Jimmy who? 49ers’ Robbie Gould key in 3-game win streak

SANTA CLARA — Quarterback Jimmy Garoppolo has been the story for the 49ers since he took over the starting job three weeks ago.

Kicker Robbie Gould has been the hero.

As well as Garoppolo has played, the 49ers offense has scored only three touchdowns during this three-game win streak. Without Gould, the 49ers may not even have a win streak. He has made 15 field goals the past three games – more than any kicker has made in a three-game span in the history of the NFL, according to Elias Sports.

“I can’t explain to you why he’s doing so well,” Kyle Shanahan said at his press conference Monday afternoon. “I don’t know enough about kicking. All I know is whether (the kick is) good or not good. It’s probably the only position I can study off a piece of paper just by reading the percentage. But (Gould) has been great.”

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This article has 257 Comments

  1. He certainly hasn’t been Fool’s Gould, that’s for sure. More like 24k Gould. The skies the limit as to how good Jimmy can be, and the buzz on the street is positive. Advantage 49ers in F/A. Lynch has another great draft, and we can win 9 games by this time next year, with a chance for a playoff berth….

    1. If somehow Bradley Chubb (EDGE, N.C. State) falls to them in next year’s draft, that will be awesome. Other notable prospects to watch are:

      Offense:
      Orlando Brown (OT, Oklahoma), Quenton Nelson (OG, Notre Dame), and Courtland Sutton (WR, SMU)

      Defense:
      Minkah Fitzpatrick (FS, Alabama), Denzel Ward (CB, Ohio State), and Roquan Smith (ILB, Georgia),

      1. I hope they get Q. Nelson. Though many areas need help, I feel the most important position to draft first is OL and Nelson will be an All-Pro one day. I believe he’ll be in the #5-8 pick area in April. He won’t be the only OL selected plus a solid FA. Can’t let JG get killed and the RB’s need holes to run thru.

  2. Grant, no disrespect to Gould, he’s been money, but hasn’t he been on the team all season? The same season in which the 49ers lost their first 9 starts. Given that, I certainly wouldn’t insinuate he’s been more valuable than Jimmy G.

    Robbie Gould is MONEY, while Jimmy G is the MAGIC!

      1. “He’s the quarterback. That’s part of the job.”
        I don’t recall Montana doing much of that. It’s personality thing and is not a requirement for the QB job. Brady, Rivers and a few others do a lot of that. I don’t see many of the others like Rothlesburger, Brees and Rodgers playing a vocal sideline role.

        1. “I don’t recall Montana doing much of that”

          You’re right he didn’t. My comment that it’s part of the QB’s job was directed at this:

          “Great to see the newbie taking on an immediate leadership role.”

          Montana was definitely a leader, albeit in a usually quiet way. Except after beating the Vikings in the divisional round back in ’88 😊

          1. Guess i figured the vocal part was implied both in the title, the preceding comment, and the video itself.
            I’ll try to do better.

  3. Jimmy has set up Gould to be the hero. Without Jimmy G gettin us in field goal range and in scoring range, there is no need for Robbie.

    Jimmy G, the franchise!

    1. + a bunch, Prime. Gould could have also won all those games we lost by 3 or fewer points. But guess what? The Hoyer led offense couldn’t get them in range.

    2. Indeed.
      Which of our previous 4 quarterbacks were you going to trust to move the offense 40 yards with 53 seconds and 1 timeout for a come-from-behind game winning score with no running threat… oh, and no need for a brown paper bag to control hyperventilation.

    3. +1 Prime.

      It’s a QB driven league. There’s a reason nobody builds a team around a fricken FG kicker, no matter how good they are. In fact, many of the good ones don’t even get drafted, including Robbie Gould, out of Penn State, who went undrafted in 2005.

      NFL legend Buddy Ryan:

      “Football kickers are like taxi cabs, you can always go out and hire another one.”

      Props to Robbie Gould for what he’s accomplished, but let’s not kid ourselves. The quarterback put him in a position to win these games.

      1. My man, MATT BARROWS, made a hilariously sarcastic quip that could have passed for a serious Grant Cohn analysis: “Jimmy Garoppolo’s minus-6 receiving yards this season ranks last in the NFL among 448 pass catchers. Is this really a guy the #49ers want to sign to a long-term deal?”

      2. I think they are more like doctor’s or dentists. You never want to see one, and swear your overpaying them for what they what they do…. But when you really need one, you pray you have a good one.

      3. Let’s put it this way Grant. The 49ers locker room is flush with optimism not only to finish out strong, but with the belief they are building something special, and these guys can hardly wait for next season.

        Now, do you think Robbie Gould is the reason these guys can hardly wait for 2018? lol. I think not!

        Jimmy Garoppolo = MVP!

  4. Ah, yes, Grant’s doing his Curmudgeon Realist Persona and throwing a ‘bucket of cold water’ on the fan mood upswing because nothing that’s ever been joyful has been invented that someone like his dad, or Ratto or Kawakami or Bayless or any of the other professional nay-saying curmudgeons couldn’t crap on…

    Gould has been great and has only missed two FGs this year. One cost us a game, but them’s the breaks. The rest of his FGs, until the last three games, were futile and only made the losses smaller or, in the case of blowing the Giants out, didn’t matter.

    So, yeah, his right foot is seriously big part of our three-game winning streak. And I’m happy for Gould and his success. I think he’s been amazing. But there’s no need to be so casually dismissive in your click-bait title of what Garoppolo has accomplished with this team in order to give accolades to Gould.

        1. Darren,

          LOL! Of course it is. Did I tell him not to? Just think it’s odd to put oneself through something they don’t like on a daily basis.

          Thanks for chiming in though.

      1. I have wondered if anyone would notice Grant were to be replaced by a AI program generating contrarian posts on a regular basis and pushing the tried-and-true buttons :)

          1. Yup! From moreisdifferent.com

            “Fortran is rarely used today in industry — one ranking ranks it behind 29 other languages. However, Fortran is still a dominant language for the large scale simulation of physical systems, ie. for things like the astrophysical modeling of stars and galaxies, hydrodynamics codes (cf. Flash), large scale molecular dynamics, electronic structure calculation codes (cf. SIESTA), large scale climate models, etc. “

            1. Cassie
              There are two reasons: 1. Lots of core code for numerical solution of equations were written and fully debugged that can still be re-used with wrapper code written in other languages. 2. Fortran introduced an approach called vectorization that made it easier to do simulations in parallel on multiple computers.

              1. Love it!

                C AREA OF A TRIANGLE – HERON’S FORMULA
                C INPUT – CARD READER UNIT 5, INTEGER INPUT, NO BLANK CARD FOR END OF DATA
                C OUTPUT – LINE PRINTER UNIT 6, REAL OUTPUT
                C INPUT ERROR DISPLAYS ERROR MESSAGE ON OUTPUT
                501 FORMAT(3I5)
                601 FORMAT(” A= “,I5,” B= “,I5,” C= “,I5,” AREA= “,F10.2,
                $”SQUARE UNITS”)
                602 FORMAT(“NORMAL END”)
                603 FORMAT(“INPUT ERROR OR ZERO VALUE ERROR”)
                INTEGER A,B,C
                10 READ(5,501,END=50,ERR=90) A,B,C
                IF(A=0 .OR. B=0 .OR. C=0) GO TO 90
                S = (A + B + C) / 2.0
                AREA = SQRT( S * (S – A) * (S – B) * (S – C) )
                WRITE(6,601) A,B,C,AREA
                GO TO 10
                50 WRITE(6,602)
                STOP
                90 WRITE(6,603)
                STOP
                END

                Snagged from an online source

              2. Waayyy off topic
                The VA guys got me an on-campus job (paid intern) at the Sonoma State U. Computer center when I was there as a student on The Bill.
                I was running punch cards interminably for the COBOL/FORTRAN
                Class. They had little cubby mailboxes that were meticulously designed to take a stacked and banded bundle straight in. 60% of the students split the decks and put two half decks in sideways, making it impossible for me to know which was top half.
                I’d feed them and rebuilder them with the green bar print out and put em back in the box. When the kids found their work was gibberish, they’d be imploring me 10:00 after the end of my shift to rerun them. I’d just push start by VW beetle and go home.

              3. brotha,
                That must be in the late 70s or early 80s? When I immigrated to this country in the mid-80s, punch cards had just been phase out by reams of paper printouts in light green and white. I spent a couple of years going through those reams at the U. I rec all Jimmy Johnson cheerleading the crowd at the student center on a Friday night before the game against the Gators.

              4. The GO TO statement brings back memories …

                yes it does…..

                I think it is still used in writing XML statements……..

              5. Punch cards? Oh yeah, I did that. Push start VWs? After a night computer science class I jump-started a Chevy Vega many times with a large 18″ screw driver. Those were the days.

  5. Gould is team MVP. Behind the scene it is Jimmy…

    …but PR wise and not getting ahead over our skis. Keeping excitement down, blau blau blau… Let’s book Gould… get out of season with no more injuries and build this team for success next year…

    …however, :)… if these next two games are all Jimmy and Jimmy carves up those two defenses and scores in the red zone and… AND…. and… blau blau… “b/c of Jimmy”, Hyde get 1000 yards, Goodwin gets 1K yards, Trent Taylor leads league in 3rd down completions, Jimmy has 70% completions… then we can chat about Jimmy on the map as 49ers MVP and top five QB in the league. But for now give it to Gould and humbly go into offseason.

    One game at the time

  6. Here’s some of the links from 49ersWEBZONE.

    How Garoppolo’s play, leadership have elevated 49ers
    LISTEN: 49ers Insider Podcast — The Jimmy Garoppolo Effect
    Jimmy Garoppolo Nominated for Two Player of the Week Honors
    49ers quarterback Jimmy Garoppolo a big draw for impending free agents
    Niners’ Tight Ends are Prospering With Garoppolo at QB
    49ers QB Jimmy Garoppolo helping to bring Levi’s Stadium back to life
    Jimmy who? 49ers’ Robbie Gould key in 3-game win streak

    One of these things is not like the others.

  7. A kicker is like an electrician or a plumber. It’s great to have a reliable one when needed. That this one chooses to be engaged with his teammates seems like a plus to cohesion. Wuzzamaddadat?

          1. Alex Karras had a priceless description of soccer style placekickers: ” tiny little foreigners who ran onto the field shouting, ‘I gonna keeck a touchdown.’”. No doubt he would be fined by the NFL today.

  8. https://www.ninersnation.com/2017/12/19/16797556/2018-nfl-draft-order-mock-draft-49ers-pick

    He has the 49ers selecting Texas offensive tackle Connor Williams.

    Walter Football Skill set Summary: In pass protection, Williams is a good athlete with quickness on the edge. He has length with long arms and height to make it hard for edge rushers to get around him. Williams has quick feet, balance, and gets depth in his kick slide to neutralize edge rushers. Even though he wasn’t overly powerful last year, he showed a nice ability to sustain his blocks in pass protection. Williams kept a lock on the defenders to prevent second-effort sacks or give up sacks after initially having his man blocked. Williams has quick feet and is nimble on the edge. He is a real asset to help negate speed rushers and protect the blind side for his quarterback.

    As a run blocker, Williams has been excellent at using his quickness to fire to the second level to hit blocks to spring backs for some long runs. Williams uses his athleticism to hit blocks in space and was superb at hitting blocks on linebackers to create lanes for Foreman.

    By Walter Football.com

  9. http://www.49ers.com/news/article-2/49ers-vs-Titans-By-the-Numbers/28aa78da-bd99-4f75-bf37-736f325bdef9

    “13 scoring drives in the 49ers last 16 possessions dating back to Week 14.”

    Not bad.

    “17 plays ran during the 49ers touchdown drive against the Titans in the second quarter. The possession spanned 17 plays, 80 yards and chewed 8:36 off the clock.”

    Long TD passes are sexy, but they put the D right back on the field and they’re low percentage plays (think a three point shot from half court). WCO gets the job done.

    Disclaimer: I’m not saying we should never go deep. I shouldn’t have to say that with every comment, but I never know if someone wants to give me a “hard time” again.

  10. Where are those people who said the 49ers should “bubble wrap” Jimmy G till next year?

    That might have been the dumbest idea ever!

      1. I’m not intentionally trying to insult anyone, especially you Rib who I enjoy reading, but look at what kind of energy this guy has brought to the organization.

        He was highly touted for a reason and football players play football. They don’t get shelved for another day or time.

        Jimmy G needed to play for many reasons. For him and his contract,and for the 49er to see what he can do.

        You look at the Browns and the 49ers and where each organization was 5 weeks ago. Pretty much on the same dead end season. Now, we are talking about a rebuild shortened from 3 years away to an offseason. Unreal!

        1. Prime, I didn’t want to see him CJ-ed, but who knew JimG was so adept at sidestepping pressure? Or that his release was so damn quick it even made this Niners oline look like it was protecting him.

    1. Prime,

      The 49ers (Shanny) knew what he had in JG from the beginning. Build a Winner and # 80 actually congratulated me for suggesting the 49ers hire Shanahan in the 1st place.

      WCO coaches just know QB’s, and Shanahan was raised in an environment where his proclaimed hero is Bill Walsh, so studied the QB position intensley.

      Players know who can play football in practice. Remember when Ronnie Lott and Dwight Clark said:
      “Who is this guy?” about Jerry Rice in summer camp as a rookie. Newspaper leaks emerged that Rice was going to be very good…..When that comes from Ronnie Lott you pay attention.

      There were similar reports from the 49ers about JG.

      So, playing him when they already knew what they had was a gamble and still is. In no way do I want my point proven by injury, of course not.

      At the most, he gets valuable real time experience with the play book and builds chemistry with his teammates……Cheers JG…..Go Niners !

      It’s like

      1. That’s my main point. He needed real experience leading the team.
        That was not gonna happen by him wearing street clothes on Sunday’s.
        Shanny says it all the time. Players get better by the more they do(reps).
        These 5 games for Jimmy G are so valuable.
        Again, the energy he has brought has also helped build a new culture in SF.
        Sitting him, saving him was a crazy idea.

        1. Other reputable analysts agreed with TomD. at the time:

          “It’s both obvious and broad, but the fact that Jimmy G has only been with the team since the

          The 49ers currently have 18 players on injured reserve. Six of them are on the offensive end. A few of these include Joshua Garnett, Pierre Garçon, and Garry Gilliam.
          Both of the team’s starting offensive tackles are having injury issues. Trent Brown is coming off of a concussion, and Joe Staley has been dealt an unfortunate injury to his eye.The team is currently third-worst in points per game and ninth-worst in yards per game. The offensive line is the worst in quarterback hits allowed and second-worst in sacks allowed. The 49ers are also worst in passes dropped with 21.”

          “Shanahan would only be setting up Garoppolo for failure if he put him in.”

          http://profootballspot.com/why-the-49ers-shouldnt-play-garoppolo-anytime-soon/

        1. Maybe for an hour after the trade then common sense clicked in.
          You don’t bubble wrap franchise QB’s. And for the record, I was the biggest advocate of trading for Jimmy G at the draft else while everyone else wanted Cousins.

          1. Yeah… not everyone. I was right there with you and was the only one that said I would be happy to trade the 49ers 2017 first round pick for him. Copped a bit of flack for that at the time.

            1. The question about acquiring goes back a while. When the subject was mentioned on her before the 2016 trade deadline my comment was that I’d give the Patriots whatever they wanted for Garoppolo.

              Then after the trade was done this season I was one of the first to say that they needed to get him on the field. A couple of folks included in this thread tried to say it was only because I wanted to see him fail due to not being ready to anoint him as the Savior.

              I liked the guy as a player.

            2. Scooter,

              There is no way they should have traded their first round pick for him in 2017. Whether it worked out or not, no team is going to gamble a pick that high on a QB with two starts. As it turns out they got him for a Second so I’m glad they didn’t trade a first for him.

              1. As I said at the time, those opposed to trading a 1st for JG are those that saw a guy that only had two starts and a guy that looked good at an organisation that has fooled people before.

                As I have been saying for a long time, JG was a good talent that came with serious question marks due to the system and division he played in college. In his first three years in the NFL he had shown at every opportunity that those concerns were overblown, and that he now had experience and an understanding of NFL concepts. Given the talent he had, that made him a better prospect than a guy like Trubisky, who went #2. So yes, he absolutely was worth a 1st.

                As for now getting him for a 2nd, that is outstanding. Although we are now excited about winning meaningless games whereas if we got him during the past offseason we may well be getting excited about a post season run.

                Its all moot though. We know Lynch enquired and got immediately shot down by Bill in the offseason. So while I very much think a 1st was worth giving up for him, it was never going to happen.

              2. Scooter,

                I think you may be forgetting the growing pains this team had to go through before it might win meaningless games. Up until a couple of weeks ago the receivers were dropping passes and the offense was committing very bad penalties at inopportune times. A lot came together during the Giants win which has continued more or less.

              3. I’m just talking about the situation at the time. No team would have given up the 2 overall pick for a backup QB with two starts. Doesn’t happen and that is why you were shot down when you suggested it. I was well aware of JG coming out of College. He had a remarkable senior season which is why he went in the second round, but during his time in NE he hardly saw the field with the exception of preseason and had played a game and half before getting injured. He was also in the final year of his rookie deal so giving up a first rounder would have been a non starter for pretty much every team interested. Most in here didn’t want to give up a 1st round pick for Cousins and he had a much stronger resume.

              4. Five games in a row from weeks 2 to 6 were decided by 3 points or less. You don’t think JG could have gotten more out of the offense than Hoyer over that stretch?

              5. We will never know what teams may have been willing to give up for him, but I figure if he is worth a 2nd round pick midway through a year for a team already out of playoff contention when he would be off contract at the end of the year, it really isn’t that far fetched to think he may have been worth a 1st to the 49ers to have him for the full year.

          2. What Scooter said, not everyone. I favored Garoppolo. I said JG was younger, cheaper, and had a higher ceiling. I gave up on JG when I thought Shanahan was holding out for Cousins.

          3. http://49ers.pressdemocrat.com/49ers-free-agency-challenge/

            #80 says:
            February 12, 2017 at 1:25 pm

            How many of you would trade pick 34 for Garoppolo? I would do it. Even if you want to make a lazy comparison and call him the next Cassell, Shanahan likes him. Kyle says Garoppolo is a pure thrower. I trust Kyle’s ability to evaluate QBs.

            Scooter_McG says:
            February 12, 2017 at 1:31 pm
            Yep. Happily.

            Shoup says:
            February 13, 2017 at 11:35 am
            Absolutely he was a second round pick to begin with so he had talent. Now he has experience in an NFL offense to go along with it.

            1. A friend of mine who is a Redskins fan says they might fire Gruden. How much will that affect Cousins decisions now? Things will get exciting if indeed Gruden is fired and Cousins walks.

          4. I wouldn’t have minded the idea of trading for JG at the draft. But wasn’t it a pipe dream at best due to the Pats already having him bubblewrapped as TB’s successor at the time? And only became a reality due to Brady’s play this season, something not knowable at draft time.

    2. I said to bubble wrap the guy until next year, You are an absolute freaking moron for posting this with 2 games left. If Jimmy G gets hurt, it’s your fault. Don’t you have the common sense to wait until the final whistle to gloat. Wtf is wrong with you. Damn it!

          1. All I want for Christmas is a sarcasm font, and for the Press Democrat IT guy to fix the “Popular Tags”…

            … and maybe a pellet fed, offset smoker.

    1. Haji-Sheikh’s Dad was a professor in Mechanical Engineering in Texas A&M (or maybe Arlington) who did research using Fortran code! A friend of mine did research for him.

    1. Why?
      He certainly has not played like one over the course of the whole season. I’m guessing there are something like 3 full backs in the nfc

      1. I posted a couple of years ago on this.
        It should be a fiesta. A Flag Football game, plus other competitions. A tug of war for the Big Uglies. Maybe an Ultimate Frisbee Match for skill position guys.
        Horseshoe pitching. Outrigger races. Beach Volleyball 6vs6.
        They’d have fun competing and bragging in low impact just-for-fun events. The tv folks would have something to broadcast.

  11. Reid showed again why he his valuable and shld be resigned…..he pretty much shut down D walker in the 1st quarter…..this was why the titans struggled earlier in the game.

    We need another solid ILB ….Coyle is a good backup…

  12. Watching the game again……
    JimmyG is God sent……he just saved us 1-2 yrs growing pains of qb play……i used to wonder what did we do or why did we deserve to be in the loser funk we have been this last year’s.. ….49ers are winners.. …we own the West …

    Finally I am 🤗 to say the QB has arrived with 🔫🔫🔫🔫 guns blazing🔥🔥🔥……

    49ers are back…..

  13. Back to football…

    For comparison, would love to see video that superimposes–to the extent possible–the releases of the last 10 9er QBs who’ve started more than two games. Similar to what is done at the combine when current and past prospects running the 40 are superimposed for comparison purposes.

    I’d think Jimmy’s release would be one of the quicker…

  14. Prime,

    I was definitely one of those “dumb” people that advocated keeping JG safe until next season. Tho’ I will argue that there is a difference between dumb and cautious. However I do take your point.

    I also suggested that there was no point in trying to evaluate the talent on this team when the talent bar was set so very very low. At least, that’s how it looked at the time. I still can’t get my head around this turnaround. Genuinely. Is JG really such a good QB he has turned a barely third rare receiver into one of the best in the NFL? Is it that KS’s offensive schemes are beginning to bed in? Is it simply that the team wasn’t that bad all along (those near misses at the start of the season?) and the only thing holding the team back was Hoyer?

    Either way…good to see the team doing well for a change but more importantly actually enjoying themselves it’s infectious and certainly bodes well fornext season

    1. Sorry, dumb was the wrong wording. I am not implying anyone on here is dumb, except the guy we all know who is. He is gone now.

      My point was to see what Jimmy G was all about, and to get him valuable experience, he needed to play. I wanted him to sit and learn the playbook and be functional before playing. I think the coaching staff did a great job waiting and getting him ready.

      Extra shout out to Kyle Shanahan who has coached his arse off these last 5 weeks. The team looks confident and playing hard.

      1. Good point about Shanahan, Prime.
        Is Jimmy G making Kyle look better, or is the entire offense finally “locking in” on the scheme?

        1. For sure having a quality QB helps. But look at all the other guys stepping up like Bourne, Taylor, Celek, Robinson. For whatever reason they are playing at a different level the past 5 weeks.
          I’m thinking its a combination of Jimmy G and coaching.

      2. Prime I don’t disagree that Shanny has “Coached his ass off” but he’s done it all season. There really isn’t a big difference in some of the things people were complaining about – penalties, play calling, etc. from early on until now -The difference is he has a QB who can run his system (at least what he knows of it) effectively, and the players are now getting used to playing in it and the nuances that come with being comfortable in a system that is complicated at first. It takes time for things to come together and we are beginning to see the evolution that comes with a ton of reps.

  15. Seriously, Grant is a very annoying reporter. So now the kicker is the MVP of the team? Open your eyes Grant, look at what the QB is doing, did the kicker throw all those passes to get into the FG position? sheesh, grant is likely the dumbest beat reported across the NFL. Idiotic!

  16. Ain’t nothin’ but a G thang with Garoppolo and Gould… Without Jimmy and those defense-breaking drives those FGs don’t happen… I’d exchange more TDs for less Gould but hey, great teamwork regardless!! They’ll iron out their RZ deficiencies in the offseason :)

        1. I read Florio’s piece on this yesterday. BB is a control freak whose style has great success. Letting Tom Terrific who also has good success have a personal trainer with an office in the building is one thing, but having that trainer be a pied piper for other players seemed to have chapped his hide. BB instituted some new ground rules in his house. The guys can still see the trainer by walking across the street, and TB can still see him in house.
          BB asserted control. Tom defends his guy. The idea that there is dysfunction between the two or that Brady’s status or longevity is in any way threatened doesn’t fly. Rib points out the Post, and I remind about Florio.
          Everybody’s moved on in NE.
          New rules.
          Really?
          Yup.
          Oh, ok then.

          1. Actually, Marquise had 99 yards in the game against Bears. His last three game stats are:

            8 catches 99 yards vs Bears
            6 catches 106 yards vs Texans
            8 catches 114 yards vs Titans

            So he is now at T Owens level..? :)

  17. Grant,

    Would you consider a column about those players on IR and what the team can expect from them in 2018, if anything?

    1. Denis Brown is wrong. Robbie Gould has not made players around him better, but Jimmy G certainly has. That’s what an MVP does.

      1. Yes, Gould likely isn’t in position to attempt all these field goals without Da Jimmy G, but the difference is one has needed to be perfect for the wins to happen.

      2. Can Jimmy G be the MVP if he only plays 5 games? If Goodwin hits 1k yards I think he’s got to be the MVP. It’s either Goodwin, Foster, or Buckner I would guess. You could argue for Staley as well. Just don’t see how a guy who plays less than 1/3 of the season can be your full season MVP. Of course over the last few games Jimmy G has proven to be the most valuable player on the roster but in terms of 2017 contribution I’m a bit torn how he can be the season MVP.

        1. The arguments/caveats about MVP come up every year.
          Is it most valuable in terms of team performance with vs without the player,
          or the player that is associated with the most wins (typically reserved for QB),
          or some other position stat that simply dominates all others.

          I’ve never had a good understanding of the metric used for this.

          1. Well considering what Goodwin has endured personally and considering his contributions to the team, he’s who I’m rooting for to be named the team MVP.

            1. The kid’s gone from hold-your-breath and pray… to sure-handed and incredibly productive.
              The loss of an infant son and his father in a span of 5 weeks without so much as a hesitation on the field.
              Yep, I’d be all in for Goodwin.

  18. The Jaguars have lost to the Titans, Jets, Rams and Cardinals. Notable victories – at the Steelers and at home against the Hawks. This team can be had but if ‘mistakes’ continue there will be little chance for a victory.

  19. The pertinent question : if Goodwin racks up two more hundred yard games and continues to do all the things one expects from a #1 receiver, should he be considered a #1 receiver? (How much of Goodwin’s success can be ascribed to Robbie G, the team MVP, one wonders……)

        1. Like a good engineering design that can accommodate variation or slop in its component parts, a franchise QB’s throws and movement within pocket can hide the limitations of the others in offense.

    1. Yardage is great but you need to score TD’s to be a #1 WR and Goodwin has a grand total of 1. I’m not trying to diminish the guys play, just pointing out that being a yardage churner on a team with few weapons does not make him a #1 receiver. I am encouraged by the strides he has taken and excited to see him for years to come, but we still need a true #1 guy.

        1. Absolutely, but we’ve seen Garoppolo elevate Goodwin; Goodwin didn’t elevate Hoyer or Beathard. Make no mistake, the RZ offense has to improve and Garoppolo needs to finish more drives with TD’s, but he’s already made a difference with only a few weeks in the system.

          1. Goodwin had raised his level of play prior to Da Jimmy G taking over. And together they’ve done pretty good for each other.

            1. Yeah he has improved over the course of the season for sure but they weren’t winning games, and he’s been better and more consistent with Garoppolo.

            2. Before JimmyG we were content with Goodwin catching one long ball and dropping multiple balls……I disagree with Goodwin raising his level of play prior to Jimmy

              1. No Goodwin had improved a lot from the start of the season and was already a big factor in the passing game before Garoppolo took over. JG just took him to another level.

              2. Goodwin has been at 67 yards or more for 8 of the last 10 games.

                67 yards might not seem like much, but it’s the pace of a 1,000 yard season.

              3. Borderline in my opinion. Great number 2 and Punt returner who could make big plays, but if he was all you had you were in trouble. Goodwin is nowhere near Jackson anyway.

              4. I agree on Jackson. But that is the value (as a WR) I think Goodwin can bring.

                And Garcon is fine as the more possession type WR opposite him. Just like Garcon was at the Skins.

          2. I would argue this the other way. Imagine how bad Hoyer and Beathard would have been without Goodwin. It’s a chicken and egg argument. Goodwin may have very well lifted the performance of the other QB’s this year but they didn’t know how to translate Goodwins contribution into success. His speed opens up the entire field for a QB who knows how to use Goodwin’s talents appropriately.

            1. Goodwin has been around awhile with little production. When the numbers go up that quickly with a new QB, the QB gets the credit. Goodwin was improving, but wasn’t catching a lot of passes before JG.

      1. What exactly is a #1 WR?

        Both Garcon and Goodwin have played like good starting NFL WRs this year. Neither guy is a dominant WR, but both are better than being relegated to a backup status.

        I am all for finding the next Jerry Rice, but unless that guy becomes available I see no reason to think the 49ers top 3 WRs from this year can’t be the top 3 next year too.

        1. “What exactly is a #1 WR?”

          That’s my question too, along with who are these “#1” receivers that teams are willing to let get away in free agency?

        2. A #1 WR to me is somebody who can consistently beat the guy in front of him, catches everything, and produces TD’s. Goodwin is not that guy, not yet anyway.

          1. “A #1 WR to me is somebody who can consistently beat the guy in front of him, catches everything, and produces TD’s.”

            So who are these guys that will be available in FA this year?

            1. Robinson has done it and Adams is just scratching the service. They’d be my top two targets. I’d also take a look at Watkins if the Rams don’t resign him. Jarvis Landry has done a lot with bad QB play in Miami. He’d be worth a look too.

              1. You knock Goodwin because it is easy (apparently) to put up numbers when there is nobody else to throw to. Then say Robinson is a number one WR because he has done it in the past. Don’t get me wrong, I like Robinson, but talk about a guy that benefited from having nobody else to throw to. As I posted previously, Robinson has a history of really struggling against good, physical CBs. He beats up on little guys. So he doesn’t beat everybody. Doesn’t sound like the #1 WR you described.

                Adams is just scratching the surface of his ability… so what is Goodwin doing?

                Basically your argument is they need guys that score TDs. I agree. But that doesn’t mean Goodwin can’t be a good starter. The guy opposite him needs to be a physical guy that can be a red zone threat. Tbh that is the biggest argument against Garcon – he has never been a huge TD producer. But they aren’t going to replace him this offseason – better off drafting his eventual replacement this offseason. And they need another TE that can also be more of a consistent receiving threat – if they had a good receiving TE then he would be part of the red zone solution.

              2. I’m not against drafting somebody Scooter. I just don’t think going into the season with the same guys at the top of the depth chart is justifiable with all the resources they have to improve the position. Devante Adams has been a top TD producer the past two years. He’d be a great compliment to Goodwin imo. I think where we are differing is in regards to Garcon. I don’t think he’s a Niner after 2018 and would have no problem with using him in a 3 man rotation next season. It would give us a pretty good trio and cover us in the event one of them got hurt. Both Goodwin and Garcon have some injury history now and Garcon is not getting any younger.

              3. Yeah, if they are going to replace either of the two starting WRs next year then Garcon is the guy that should make way imo. I guess that is what I have been trying to get at. Goodwin’s value for stretching the field while also being able to contribute catches and yards is going to be difficult to better through FA. And end of the day Garcon is good enough for another year – he’s no worse than Boldin was in his years as a 49er. I don’t really see any of the FA WRs as definitely being that much better, if any, than Garcon.

              4. Feels so bad for Garçon. Hoyer and him never connected early and then Hoyer got worse after each game.

          2. “And produces TD’s.” In order for that to happen, doesn’t he generally have to have his number called for the TD pass? Does Goodwin’s diminutive stature reduce the number of times his number is called for a TD pass? If so, is it fair to ding him for something beyond his control.

              1. For a number of years, the knock on the Harbaugh offense was lack of a player with blazing speed to open up the offense. They did have Moss that one year and it helped. Didn’t seem to be much help if any from Torrie Smith. Goodwin does seem to open up the field.

                I had a concern that our WRs would be beaten up by JAX next week. I figured they would be pressed hard at the line of scrimmage by JAX CBs. So, I watched the SF-TEN game again. TEN CBs played up close to the LOS most of the time and a number of times tried to check Goodwin immediately. I was surprised at how well Goodwin was able to avoid the hits coming off the LOS. I also watched the JAX-SEA game and was surprised that JAX CBs played mostly away from the LOS. Now it’s possible that JAX might change their strategy for the game this week, but even if they do, I’m less concerned that Goodwin won’t be able to get off the LOS.

              2. I’d extend that line of “stature/size” thinking specifically on Goodwin as one of the many issues we have with RZ production, along with our other rcvrs capability shortcomings– no pun intended, expressed, or implied…

              3. Goodwin has gotten better at dis-engaging @ LOS w/DB’s so his downfield release is faster…
                La Fleur (& KS methinks– from his past as a rcvr) seem to be getting more out of Goodwin, influenced/enhanced no doubt by the improvements @ QB…

        1. Even WEWANTWINNERS has realized Jimmy Garoppolo makes trolling 49ers fan blogs a losing cause! And Garoppolo has chased a few others away as well I think.

    1. that is a surprise……..our Guards/Center really suck…….even JimmyG with his quick reads and release can’t make them look good…..

    2. Yeah but we made another list too:

      http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2749863-whos-to-blame-for-nfls-biggest-underperformers?share=other

      “Thomas is tied for 10th among rookie defenders with only two sacks. Top-five draft picks should be more than strong run defenders. They’re
      supposed to be complete packages. Thomas hasn’t been disruptive enough against the pass, and he’s been outplayed by multiple first-year edge-rushers. He needs to be moved around to create mismatches along the defensive front.”

      1. Those who had watched Thomas for more than that bowl game knew he was not an outside pass rusher. His strength as a PR was moving inside on 3rd down and that isn’t what the 49ers needed with the previous two first round picks on the roster. ST is a solid hard working player who has done well as a run stopper, but that type of player isn’t worth the 3rd overall pick. It’s easy to say they should have taken somebody else now, but many of us were saying that before the draft. He is only in his rookie year and hopefully he develops his outside rush, but expecting him to become something he never has been is wishful thinking.

          1. Trade him to who Prime? He’s an even worse fit on a 3-4, IMO. Size and strength become more of a factor for linemen in 3–4 defenses than in 4–3 defenses because they move primarily within the confines of line play and seldom are in space using athletic ability.

        1. Didn’t ST work one on one with a number of notable NFL pass rushers during the offseason – or am I thinking of someone else?

        2. I didn’t watch ST while he was at Stanford. Nevertheless because of his size I assumed that he was brought in to be a Michael Bennett clone. Just look at the stats (first is MB; second is ST)

          Height: 6’4″; 6’3″
          Weight: 274 lbs; 273 lbs
          Combine 40 time: 5.13 seconds; 4.69 seconds
          225 lb reps: 24; 30
          Vertical jump: 31″; 35″
          Broad jump: 110″; 126″

          I couldn’t find Michael Bennett’s arm length as I know that ST’s arms are relatively short.

          Still, is it possible that the team is thinking they can develop ST into a MB clone? Physically (with exception of arm length) ST is already ahead of where MB was coming out of college.

          1. I’m not giving up on the kid by any means. He is what I thought he’d be for the most part, a good strong run defender with some upside and high character. There is definitely room for a player like that on a NFL roster. The problem is that isn’t worthy of the #3 pick in the draft.

            1. “The problem is that isn’t worthy of the #3 pick in the draft.”

              Agree. I’m just trying to understand the draft team’s thinking.

              1. It’s a failed pick. Let’s call it like it is.
                The 49ers needed other areas to address and DL wasn’t it. Add the fact he’s isn’t a very good DL, its a bad pick.

              2. Knock it off he is 21 years old. The work ethic this kid has and his relentless motor he will be a very good player. A big reason why the run defense has improved is because of ST. He has generated some pressure as well. Missed a couple other sacks. He will improve drastically in the off season. Thank God we didn’t draft Trubisky like someone suggested. Not naming any names. :)

              3. Rebuild your argument and reasoning is always just predicting things.
                You just crystal ball things and act like it will come to fruition.
                Once again with Thomas you are wrong and the proof is right there for everyone to see on the field over the course of this season.

                A lot of guys in the NFL are strong and have a relentless motor. The truth is it hasn’t resulted in nearly enough sacks, disruption or violent plays required by the 3rd overall pick.

                Now if next year he produces unreal plays via sacks tackles and disruptive plays, I will take a knee and gladly admit I’m wrong. In the meantime, call a spade a spade. Right now today, it was a bad pick.

              4. Yes good player that should have been drafted late 1st or early 2nd. Not 3rd overall.
                That kid could be good but he needs an offseason unknown to mankind.

      2. I’m not the only one, but I argued on this blog that Thomas was a tweener who would have trouble making an impact and finding the right fit, until I was blue in the face. What about Aaron Donald I was asked, as if there was any reasonable comparison in terms of body type, or skill set. I was one of a few on this blog who understood the problems that come on the inside for a guy who weighs less than two bucks-&-eighty cents. And Thomas was hardly used and never a force as a DE in college, primarily because he doesn’t have the desirable length.

        I think the best chance Thomas has to become an impact player now, is to put on some weight while adding strength, so that he can hold his own on the interior of the DL. He can then be moved around a little on some sub-packages in order to create the occasional mismatch. But he’s got a long way to go and the look of a 3rd round talent to me, and if ShanaLynch hadn’t traded up for Foster, I would have been sorely disappointed the day after the draft, and today as well.

        And thankfully, the silly King Solomon nickname has run it’s course!

        1. Oh, and I argued that Thomas had a decent chance at finding himself buried on the 49ers depth chart this season, and likely would have been if Carradine and Armstead hadn’t been injured!

          Imagine if they had simply taken Thomas at #2? Oh my! That was still a VERY DUMB pick at #3. Thankfully, ShanaLynch were able to trade back to #3 and pick up extra picks (Foster and more) or they would have been looking silly before the Garoppolo trade.

          Of course, when you find a franchise savior, and only give up a 2nd round pick for him, it pretty much erases the early mistakes before hand.

  20. Once Grant moves on, if the PD still wants a contrarian editor for this blog they could consider Titans cornerback Brice McCain. He on JG:

    He didn’t do anything special. He threw a lot of quick game, get the ball to the receiver’s hands fast, and they made plays. That’s about it. It was nothing special. He didn’t do anything special.

    Grant or Hammer couldn’t have said it any better ;)

  21. Hey Grant, I noticed you brought up Garoppolo potentially tipping plays at the press conference today. I went back and watched a lot of running plays from this last week, and the Texans game as well. While I thought there were instances where Jimmy did scan the defense on run plays before the snap, there were actually a significant number of running plays where it did seem as if he did appear to be paying less attention to scanning the defense prior to the snap. Based on Kyle’s reaction to your question, I think you may have brought his attention to something he hadn’t considered. You would think that Jimmy would have learned not to tip plays from all his time in NE, but he also may have been so caught up with everything else going on that he had a mental lapse.

    If indeed Garoppolo has been tipping running plays, and Dick LeBeau was savvy enough to recognize it (if anyone would, it’s LeBeau), Kyle owes you some gratitude. I appreciated the fact that you brought it to their attention, and wanted to give you some props if indeed you did pick up on a “tell”, because it did certainly seem as if LeBeau had his defense in the right spot every single time the 49ers tried the run the ball. Sure, LeBeau loves him some run blitzes, but man, it did seem there was more to it than that.

    KUDOS to you Grant Cohn! Good stuff!

      1. That’s something they certainly would have figured out eventually, but the sooner the better right, so good job.

        Oh and Hyde owes you a thanks as well.

    1. Just throwing some stuff against the wall here, but could the struggles against the Titans in the run game also have something to do with a bottom 3rd run offense (49ers) going up against the 3rd overall run defense? The Niners had much more success the week before against Houston who was ranked 10th and the week before that against Chicago who was 11th. So we are left with tipping plays against one team in 3 games or the chance they just faced a better run defense this past week. What do you think is more likely?

      1. I think there is a chance that savvy Dick LeBeau picked up on a “tell” through film review, possibly film from the Texans game. Who knows? But it wouldn’t surprise me all that much, considering the circumstances. LeBeau is one of the most experienced defensive minds in the NFL. That guy has seen it all, and this kind of thing happens more often than we realize.

        Of course, maybe it isn’t a factor, but it wouldn’t be that hard for me to believe that an inexperienced QB trying to run an unfamiliar offense might have so many things going in his head that he might make this kind of mistake.

        If it happened, let’s get it corrected, and move on. If not, well, then it’s nothing to worry about.

  22. More off topic. Grant’s intro on this blog site–translated to Korean then back to English via Google…

    I cover San Francisco throughout the year for a journalist in Santa Rosa. Discuss with me, agree with me or just read the message and follow the conversation. I was a member of several other regional and national sports fields and also wrote two online columns a week for pressemocrat.com and is also posted on this site.

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