talked about MC in his rookie year (which I still think was his best easily). If Peterson follows the same pattern as MC, then he won’t be considered a shut down corner come year 4. But MC appeared to be a true #1 WR to me in his rookie year just as much as Peterson appears to be a true shut down CB to me now.
It means very little considering it is the offseason and I am not employed by either team. But neither are you.
Agree Adam707
Touchdown RRRRRRRRRRAIDERRS!
In other words, on defense the Raiders cant get any worse..up is the only direction left.
Two words: Rolando McClain. Enough said. The Raiders suck.
What are you gonna say when Harbaugh trades for McClain?
Government Assistance Program?
Disagree, Stan. It’s entirely possible that this pee-poor excuse for a sports franchise continues to be mired in the muck it’s leaders and culture have created. As will be appropriate.
Another penalty, RRRRRRRRRRAIDERRS!
My two favorite teams? The Niners, and whoever’s playing the Traitors.
@Rusty
+1
Give him a break. He only gets to hear that moron say that once every three games. Doh!!!! *uck the raiders. Stan. Take a hike!
@md
You are being to hard. Stan is welcome here. The Raiders are not.
ANY Raider fan is not allowed here. This isnt a Raider forum. It isnt our fault nobody watches or cares about that team. Im not on of those half A’s half Giants hat wearing idiots. Stan if your a Raider fan. Beat it. And Ds. If you back the Raiders fans. You can kick rocks too. Woooooo
“If you back the Raiders fans”
Just shows how little we all really know one another.
Trust me md. There is no way I back Raider fans with the history I have had with them.
I only ask that you keep in mind that Stan is a Niner fan as well. He (that I have seen) has not attacked any Niner players or the team.
Re: Winslowe
That’s a cap hit; $8.3, especially with that stable of WRs Grant referred to.
Do some vets get cut loose?
Hmm. Am I the only one who thinks Bruce Irvin could be one of the biggest busts of the last draft?
Small, lightweight speed rusher. Not much in the way of power moves. One trick pony. Very, VERY questionable character. Instead of the next Aldon, they may have the next Gholston.
Seattle is going to have two excellent safeties for years to come, and their defense may well be very good. But I am far from sold on Irvin, myself.
From what I read Irvin’s bad behavior is behind him. I’m guessing that won’t be a problem. I agree though, that what I’ve seen has showed him to be one-dimensional. What he does have is Take Off, and that’s not too coachable. I guess they think they can coach up the other stuff.
If he does become a Haley-type pass rusher, he’ll be worth a number one pick even as a situational player. Big “If”.
DS94everXev says:
May 22, 2012 at 9:10 am
“Are you forgetting about the one team in our division that actually did beat us? How is it that AZ is getting ignored? They have a shut down CB who is one heck of a threat as a returner, and the best WR in the game.
And, oh yeah. They beat us.”
No, not forgotten. I just don’t think they will be a viable team without a true QB. Fitz is an all-world’ talent, but who’s throwing him the ball? That’s a huge question that can’t be ignored.
Crabtree has best hands Harbaugh’s ever seen. http://www.csnbayarea.com/football-san-francisco-niners/niners-talk/Harbaugh-Crabtree-has-best-hands-Ive-eve?blockID=710336&feedID=5936
I actually relayed that during the live interview on KNBR last week. Little late.
DS/BS/BB (Blog Bum) – Not everyone spends their entire life in here like you do. Most of us are out and about. Most people have a life outside of this blog.
49erGirl always has been spot-on about you.
Here’s the link to the DS94everXev famous SNL intro.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VwT1kp0C3Ss&feature=related
Might want to include msc, jack hammer, hof, adam, undercenter, neal, and so on. That topic was discussed.
But please. Don’t let me get in your way. After all you have posted more hate DS posts than football posts.
There is some football to discuss if you want to be here for some reason besides acting like a jerk because your life is in the pitts. A little discussion about AZ perhaps?
Crab15,
That is not DS. This is a surveillance video obtained from his last employer. Apparently his real name is Milton Waddams.
http://video.search.yahoo.com/video/play;_ylt=A0S00M3bC7xPKg8Avsz7w8QF;_ylu=X3oDMTBvbnA1cmZmBHNlYwNzcgRzbGsDdmlkBHZ0aWQDVjEyNQ–?p=milton+waddams&vid=BD32E2DA8620D56F4350BD32E2DA8620D56F4350&l=2%3A57&turl=http%3A%2F%2Fts4.mm.bing.net%2Fvideos%2Fthumbnail.aspx%3Fq%3D4730675117948943%26id%3D6d0b9cef9fc1a7359b5cb895a9b2f436%26bid%3DUENv1SCG2uIyvQ%26bn%3DLargeThumb%26url%3Dhttp%253a%252f%252fwww.youtube.com%252fwatch%253fv%253dqfSAcVq6s9c&rurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DqfSAcVq6s9c&tit=Milton+Waddams+Strikes+Back.wmv&c=4&sigr=11avmhp3l&
BS formerly known as DS, your one sick pup, I actually feel sorry for you, your probably like the song ” All by myself” This blog is your pathetic lonely life.
NO NO NO…… I truly believe this is DS
http://youtu.be/86siAUU8Jlo
Solve “its” riddle
That might be the one md.
It’s riddle is quite difficult to solve.
Gee…
And you all think I have too much spare time.
Clearly I’m in all your guys heads. You must all think, sleep, think DS all the time. Who/why spend your time researching things not one of you have a clue about? In my day we spent time on the internet looking up porn. You spend it on me.
Should I be flattered?
:- )
DS says, “In my day we spent time on the internet looking up porn.” As Neal said, you’re one sick pup….
BS,,
No you shouldn’t be flattered. You should be at work, school, something else! Now get to it and let us have our blog back. You’ve worn out your welcome in less than a year. Now please, go away.
My new campaign!!!
STOP DSX1234567890!!!!
Good to see you have a good sense of humor ds
23welcher, your blog? Get serious dude. If anything we should all start a campaign that’s #stopwelcherclown23!
DS has its moments but you my friend are in a whole other level of ignorance. Your the last person that should be calling out anyone based on your history.
Oh an BTW save yourself the embarrassment of comin back at me with Crabtime, Michael Prime, please come up with something dumber, I know you have it in you!
md
“Good to see you have a good sense of humor ds”
If you are on this blog, you better have one.
I just like seeing how every little thing I write gets so many people to just freak out. It is fun.
If I wrote a post tomorrow about me wearing different color socks, would it get some people so outraged they throw out swear words or demand that I tell them the color? Some people here need to relax.
Thats all good. Ds. Until you start backing Raider fans. T… T… T… NO BUENO
Poor Prime, the only friend on the blog you have is BS. I won’t waste my time on you. You are below me. Everyone knows you post under 4 names. Who do you want me to respond to this time. Sorry, I dont have time for simpletons like yourself! Night Now!
Just to show you all how farour interests on the internet have all ‘evolved’, this article from sfgate about what movie sex scenes are the favorites shows us that indeed, thoughts of sex and porn have become so common place on the internet, it is a major story on the first page of sfgate.
http://blog.sfgate.com/mlasalle/2012/05/22/the-great-movie-sex-scenes/
So, anybody who thought they had some sort of ‘moral up’ on me for mentioning it, also apparently has the same ‘moral up’ on the Edior in Chief of the SF Chronicle blog. Must be great to be so moral and rightous.
: – )
Gumpy old troll? That’s hillarious.
Well done 23welcher, your game has improved to a 3.5 on the dumb scale. Keep up the bad work!
I hear your boy JJ has had a hard time reading coverage since OTA’s are now competitive. That has been the knock on him, can’t read defenses, great arm and quickness, but no brain, sound familiar?
Grant and fellow 49er fans,
I apologize for losing my composure and choosing to use inappropriate language, and am sorry if that offended anyone who may have seem it.
Thank you for erasing that series of posts.
Jack
I’ve asked you many times now for the good of the blog to ignore my posts and to stay out of those threads which attack me.
Every time I ask, you tell me to basically “shove it”. That I have to just live with it.
Now maybe you wil take that suggestion a little more seriously. Like I said. Not for me. But for the others. Unless your hate of me overwhelms your sense of reason so.
DS,
If you don’t want me to comment on your comments then don’t comment.
If you don’t like my comments with others, simply use your ignore button.
Good of the one (Jack) over the good of the many (everybody including Jack) it is then.
You could stop reading the posts. OH MY GOSH! Novel concept. And you won’t get any respect by doing the very same thing that lead to that thread of deleted posts. History repeats.
*will*
Grant,
Any good info from Day 1 of OTA’s?
..Aes I knw sea is unproven at the QB position…and wuld hope it remains like dat nxt year…kw gives the unproven QB a security blanket/reliable target…which sucks for us..
…… That might have been a good point…….. If you could spell….. Instead…. Of text……ting…….
A lot of fans are talking about the east coast games this season, but I think a lot are overlooking this division. This will not be the same old NFC West. Next seasons schedule is going to be difficult throughout. SF must stay healthy. Got lucky last season with few injuries. That doesn’t happen to often for two straight years. 11-5- 10-6 definitely back in the NFC Title Game
Winslow will be nothing more than a role player for the Seahawks at 3.6million? Costly. Can’t wait to play Petes’ team. Lynch will be paid back and will not have a 100yd game on the 49ers again.
Very interesting to see Harbaugh take the same approach this offseason with Crabtree as he did with Smith last year. Pump him up with false confidence and hope he can build off of it. He has an interesting strategy.
@Adam707
What false confidence?
I don’t agree with that statement. JH sees something in MC. Just like he did in AS. He may be wrong. But I don’t think JH is going out here lying about how he feels about his players. That strategy can’t work for long if he is lying. If he is telling the truth, then that helps.
The media can be fooled. But the players can’t be. They see JH all the time every day. It is easy to lie to the media. But you can’t do that to the players.
I dont think false confidence is the correct term. But i cannot think of any others that fit what he is doing. He comes out and says Crab has the best hands he’s ever seen. Coming from a guy who has been involved with pro and college football for around 25 years, working with the likes of Marvin Harrison and Tim Brown, thats a HUGE statement to make. Does he actually believe that or is he just saying that for Crab’s sake.
Adam707,
The best way to put it is that he is just pumping up his guy. The interesting thing is he did it totally unprovoked.
How many NFL players have better hands than Crabtree? I’ll start the list with Hakeem Nicks.
Crabtree does have good hands. I know he has some drops but on many of these I really think it is an issue of trying to secure the ball and turn upfield before he’s caught it. Not an issue of “hands” per se, which I take to mean ability to make difficult catches and hang onto them rather than ability to stay focused/ concentrate to not drop easy passes. He needs to concentrate on catching the ball first and not get ahead of himself.
I don’t think he has the best hands in football though. Guys like Fitzgerald and Lloyd have better hands, as does Nicks as Grant pointed out. These guys can routinely make difficult catches look easy.
Well Adam707, if the players don’t buy into it, it doesn’t matter. And because JH said the things he said about AS last year, if I were a player on this team, I believe him.
Who cares if the people outside the locker room believe this? How does that help the team win if (for ex.) DS and Adam 707 don’t agree with him? JH said a lot of things last year that a lot of people laughed at. But at the end oof the year, he had created the mos complete team in the NFL. And how? By doing what he’s doing with MC. Same thing.
May/may not work. That’s a risk. But one worth taking if you’re JH I suppose.
Slick Jimmy in a past life was a smooth salesmen Saying that Crabtree has the best hands he had ever seen is just crazy. What next? He is going to call Alex Smith a elite QB. You never know.
Larry Fitzgerald
Manningham and Moss
Greg Jennings
Andre Johnson
Let’s get this party started.
Vincent Jackson, Mike Wallace and Marques Colston
I have full confidence that the competitor in Mr. Crabs will quiet the naysayers just as VD did.
Interesting thing Razor is that, through 3 seasons Crabtree is actually ahead of where Davis was at the same point in his career.
MM did a nice piece on this a couple weeks ago. In case you missed it, here it is again.
http://www.csnbayarea.com/football-san-francisco-niners/niners-talk/Rating-Crabtree-through-three-seasons?blockID=704914&feedID=5936
Thank you Mr. Hammer.