49ers 16, Seahawks 43: Grades

San Francisco 49ers head coach Kyle Shanahan, right, stands on the sideline during the second half of an NFL football game against the Seattle Seahawks, Sunday, Dec. 2, 2018, in Seattle. (AP Photo/John Froschauer)

The Seattle Seahawks blew out the 49ers 43-16 on Sunday. Here are the 49ers grades.

NICK MULLENS: B-MINUS. The kid played better against the Seahawks in Seattle than any 49ers quarterback I can remember. Mullens passed for 414 yards. Colin Kaepernick, for example, never passed for more than 244 yards in Seattle. Mullens showed toughness, courage, accuracy and good decision-making, although he threw a pick-six in the red zone. That was a bad decision. Still, he firmly established himself as the second-best quarterback on the 49ers, better than C.J. Beathard. Had Jimmy Garoppolo passed for all those yards in Seattle without both of his starting wide receivers, people would have called him the greatest quarterback of all time.

RUNNING BACKS: C-PLUS. Matt Breida tweaked his injured ankle during warmups and played poorly. He rushed five times for just six yards. His backup, Jeffrey Wilson, played better. He ran extremely hard, averaged four yards per carry and gained 134 yards from scrimmage. Wilson has both speed and power, as opposed to Breida, who has speed but no power. Wilson reminds me of Chris Carson, the Seahawks starting running back. Wilson should have a future in the NFL, unless he keeps fumbling. He fumbled once in the red zone Sunday.

WIDE RECEIVERS: B-PLUS. Both Marquise Goodwin and Pierre Garcon missed the game, and both of their backups played well. Dante Pettis caught a 75-yard touchdown pass during garbage time (read: the entire second half) and finished with five catches for 129 yards and two touchdowns. Kendrick Bourne finished with six catches for 60 yards and no touchdowns. The rest of the receivers did hardly anything.

TIGHT ENDS: B. George Kittle caught six passes for 70 yards but didn’t score a touchdown. He is the 49ers best receiver and the 49ers can’t get him the ball in the end zone. He has only five touchdowns in his career. No other tight end caught a pass Sunday. The 49ers don’t have a worthwhile No. 2 tight end. If only they had kept Vance McDonald instead of trading him to the Pittsburgh Steelers and keeping Garrett Celek. McDonald has caught 33 passes for 444 yards and three touchdowns for the Steelers this season. Celek has caught three passes for 29 yards and one touchdown for the 49ers. Oops.

OFFENSIVE LINEMEN: F. They gave up three sacks and a whopping 15 quarterback hits, so the pass-blocking stunk. And the run-blocking did, too. The 49ers gained just 2.9 yards per carry. All five of the offensive linemen struggled big time, especially left guard Laken Tomlinson. He committed two false starts and gave up all three of the 49ers sacks. He’s not good. But, the 49ers probably won’t replace him any time soon, because they gave him a three-year, $16.5 million contract extension through 2021. Once again, the 49ers failed to properly assess one of their players.

DEFENSIVE LINEMEN: D. The 49ers couldn’t stop the run or the pass. The Seahawks averaged 5.8 yards per carry, and Russell Wilson’s quarterback rating was 140.9. Big, big numbers. DeForest Buckner played well – he recorded two sacks – but the unit as a whole made no impact.

LINEBACKERS: F. None of them broke up a pass or forced a turnover or recorded a tackle for a loss. The 49ers linebackers just made some downfield tackles after long runs.

SAFETIES: D. Jaquiski Tartt left another game with a stinger – he can’t stay healthy. The 49ers should have kept Eric Reid. The other safety, Antone Exum Jr., committed a 43-yard pass interference penalty.

CORNERBACKS: F. Ahkello Witherspoon committed his weekly pass-interference penalty and gave up a 45-yard catch because he forgot to cover his zone. K’Waun Williams gave up two touchdown catches. And Richard Sherman gave up one. Teams have picked on Sherman the past two games. He does not deserve to go to the Pro Bowl. The 49ers need three new corners.

SPECIAL TEAMS: D. The kickoff-coverage unit gave up an 85-yard kickoff return to start the second half. And Richie James fumbled a punt which the Seahawks recovered. But, James also returned a kickoff for 42 yards, and that play gave the 49ers life in the third quarter. James is a decent kickoff returner, but a horrible punt returner. Pettis should return the punts.

COACHES: F-MINUS-MINUS. Pete Carroll may have put Robert Saleh of business. Saleh runs Carroll’s defense, and Carroll knows exactly how to attack it because Carroll created it. Saleh merely imitates it. The imitator never catches the innovator, because the innovator constantly creates new wrinkles while the imitator still tries to master the basics. Fire Robert Saleh. Fire Kyle Shanahan, too. He challenged his players to play hard after the Bye week and they quit on him. Got blown out two weeks in a row. Made the same mistakes they’ve made since Shanahan became the coach almost two years ago. Committed 13 penalties, converted only one-of-four trips to the red zone, gave the ball away three times, took the ball away zero times and played soft, because that’s what Shanahan’s 49ers are. Soft. Jimmy Garoppolo can’t fix this mess.

This article has 386 Comments

      1. Sorry Grant, you have no credibility when stating Garoppollo won’t the help fix this mess (which Shemran acuractly attributed to injuries (post game), after predicting nothing would change when Jimmy g took a over last season.

        Let’s evauluate the injuries, which are the cruxed of the teams issues:

        – Franchise QB – the most important position in pro sports, out for season

        – Top 2 WR’s, out, injured for the bulk of the season.

        – Starting slot reciever out, injured most of the season

        – Top 3 RB’s, 2 out, 2nd string injured for bulk of the season

        – Top 2 FS, out, injured for bulk of the season

        – Top SS, injured for bulk of the seaaon

        – Best ILB gone, injured for bulk of the season, #2 ILB banged up most of season

        Failures: Team failed to adress pass rush in off-season, an obvious critical mistake, and biggest issue outside of unprecidented injuries. Turnover differential – brutal, partly due to injuries, but must be addressed in off-season. Defensive coaching & scheme must be evaluated in off-season.

        Answer for 2019: Get healthy and draft Bosa. Consider defensive coaching change(s). Find a way to address turnover discrepency. Find a WR who can win consistantly in redzone.

        1. And most tellingly for me, how you – a local beat reporter with media credentials who closely covers this team – isn’t doing more to talk about how key injuries are having such a devistating impact on this team, and greatly effecting continuity, and how you are failing to call out the 49ers current DC more forcefully, comes accross as a guy with an alternative motive … as usual.

          And no props for the rookie WR PETTIS, after he’s stepped up in back to back games now that he is healthy and finally getting his opportunitialso reaks of disingenous reporting. You can, and should, do better.

        2. I don’t think a healthy garoppollo and others drastically changes the trajectory of this season. Injuries might make the difference in winning some of these games against top teams, but there were plenty of winnable games this season against bad teams that the 49ers lost due to unforced errors. There’s nothing wrong with calling that out.

        3. Even though I agree with you, what happens if we don’t draft bosa? Everyone of you are tied to this man. Is he the be all end all? There actually might be a case where we might slip all the way to 5 or 6. So just asking, if no bosa, then what?

  1. Agree with the grades. If anything, the D-line should be even lower. They keep outdoing themselves on lack of pressure.

    Saleh. That’s the biggest concern. Personnel or not, his system makes no sense. LBs chasing receivers into the end zone. LBs running into wrong gaps. Soft coverage at the wrong times….. Methinks he may be a fall guy.

    1. There is no doubt he needs to be fired. It’s a defense where you need special players but it’s clear he can’t call a game and make necessary adjustments.
      Too much zone and too much leaving guys not capable of executing their assignment one on one.

            1. That’s exactly it. Saleh has made zero changes to this defense.
              He still has LB’s covering WR’s and he still hasn’t been able to add a pass rush blitz package to help. Zero innovation to fix anything.
              Personnel or not, the defense once was a strength and now is a liaibiity.
              He has to be let go. No vision and players are not getting better.

              1. To be fair, the DBs haven’t been exactly standouts covering WRs either!

                And I don’t remember the defense being a strength since Harbaugh was around! Not sure that firing Harbaugh and pushing Fangio out was Saleh ‘s fault, but who knows? Seb seems to have an ear to all the back door dealings and conversations in Jeblandia, so ask him!

            2. It’s not Roberts scheme. It’s the dang players they have running it. There really isn’t any more secondaries that can play that type of 2011-14 Seahawks defense. NFL rules won’t allow it. Kyle has a choice to make. Keep Salah for continuity purposes, or completely change the scheme next year. The Baltimore Ravens have had a top 20 defense for the better part of 18 years. No matter who runs it, it always performs. Hell call Mike Nolan. Lynch should all Baltimore in the off-season and literally ask to interview the whole defensive staff. Or go blast from the past and call Ed Donatell

              1. Yes, it is Saleh’s fault. He had a LB covering Lockett. Did I see any exotic blitzes? Wagner’s delayed blitzes up the middle were devastating. Where were the safety blitzes? Wilson avoided the slow linemen and threw 3 TDs in 4 passing attempts. A DC should not allow uncovered players. They allowed the Seahawks to convert on a third and 25 yards play? Wow.
                .
                If the Niners do not have the personnel to play in a Pete Carroll defense, why are they trying to do that? They should be doing something else, like devise a scheme to fit the players.
                .
                After 2 blowouts, the Niners are regressing. They should be desperate, not complacent.

              2. Seb.. never said it wasn’t his fault, I said they don’t have the players to run his scheme. The scheme can work but the players don’t exist to run it. Why are they running it you ask? Because when Kyle became coach it’s the defense he used in atlanta, so im assuming since he got started so late in putting together a staff, he went with what he knew, and found someone with knowledge of it. When Bradley turned him down, he settled for Salaeh. But without the players, the scheme won’t work. In my opinion, Robert doesn’t know anything but this scheme and doesn’t know how to adjust when it’s not working.

              3. Seb, it’s a link above from Richard Sherman.. read it, nobody is complacent. You made that up. Hear it from the horses mouth.

              4. Steele, Richard Sherman should be the last person to ask about complacency. He gave the Seahawks reams of motivational material, as if it did not matter.
                .
                He dissed RW, who threw for 4 TDs and had a 140 QBR. I can assure you, Wilson was not complacent. He made the Niners look complacent.
                .
                After that 98 yard pick six, the Niners looked even more complacent. I did not see any fire in their eyes. I saw more hang dog looks.

              5. Seb, why is that? He just let you know that nobody has given up. These guys are fighting, they just have a depleted team. And because Russell threw for 4 touchdowns that means he’s “not complacent”. Again Seb, you made that all the way up. Because that’s how “YOU” feel, not what’s actually going on.

              6. Steele, yes, it is just my opinion, but once the Seahawks went up by 24 points after only 16 seconds in the second half, the Niners became resigned to losing.
                .
                Richard Sherman is like the Black Knight.- ‘Tis but a scratch!!!’

              7. Sebs-

                You are mistaking lack of talent-and sound defensive coaching-for complacency.

                These guys are playing for a job i.e. food on the table-next year. Either here or someplace else. At the very least, complacency is the least of it. Were having to play 3rd string players in many positions……thats not going to get it done.

  2. I didn’t see that the Niner players quit on Shanny. Wilson runs with some power, something the Niners are lacking.

    1. I told you I liked what I saw from Wilson last week. He runs low with power, and finishes runs, can catch and has some burst. Gonna be a competitive stable next year….

    2. It’s a young team that gets deflated easily but can you blame them? Nothing has gone right for this team all year.
      But one thing they have not done and that’s quit.

  3. Yes makes perfect logical sense, fire a coach that has a 6 year deal in year 2. Coach who is down to third string and practice squad players. A coach whose third string QB threw for 414 yards, but Grant keeps saying that the Niners should sign Kaep. I think we do need a Wade Phillips type of Defensive Coordinator that is very experienced,however Grant you remind me of someone I know, who reads Sales books and he think he knows everything about Sales but never sold a thing in his life, now equate that to football.

        1. I think he knows exactly how to run Vic fangios defense. Only problem is, this defense is built for a 4-3, not be a 3-4. Looking at it now, how would the front 7 look in a 3-4? Buck, armsted, (BOSA), Smith and Warner in the middle? Have no idea about the outside backers

          1. Justin Smith was a 4-3 DE all his career and then came to the 49ers. There was the same argument then. What are we going to do with him, there’s no way he can play in a 3-4. Well, they were very wrong. The players we have now can’t run Saleh’s defense. How could they do worse if it’s changed?

        1. Razor I was thinking that, but how will the faithful take it, hiring another guy with no coordinator experience? But you have to start somewhere.

            1. He’s had some good defenses at Clemson. That actually might be worth a look. I know I’d support that likely hire.

              1. SMH?

                Status must happen?

                sebnynah says:
                November 28, 2018 at 7:43 pm
                Grant, by calling me a legend, elevates my status,

              2. sebnynah says:
                November 28, 2018 at 7:43 pm
                Grant, by calling me a legend, elevates my status,

                Rankings as of Dec.3/18

                1. Eastcoast
                2.Rocket
                3.Scooter
                4.Jack Hammer
                5.Cubus
                6.Razoreater
                7.whine country
                8.Steelmatic
                9. Juanhunglo
                10.Darren5000

                Unranked: sebnynah, just not enough status to get ranked.

              3. Prime, did you actually rank D5k as having status?
                .
                D5k is rank, not ranked.
                .
                You just put yourself below D5k. Good show.

              4. sebnynah says:
                November 28, 2018 at 7:43 pm
                Grant, by calling me a legend, elevates my status,

                Darren 5000 is a d bag like you but at least he is original in his thoughts. Unlike you who sounds like you just copy and paste from day to day.
                You are not ready to join the elite posters. Keep trying!

              5. Prime is thinking he is smart enough to rank posters. Too bad he is so clueless.
                .
                Obsessing about status just shows how Prime is so insecure and immature.
                .
                Luckily, he tops a list for being a foul mouthed simpleton bully, so he can claim to be number one.

    1. Haha, couldn’t agree more. I read an article of his last week where he was using that same level of knowledge to grade the last 2 drafts… he described McGlinchy as having had no impact, despite him being one of the top graded run blocking tackles, the top rated rookie lineman, and even described as a dark horse candidate for offensive rookie of the year. He won’t win it, but that’s a long way from “no impact”.

  4. I don’t know what game you were watching today Coach/GM Cohn. I didn’t see any quit today. Just the opposite. They played very hard until the end. They’ve played very hard every game this season. That ridiculous statement by you takes away any credibility you might have in assessing today’s game, or any others this season. As usual, you come across as a jaded petty cry baby who wouldn’t know effort if it stood in front of you. Who gives a flying Wallenda anyway?

  5. Fire Robert Saleh

    It’s about time you figured this out (even if this should have been done many games ago…..). Shanahan should do everything he can to pry Kris Richard away…. Someone who actually knows how to coach defense, technique, fundamentals and you know, the scheme that Saleh struggles to grasp. This defense plays like Saleh – clueless and without any sort of confidence, heart or passion.

  6. Why are you wasting your time on players and coaches? Fricken Jed f-ing York is the problem.That guy can’t get a damn thing right.Shouldv’e left with his home boi Trent…this soft ass pasty white dumb ass needs to leave.Niners suck in all phases but jeddy boy is the truly the reason.wtong players and wrong coaches and GM sucks.

    1. Wow!! blatant in your face racism! Like the flesh is doing the thinking……………..Out of the abundance of the heart does the mouth speak, not the other way around!

      Alex, you have drunken the poison.

  7. Grant, gotta agree with your grades., especially the coaching.
    .
    It felt like some Pee Wee team was playing against the Legion of Boom.
    .
    The coaching was pathetic, incompetent and embarrassing.
    .
    Pete Carroll schooled the Niners, and he is everything I see lacking in the Niner coaches. Bill Walsh would have been proud of Pete.

          1. No, you asked about the team. KS is the leader of the team.
            .
            KS should never have damned Wilson with faint praise. RW responded with 4 TDs and a 140 QBR.
            .
            Giving the opponent motivation is counter productive.
            .
            After Mullens threw that 98 yard pick six, the Niners gave up. They just went through the motions after that. That play was a real gut punch, and sealed the victory.

            1. Wow! Pin point analysis. Of course the game was over after that 98 yard pick 6! Holy sh$t you are brilliant!

              That’s all you got?

              1. Quitting and having the game get away from them over miscues are 2 totally different reasons.
                You view the game from black and white. It’s lazy and an old mans mentality.
                Those players played hard the whole game. The result can be questioned, the effort cannot be.

              2. Prime, look at Grant’s 49ers-Seahawks postgame report. Richard Sherman’s face speaks volumes. Sure looked like he was resigned to losing. Sure did not look like he was fired up, with a spring to his step, expecting a miraculous comeback for a glorious victory.
                .
                Getting blown out twice in a row does not help the psyche. It is actually pretty demoralizing.

              3. No, no, I did not expect you to comprehend his writing, I just wanted you to look at the picture.
                .
                The look on Sherman’s face said it all.

            2. Sebs-

              I’ll cut to the chase-Kap is not coming back-they will not sign him to a 10 yr K-stop being bitter to Kyle for that.

              1. Saw, I did not mention Kaep at all, and other posters have been ripping on KS a lot, and deservedly so.
                .
                Maybe you like how KS considered time outs to be precious, and wisely used them to help the Seahawks score a TD.

    1. It felt like some Pee Wee team was playing against the Legion of Boom.

      To be fair, that was close to the talent discrepancy in this game… I don’t know a coach in the NFL that would coach this current roster to a win over Seattle in Seattle.

  8. Yep, the coaches fumbled the punt, threw the pick six, fumbled the ball, produced the penalties, dropped the balls, allowed the run backs, and didn’t tackle. Lol. At what point do you hold the players accountable for their play? It’s about lack of talent. Neal, you have it right on the money. Your “Sales” analogy is perfect.

    1. I am not ‘buying’ it. The team last season was struggling, but once JG started leading them, the whole team performed better and won 5 straight games. JG, by KS’s own admission ‘overcame the coaching’.
      ,
      Maybe the ST coach should have coached up Richie James so he does not let the ball fall through his fingers.
      .
      Maybe Scangarello should have coached Mullens well enough to look off the DB. Instead, Mullens stared down the receiver for a 98 yard pick six. Allowing opponents to run down field uncovered is the DC’s fault. He should prepare the DBs well enough to be able to cover all the receivers.
      .
      Absolving the coaching of all blame is not realistic. With better, more thorough preparations, the players would not be making so many mistakes. Simply by running the no huddle with quick snaps, they could have avoided all those false starts. Cannot false start if the ball is already hiked.

      1. No one is absolving the coaches of blame, but you act like coaches are video game players that control the moves of everyone on their roster. If coaches mattered as much as you think UC Davis could contend with Alabama if they just hired Bellacheck, it’s absurd.
        You blame the coaches when a player fumbles or when a qb makes a bad throw. With that logic, the niners shouldn’t worry about who they draft or bring in any free agents because if the coach is good it wont matter. They should field a roster filled with players that only accept league minimum because its all on the coach. If he is good then the players wont fumble, make bad decisions, miss blocks, etc.
        I’m not saying the coaches don’t deserve criticism, far from it but at least criticism them for what they control, scheme ( defensive confusion is a mainstay and must be looked at), General technique if it looks the same (see Chip Kelly’s play action vs Kyle’s play action line play), game management, not taking a time out soon enough, not getting a call in fast enough etc, failure to adjust, if a particular player is killing an olinemen, not giving help or rolling away from said defender. Those are all coaching issues.
        Fumbles, throwing into double coverage, staring down a receiver, not cutting upfield for the first down, alligator arming a ball, failing to catch an interception, failing to wrap up a player, etc.. those are all on the player.

        1. I have no idea why you guys continue to respond to Seb. He doesn’t have a clue how football is schemed and matchups are created. He just repeats clichés he’s heard and offers up generic ideas that a 10 year old learning the game for the first time would. Don’t waste your time.

          1. Yup, you ripped my trade back proposals, but now, many are calling for trade backs.
            .
            I am patient, and some day, you will admit I was right. Until then, I hope you ignore my posts, like I have been ignoring yours, until this last screed when you mentioned my name.
            .
            BTW, I said before the game that the Seahawks would keep everything in front of them, make the Niners make long sustained drives and expect the Niners would make mistakes to prevent the Niners from scoring. Guess that was wildly off base for you.

            1. You are as thick as a brick. No one has ever been against trading back and it happens all the time. The reason people were ridiculing you was because of your multiple trade back mock drafts that had the 49ers winding up with tons of picks in the first 3 rounds which were unrealistic and had no chance of happening. Your mock draft scenarios are right there with your knowledge of football; non existent.

              1. Seahawks traded back multiple times, and locked up 12 players under rookie contracts. Guess you will now be claiming that JS and PC have no football knowledge. Too bad they just humiliated the Niners.
                .
                However, Schneider and Pete Carroll thought there were players even in the 5th round who were valuable to them. Guess you will claim they are clueless.
                .
                Rams gave away 6 picks, and Philly gave away 5 picks, so that ‘impossibility’ just happened recently. Those trades were real, not non existent.
                .
                I made those multiple mocks because JL stated that he would consider every proposal. Maybe your beef is with JL for making that statement. Sure, some of those were unrealistic, but trading back one spot and getting 3 picks was unrealistic to me, but happened.
                .
                Sure am glad that JL followed my advice, and not yours.

              2. catfish,

                Good point and that’s why I want them to take Bosa as opposed to trading down if they get the #1 pick.

                If Seb’s mocks were even half way realistic I wouldn’t ridicule him but the mocks where he has the Niners trading down in the first multiple times and winding up with 8-9 picks in the first 3 rounds are ridiculous. No examples in NFL draft history of any team acquiring near that many picks in the first three rounds of a single draft

        1. Haha!

          The last word-Sebs always has to get in the last word, the last little snip! I love it!!!!!!!!!!!!

          I love ya Sebs and thats a factoid!

  9. Look at the starting roster. A week before the season if you looked at this starting roster would you expect to win?

      1. Grant, I’m sure you know this– the spread has little to do with who wins by how much but everything to do with what number it takes to get the betting public to spread their bets evenly between both teams. Truth is, and most bettors knew this–Seattle at home was and is a much better team than just 10 points.

      2. The Packers were 14 point home favorites and lost. What’s your point?

        You talk out of both sides of your mouth too often. Mullens is a 3rd string qb yet you think he played well even though KS should get fired…. Who was calling the plays Genius?

        Stop trying to be the bay areas version of skip bayless.

          1. Seb, Mcarthy was fired after 12 years with the ,2nd best QB in the NFL. Not after a year and a half with 2nd and 3rd stringers at QB and 7 and a half games of your supposed starter. Your exclamation point is irrelevant.

            1. Steele, at 4-7-1, he had twice as many wins as KS.
              .
              It also shows how important a defense is to winning. They have Aaron Rodgers, but have lost 7 games. AR was also mad that they did not draft a decent WR.

  10. Today was pretty much like every game this season.

    Special teams set up 2 scores, one with a fumble, one with a long return.

    Fail in the redzone with a long return, this one for a touchdown.

    It’s the same stupid stuff with this team every week, and it was the same even with Garoppolo under center for the first 3 weeks.

    This team sucks. They put up yards on offense, the 452 yards look impressive at first glance. Except the Seahawks came into the game giving up an average of 7.6 yards per play over their last three games. Today they gave up 6.1. The big yardage had more to do with the fact the 49ers ran 74 plays.

    On defense, Witherspoon gave up 2 big plays while they’re in Cover 3’because he chases the receiver inside instead of seeing the crosser coming into his zone.

    Sherman is an old man. Not only because of the TD catch, but he also misses a tackle on Baldwin who then runs for a first down.

    The front 4 is terrible. Yeah Thomas pretty much sucks. He doesn’t make plays. People have been calling for Taylor to play, but he’s slow. That’s why he’d been inactive all season.

    The linebackers looked lost pretty much all day.

    It was good to see Pettis back up his performance from last week though.

  11. EastCoast9er says:
    December 1, 2018 at 4:21 pm
    You are right about Getting Kittle involved. I fear they will tee up on Pettis. I suspect that our inability to make plays will continue and Seattle will use this as their coming out party to the rest of the league. Two picks for them.

    Score 37 to 17 with Seattle looking good and the 49ers, well…

    Now I don’t repost this to Paty myself on the back for being close on the score and outcome, but if you observe both teams dispassionately it is easy to see that Seattle is in ascendancy and the 49ers are hurting.

    We have a OL that cannot protect a passer, this was true with JG and other QBs. They have largely been given a pass because of their success with zone run blocking. But it is also an Achilles heel when they get into the RZ.

    Pettis did well in the open but you can be sure that teams will try to jam him up and rough him up. The WRs leave much to be desired.

    TE play is good but poorly utilized (as well as FB).

    The QB play is ok. Not great but still serviceable if all other areas were firing.

    Defense always get the blame and while the didn’t play great (no TO), especially against the run, too many times they found themselves on their heels by something the offense or special teams did or penalties.

    The most glaring problems are in the secondary and AW and the rest of the corners as well as safety play is poor! Never understood why Reid was allowed to leave and he would have done a lot to solidify this poor backfield.

    DL didn’t get to the QB (no surprise) with enough regularity and some players just aren’t cutting it.

    Busy upcoming offseason and I fear there will be a reshuffling of personnel. Some position coaches will be looking for work and some players will have to go.

    1. @Eastcoast9er

      Not sure what game you watched but your wrong in almost all aspects…TE and FB are poorly utlilized?? I can bring up film that says otherwise. You cant on any of your points. The teams main problem is the secondary? Shows how well you understand football. The teams problem is the lack of pressure. QBs love playing the 49ers… And Pettis was very good today, as great get off to beat the jam. His route running is some of the best I’ve seen in a long time. I’m an East Coast fan too and your giving us a bad name with poor analysis that frankly is wrong.

      1. Well, maybe you haven’t been around for too long because I have been advocating a pass rusher for sometime now PA! If you noticed I mentioned the glaring problems in the secondary. But whatever.

        In regards to the poor utilization of the TE and FB, the proof is in the stats. Kittle is not targeted often enough in the RZ and Juice doesn’t get the ball enough, especially in short yardage situations or RZ.

        I stated in a previous post that Pettis did well. And repeated here. If you think opposing teams won’t work at limiting his release then you’re dreaming.

        I don’t speak for all East coast fans but myself. So, if you think I’m speaking for you, I apologize. I’ll let the facts speak for themselves.

    2. “You are right about Getting Kittle involved. I fear they will tee up on Pettis.”

      That was in response to my comment from the earlier thread. Pettis did look good in space. Our opponents will have to account for Pettis now, in addition to Kittle. That’s two pieces to build around. With Goodwin taking the top off the D, this offense will be even more difficult to defend. Then you have Jet who like Pettis, is good in space. And of course JG will be back. I would like to add a quality WR, but this offenses biggest problem is still the interior OL.

      1. Marquis Goodwin is not someone who can be counted on. Until last year he was always hurt and he’s been hurt most of this year. He’s had several concussions in the last few years. Given what is now known about concussions, he probably should have retired already. It’s a shame because he’s a likable, talented player and outside of Tyreek Hill, Marquis is probably the fastest player in the NFL. He is many things, but he is not dependable. Unfortunately.

  12. I don’t know what they are teaching the secondary. Exum could easily have turned his head to look for the ball on that penalty. He had caught up to the receiver and was actually on top of him. He could readily have turned his head in what looked like at least a second or two before the ball arrived. Every week it’s the same thing. I can see when a DB is beat by several steps that he needs to run as hard as possible to catch up which will preclude turning the head until he catches up. But Exum was there in plenty of time.

    I did think that PI on Witherspoon in the endzone was ticky-tacky, but when you’ve got his rep and a losing team record, you never get the call.

    1. I will be surprised that Hafley is not teaching correct technique. The problem is that we have third of fourth stringers like Exum as starters due to the injury situation. Exum is a sixth round draft pick who started 3 games for Minnesota in 4 seasons. He will probably out of the leagues in a couple of years….

      1. So why is Exum in the team? Why is he on the field when the team had a decent DB in Reid? They could have paid him. They could have structured the contract in such a way that he would have a 1-2 year deal if certain parameters weren’t met.

        But the excuse was that they needed to develop younger talented players. Now some these guys are scrubs who will be out of the league soon??

        Coaches have the opportunity to sit players who don’t execute or ask that players be brought in who will. Some of this has to fall on the coaches who see these deficiencies across all players and do nothing to correct the problems week-after-week!

        This team is not very good. It wasn’t very good with Garoppolo and likely wouldn’t have been very good with McKinnon! All the talk of this team making the playoffs was nothing but hype! At maximum, they may have had 6 wins this year but that was if everything fell the right way. It didn’t and you see the results.

        Remember when people said they would sweep Arizona and split, at least, with Seattle? Seems like a fantasy because it was.

        This team is several players away from respectability. I hope they can make inroads with FA and the draft but so far the results have been anemic.

        1. East, I have said it before and been shouted down. Shanahan wanted Reid “long term” and said so publicly but there were “business considerations” (in November 2017 in a press conference). Then in 2018 when he was not signed he made up a story about not having enough slots. This was a decision made by Paraag and his analytics not a football decision and we are now seeing the results. Kyle and Lynch make the roster – except when they don’t. Paraag is Denises’ man in the building to protect cash flow… and that trumps football.

          1. I’m with you regarding upper management being the burr in the saddle. Not sure if securing Reid was part of that equation but I could certainly see your point

            To me the end result is what matters. Not having Reid this year has certainly hurt.

        2. Reid would not have changed the issues the secondary is having. He was criticized repeatedly last year and nobody in here was banging the table to keep him after last season. The Niners offered him a one year deal to come back as a backup and he declined. No smoking gun; just not a lot of interest in bringing him back.

            1. Sebs-

              When are you going to produce Kaps stats for his last 3 yrs, and present an argument with some backing? Instead of telling us he’s just as good as Montana? Or, loudly, “He’s better than Joe!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!”

              We all know precisely what you think.

          1. As usual Rocket, I’m missing the point. Kyle wanted him but most on this board didn’t so that’s OK. It’s like I’ve said, the 49ers personnel is a horse designed by a committee…or commonly known as a camel. You’ve had much of the same business experience I have. Every hear the saying: “When everyone is thinking the same thing it means no one is thinking”

            1. WC,

              That is a good saying and applies perfectly to most things in life, not just business. An Echo Chamber rarely accomplishes anything other than inflating egos.

              You are very self deprecating and I’m not sure why. I don’t think I’ve ever written anything suggesting I think you are uneducated on the topics we discuss or that you don’t have any good ideas. I do disagree with you sometimes but that is par for the course here with so many different opinions. My disagreement with you in this case stems from the fact nothing that was said or done in FA suggests Marathe or York have stopped Lynch and Shanahan from doing anything. They spent a lot of money on Garoppolo and McKinnon and Shanahan is on record saying Reid would be welcomed back as a backup. I don’t see the link between that and ownership not letting them sign Reid to an extension. To me it’s a simple case of Reid not playing well enough to warrant a big extension and the fact they had young players they liked ahead of him. It would be nice to have Reid right now due to attrition, but it’s not like he would have had a huge impact on the fortunes of the defense. He was replaced last season at one point remember?

              1. I didn’t bring up Reid for the same reasons I haven’t brought up Jimmy Ward. I pick my battles. I thought that EReid is a pretty good safety and have argued as much in the past.

                To me the fact that they passed on him underscores how they have mismanaged personnel. Reid is a savvy veteran and would have helped solidify the Defensive backfield.

                I believe that this new regime wanted to clean house from the very beginning and remake the team in their image rather than build the team with some pieces they already had.

                This way they could receive all the praise but I think that was their first mistake and one on which they haven’t improved upon.

    2. Thats just it-they’re NOT teaching in the secondary.

      1) No one consistently knows where they should be………..

      2) No one’s improving.

      Thats coaching.

  13. Nice assessment East, both before and after the game. I had it 27-6, so the offense was better than I thought it would be and thats a plus considering they are playing with second and third stringers. Unfortunately, in my parlay I took the under (45.5). Wrong!! You are correct that there will be reshuffling with the second tier coaches and a lot of player changes. Nice analysis and it’s nice to see you don’t blame the entire game on the coaching like some. :)

    1. Thanks Juan! I had a suspicion that Seattle would use this game to let the league know they are for real!

      Now that we are eliminated from post season contention, perhaps we can start to look at ways of addressing the team’s shortcomings.

      BTW, I don’t blame the coaches solely but I do hold them responsible for the outcomes. As you mentioned you teach fundamentals all the time (that is about 80% of coaching) but some coaches have more success than others for a variety of reasons (different techniques in learning fundamentals, differing game day philosophies, etc.)

      I don’t have experience with coaching softball but have coached soccer and I can tell you when players didn’t execute what I asked, they were sure to be pulled from the game or have some kind of tedious task to do in practice to help them remember the lesson come game time.

      You are correct in your assessment that good players execute better than the poor ones, and it is the coaches responsibility to help the players mask their shortcomings while exploiting their virtues!

      The 49er coaches seem incapable or just do not execute those parts of their responsibilities! I think many are still too young and are still learning their craft! And that was a mistake of management to put so much inexperience on the team.

      Not much to do now but suffer through the period and hope it all turns out ok, I’m afraid. The one thing that can be done is minor reshuffling.

  14. Cubus, with all due respect, do you think there is a defensive back in the entire league that isn’t taught to turn their head around when defensing a pass? Come on! Of course they are. That’s what separates good to great players from not so good to lousy players. In any sport. The ability to take what you learn in practice, day in and day out, and execute what you have been taught in the game. Your talking about one of the main fundamentals the defensive backfield players need to execute. As an example, in softball, a sport I coached for decades, I’ve had outfield players that I have taught to always take your first steps back when fielding a fly ball, or infield players who I teach to always pick up a dead ball with your bare hand, not your glove hand. They do it all day in practice. In the games? The good players, yes. The not so good, even though they executed those particular plays fairly well in practice, no!! They run in first at the crack of the bat and the ball goes over their head, or they field a dead ball from a bunt and try to pick it up with their glove hand and fumble it. Just because players are making mistakes doesn’t mean they are not being coached correctly, or not at all!! Does that excuse all coaches? No, not at all, but basic fundamentals at the professional level? They’re being taught. Trust me!! All day, every day. They just aren’t executing in the pressure of the game what they are being taught. IMHO

    1. No, no, I SWEAR they are taught to let the ball bounce off his helmet. If it bounces off his helmet, it will be hard to catch.!!!!

    2. Just like they’re taught to tackle, hmm. I’m sick and tired of watching this pathetic defense game in and game out.
      Saleh be gone.

  15. When did I see the Niners give up? Right after the second half kick off, and the Penny TD. It took 16 seconds to score that put them up by 24 points. The Niners, coaches included, had a bludgeoned look on their faces.
    .
    The Niners showed no sense of urgency. Instead of quick snaps, they let the play clock run down to almost zero.
    .
    Sure, they still tried, but I saw no fire in their eyes or a spring to their step. The beat down was on, and they were professional enough to give strong effort, but the whole team was resigned to losing.
    .
    Richard Sherman declaring that they were not complacent just reminded me of the Black Knight declaring- ‘Tis but a scratch!!!!’

  16. Watching Malcolm Smith getting burned by Lockett in that Cover 3 beater over route, I wonder whether Niners would have played big nickel if they had healthy safeties.

  17. Not what I saw. What I saw was a team of second and third stringers playing their arses off against a probable NFL playoff team. There was no quit out there today. Not even a smidgeon. I have no idea what game you were watching today Seb. As far a Kyle, I don’t blame him for telling the official F**k You!! Not only did they get the non fumble wrong, then they let the player advance the ball 10 yards to the 15 when he was laying on top of the supposed fumbler with the ball, there by being touched and down. Ball should have been on the five. That’s after the non OPI call on the touchdown pass. Kudos to Kyle. The fact that he has kept this team fighting the way they are considering the amount of devastating injuries they have incurred makes me admire him even more. He should be a nominee for Coach of the Year.

    1. Did you notice that not long after Kyle let it fly with the ref Pete Carroll got into it and used the F word. No flag though. It almost looked like Carroll was testing them. I think the NFL has a continuing problem with the refs. Did you see the picture of the Cowboy who was down two yards from the 1st down marker and it was ruled a 1st down. Saints had no challenge so a very bad call stood. The refs are too thin skinned if they cant take some heat from the coaches. Sticks and stones and all that…as long as they keep their hands off each other, everything else should be fair game.

  18. OK, this is getting tougher each week, but positives IMO:

    1. Pettis. Runs good routes and excellent in open space. Bonehead play not reaching for the first down, but that was the MO today for the whole team.
    2. Wilson. Already discussed.
    3. Mullens. 400+ yards on Seattle’s field. I can see him filing in as a starter somewhere if he doesn’t stay on this roster.
    4. OK, I gotta reach now to even find a fourth. And it won’t be on defense. No major injuries and one loss closer to that first pick.

  19. While the 49ers played poorly and finally threw up their hands in the 4th quarter, I’m not going to give Kyle an F grade.
    The reason I won’t, is because this is the best the offense has looked in Seattle since about 2011, and it was done with scrap heap players.

    The Fumble and Red zone Int were on the players. One of them at least caused a 10 point swing.

    That said, Saleh has to go at this point. And the next DC should be a voice of reason, an older more experienced guy. Someone that Kyle can ask scenario questions too and he can answer from experience.

    As to the defensive personnel, who cares! We don’t have the personnel to run any scheme, and the few good players we have should be able to play in any scheme the new coach wants ( Buckner and Warner).

    1. “this is the best the offense has looked in Seattle since about 2011”

      This isn’t the same Seattle team from back then.

      1. I didn’t say it was Jack.
        I would however argue however that the talent differential in this game between the two teams in questions, was higher than at any other point in that time frame.

        1. There is little to no difference between the 2017 team and the one we saw yesterday on the offense. The Seattle D has been allowing 7.5 yards per play the previous 3 weeks.

          1. There is little to no difference?

            No Goodwin, Garcon, Hyde, and basically no Brieda, a practice squad player from last year is manning the helm.
            Compared to last year almost every skill position player was a backup or playing injured, but no the team that played yesterday was identical to last year… they were wearing 49er uniforms after all.

            1. “No Goodwin, Garcon, Hyde, and basically no Brieda, a practice squad player from last year is manning the helm.”

              Goodwin and Garçon are below average WR’s who aren’t missed.

              Hyde’s production has been replaced all year long.

              The level of play at QB is about the same between Hoyer, Beathard and Mullens.

              1. “The level of play at QB is about the same between Hoyer, Beathard and Mullens”

                And as a result, 3 wins. Cannot win in this league without a QB.

              2. Goodwin and Garçon are below average WR’s who aren’t missed.

                Goodwin is greatly missed and put up some very good numbers with Garoppolo. Garcon hasn’t been healthy for a good part of this year so hard to miss what you haven’t had much to begin with.

              3. sebnynah says:
                November 28, 2018 at 7:43 pm
                Grant, by calling me a legend, elevates my status,

                Does the PD give out blue ribbons for those that improve their STATUS?

              4. “Garcon hasn’t been healthy for a good part of this year so hard to miss what you haven’t had much to begin with.”

                Thanks for making my point. Garçon has played a higher percentage of offensive snaps this year than Goodwin.

                “Goodwin is greatly missed and put up some very good numbers with Garoppolo.”

                Yeah it was a nice 5 game stretch. Problem for Goodwin in his career has been his inability to stay on the field.

              5. Prime, glad you admit that the Niners need to upgrade their QBs.
                .
                I am also glad you admitted that Kaep took the league by storm.
                .
                It is interesting to note that the NFL likes women beaters, but hates First Amendment protesters. Another profile in courage.

              6. Jack,

                Even when he’s played Garcon hasn’t been 100% going back to his neck injury. Hasn’t looked like the same guy at any point this season.

                Goodwin has had injury problems in the past but the current issue isn’t injury related from what I’ve read. He seems to have some personal problems in his life they are letting him deal with. Whatever the case, he makes the offense a lot better when he’s on the field and is greatly missed.

              7. Goodwin missed a lot of time early in the year due to an injury in the Minnesota game.

                “he makes the offense a lot better when he’s on the field and is greatly missed.”

                No he’s not. Pettis has made up for his absence.

                Their yards per reception is almost identical. Pettis has a higher catch percentage and just as many touchdowns despite playing 51 fewer snaps.

              8. sebnynah says:
                November 28, 2018 at 7:43 pm
                Grant, by calling me a legend, elevates my status

                Seb are you able to find a status guru to help elevate your status on the blog?

              9. Pettis wasn’t even a factor until the past two games. He made some plays yesterday which is great to see but the offense would be a hell of a lot more dangerous with both Goodwin and Pettis available to play.

              10. “Pettis wasn’t even a factor until the past two games.”

                Pettis had over 60 yards and a TD in the opener. He also has 35 yards or more 4 times this year. Goodwin has 3 such games.

                “He made some plays yesterday which is great to see but the offense would be a hell of a lot more dangerous with both Goodwin and Pettis available to play.”

                They pretty much play the same position and fill the same role.

                Garçon and Goodwin should both be sent packing in the offseason.

              11. Pettis had a grand total of 7 catches for 108 yards and a TD before the last two games. He was a non factor. They finally got him and Goodwin on the field together against the Giants and that will be the goal moving forward. I agree that Garcon is likely gone, but Goodwin will be here and should be as long as his head is in it.

              12. “Pettis had a grand total of 7 catches for 108 yards and a TD before the last two games. He was a non factor.”

                He was also hurt which limited his playing time. As for the last two games, take a look at Goodwin.

                He’s very hot or miss. Pettis’ last 2 games are better than any back to back games for Goodwin this season.

                “They finally got him and Goodwin on the field together against the Giants”

                And he was limited to a role of catching WR screen passes.

              13. He was also hurt which limited his playing time. As for the last two games, take a look at Goodwin.

                Yes Pettis has had a problem staying healthy which is your main complaint against Goodwin. They both need to stay on the field.

                He’s very hot or miss. Pettis’ last 2 games are better than any back to back games for Goodwin this season.

                Sure and last season Goodwin had multiple 100 yard games and a 3 game stretch with 2 100+ performances and a 99 yard. This season has been a struggle for everybody.

                And he was limited to a role of catching WR screen passes.

                He was targeted for more than that. The object should be to get Goodwin and Pettis on the field together, not dump Goodwin. Pettis can play any spot and Goodwin is the best big play guy they have along with being able to run the entire route tree now.

              14. “Garçon and Goodwin should both be sent packing in the offseason.”

                Agree on Garcon, but not Goodwin.

                “Problem for Goodwin in his career has been his inability to stay on the field.”

                You could say the same thing about Vance McDonald who has yet to play all 16 games in a season.

              15. I don’t have a problem with Goodwin. Go back to the start of the thread. My point is, now that Pettis is healthy they don’t miss him because Pettis is just as good, and the numbers back that up.

              16. Speed kills and there’s nothing wrong with two killers, even though Goodwin has the olympic lethality.

              17. I brought up Vance because I thought you were a depth guy. Depth at X is a good thing. And Pettis can play Z and in the slot. I agree with rocket, the goal should be getting Pettis and Goodwin on the field at the same time.

              18. I don’t have a problem with Goodwin. Go back to the start of the thread. My point is, now that Pettis is healthy they don’t miss him because Pettis is just as good, and the numbers back that up.

                You have Pettis making Goodwin expendable based on a small body of work which doesn’t make a lot of sense, especially considering they don’t have much quality depth at the position to begin with. They do miss Goodwin because If he’s on the field with Pettis they are a much more dangerous offense.

              19. “They do miss Goodwin because If he’s on the field with Pettis they are a much more dangerous offense.”

                They are? Show me what you have to back that up other than the Giants game where they combined for 81 yards on 8 catches.

              20. It gets their two most athletic WR’s on the field Jack. They signed Goodwin to an extension in March and drafted Pettis in April. In what universe does that suggest they want to replace Goodwin with Pettis?

              21. “It gets their two most athletic WR’s on the field Jack.”

                And in the one game they managed to do that they combined for just over 10 yards per catch. Show me how together the offense is much more dangerous.

                “They signed Goodwin to an extension in March and drafted Pettis in April. In what universe does that suggest they want to replace Goodwin with Pettis?”

                An extension that has almost no dead cap money after this year. It’s pretty minimal.

                I also didn’t say that’s what they’re thinking. It’s what I think they should do unless Goodwin will backup Pettis.

              22. Rocket:

                I agree with you on most of what you said. But when you consider what happened to Kilgore, I’m not sure that signing Goodwin to an extension means that much. Maybe Goodwin/Pettis was a combination they very much wanted for 2018, but this offseason could easily see Goodwin traded.

                On Wikipedia:

                “On February 14, 2018, the 49ers signed Kilgore to a three-year contract extension for $12 million with $7 million guaranteed, keeping him under contract through the 2020 season…….On March 15, 2018, the 49ers traded Kilgore and their seventh-round pick in the 2018 NFL Draft, number 237 overall, to the Miami Dolphins for a seventh-round pick, number 233 overall.?

              23. And in the one game they managed to do that they combined for just over 10 yards per catch. Show me how together the offense is much more dangerous.

                It isn’t just about what their personal numbers are. Having them both in there opens things up for others as well. As far as how it will work going forward, I think it might be prudent to let it play out instead of forming a conclusion based on one game.

                An extension that has almost no dead cap money after this year. It’s pretty minimal.
                I also didn’t say that’s what they’re thinking. It’s what I think they should do unless Goodwin will backup Pettis.

                Goodwin being a backup makes no sense. What’s your plan after dumping Goodwin?

              24. Cubus,

                Anything is possible, but in this case they would not only be getting rid of their most explosive offensive player and highest producing receiver last season, but they would be reducing the depth at a position that already lacks it.

              25. “It isn’t just about what their personal numbers are. Having them both in there opens things up for others as well.”

                They gained an extra 13 passing yards above their season average in the Giants game.

                Pettis and Goodwin essentially cancel each other out. If they end up proving me wrong so be it.

              26. Interesting that you think they are not missed.
                Even discounting the qb, if healthy all of those players would have either started or had significant playing time yesterday.
                Why, because they were all better than the players the 49ers fielded yesterday.

              27. I have to agree with Rocket.

                1 game is simply not a large enough sample size to make intelligent decisions.
                There are to many variables that can create outliers.

              28. “because they were all better than the players the 49ers fielded yesterday.”

                Garçon and Goodwin are only better players because of their reputation, not their actual productivity.

              29. “because they were all better than the players the 49ers fielded yesterday.”

                Garçon and Goodwin are only better players because of their reputation, not their actual productivity.

                If say so… I mean Goodwin does have that one game, where he was more productive than Goodwin.

  20. Sure, they were playing hard, like all professionals should do, but they lost by 4 TDs.
    .
    If it was a 2 point nail biter, I could see your point.
    .
    KS did not cover himself in glory. Cussing out an official just showed he lost his cool. He was out of control. Out of control HCs do not think clearly, and he personally hurt the team. Some one should yell at KS.
    .
    ‘He has kept this team fighting the way they are’. – This is not a team that lost by 2 points the last 2 games. This is a team that has gotten blown out twice in a row. Yes, injuries are a convenient excuse, but they should at least be competitive. The game was over before the end of the first half. It was doubly over 16 seconds into the second half. They put a nail in the coffin with that 98 yard pick six.
    .
    Juan, you are trying to make a silk purse out of a sow’s ear. Nice try, but it still is a pig’s ear.

    1. Sebs-

      Those Refs SHOULD get cussed out when they call a game like that. Im glad Kyle did it!

      Same in the NBA–horrible officiating. And Walsh used to complain about it all the time! Wanna bet on that???

      You know all this–why play these silly games?

      1. KS just gave the Seahawks 15 free yards. The point is to make it as hard as possible for them to score.
        .
        Did Bill Walsh ever get a 15 yard penalty? I thought he was too smart for that.

  21. Not great company:

    Josh Dubow tweet:
    “Coaches since merger to start 2-10 or worse in their first 2 seasons with a team:
    Kyle Shanahan, 2017-18 49ers
    Hue Jackson, 2016-17 Browns, fired in 2018
    Jim Schwartz, 2009-10 Lions
    Leeman Bennett, 1985-86 Bucs, fired after ’86 season
    John McKay, 1976-77 Bucs”

    1. and McCarthy will be the first HC hired for next season. If I ran the Browns (their GM came from GB) I would hire McCarthy now as a consultant. It would give him a head start on familiarizing himself with the players and the organization. He can take over as HC in 2019. Unless he decides to take some time off, which would be understandable.

      1. Actually, I think the odd on favorite for the Browns job is Lincoln Riley, especially if he does well in the college playoffs.
        .
        Riley coached Baker Mayfield at Oklahoma, so they might be reunited.
        .
        Browns may not want a possible contentious HC/QB dynamic.
        .
        McCarthy may be in the running for a NY head coaching job.

  22. I see the outcome of the game as a glass half full. Nick Mullins an UDFA QB throws for over 400 yards and RB Jeff Wilson who got the call to start not long before the game starts has a 61 yard rushing and 73 yards receiving performance and Dante Pettis has 129 yards receiving. If a third string QB can light up the Seahawks for 414 yards, then we can have some assurance of better depth at the QB position next season so that if the unthinkable would occur again the offense won’t run into the ditch. Time for the defense to get some better help.

  23. Does anyone get the feeling that Kyle Shanahan isn’t very good at half time adjustments?

    I said at half time with the group of 49er fans I watch the game with: “Well, don’t worry, Kyle will make the necessary halftime adjustment! We got this game in the bag!” Everyone laughed, but I think that the general consensus is that halftime adjustments aren’t in his wheelhouse.

    1. Can’t say.
      An emotionally charged team often can come out strong against a team that Physically overmatches them. But the adrenaline can’t get them to play that well over the course of a game, and later on the physically stronger more skilled team, wins.
      It’s tough to stay in any game when the other team is better at every single position group and by a large margin. Qb, wr, rb, oline, dline, lb, cb, safety. Who do you protect when you have to protect everyone? Who should they attack when their worst groups are better than your best group? It’s almost an unheard of scenario but it’s the one they faced yesterday.

    2. EC,

      I don’t see an issue with half time adjustments. The first play of the second half was an 80+ yard kickoff return which led to them being down by 24 points less than a minute into the second half. Doesn’t really matter what adjustments you make if you make mistakes like that.

      1. Well, had a longer response but it went to cloud heaven. So I appreciate your thoughts, always do. Think some of the old regulars bring a lot to every discussion. Wish there was more of that.

        However, I was speaking of general trends not one game and was reaching out to spark discussion.

  24. Kyle Shanahan is safe, but saying FU to the ref on camera is the kind of stuff that gets you on the hot seat. 2 wins, back to back bad lossees. and you’re throwing a tantrum. Sure we got screwed on the fumble, but Kyle could have just yelled ‘f**k’ in frustration, instead he made it personal by adding ‘you’, essentially begging to get flagged, thereby essentially begging to hurt the team. What Kyle did today was unprofessional and pathetic.

    1. Yup it’s the you that got him the penalty. However, for once I thought he had reasonable cause to be angry with the refs.
      The long TD had a pretty big pushoff by the wr that gave him a good couple yards of separation the LB was actually there prior to that, however Witherspoon gets a ticky tack call. (*note* this is more of an indictment on the league, and their favoritism both to offensive players and established players.) It always amazes me how once a player gets a rep things almost always go for or against them and this is not a favoritism complaint.
      The Wilson fumble was also a head scratcher, but I just expect questionable calls to go to them up there, see Bowman fumble, Green Bay Hail Mary.

      But the reality is I don’t mind him getting heated here. At this point the team was starting to collapse and needed a spark of any kind, they were in desperation mode.

      1. “At this point the team was starting to collapse and needed a spark of any kind, they were in desperation mode.”

        I get that, but he hurt the team. This isn’t like MLB where there is no penalty or the NBA where it’s a minimal penalty (technical free throw). Kyle also risks getting an anti-ref reputation that could lead to more bad calls against us. I think Harbaugh had calls go against him because of his reputation.

        1. I guess thats where we differ.
          I don’t think that penaly hurt that badly.
          And in terms of calls going against the team, they already are… bad teams don’t get the benefit of the doubt.

          That said, I can see your point. I guess we just think differently in regards to it hurting the team in the future or not and that’s fair enough.

            1. KS hurt the team. I thought he would do anything to protect the team.
              .
              The team needed a level headed HC who could provide leadership by staying in control.
              .
              Of course, then again, he used his time outs to help the Seahawks, so maybe he is a nice guy.

    2. We don’t know what the ref said to him. Kyle’s statement was a result of what the ref said to him. There’s such a thing as fighting words. Kyle knows the protocol and something was said to him that made him add the ‘you’. Since I doubt that the ref said “How’s the wife and kids” the professionalism of the ref should be an issue too.

      1. Yeah, agree with this. Refs can get caught up in the heat of the moment too. They are humans just like coaches. Shanahan deserved the penalty for sure but the refs actions should also draw some scrutiny.

        Worst thing I’ve ever personally witnessed related to refs. I was on the sideline for a TX High School 5A football playoff game about 5 years ago. I had a couple friends who were coaching and I’m close friends with the orthopedic guy who attends all the games so I was standing on the sideline with him. My friends team’s head coach had been going at this side judge the entire game. Really giving him a hard time. Honestly, the ref deserved it. He missed so many calls and made so many bad calls it was outrageous. My feeling was his horrible calls effected both teams but obviously our head coach didn’t see it that way. The head official finally tells our coach to cool it down in the 4th quarter and he does tone it down. 3 minutes left in the game and our team hits a 60 yard TD pass to go up 23-20. The side judge waits until after the completion of the play and throws his flag to call sideline interference. I was on the sideline with the play going away from me. There was not a player or coach within a yard of the sideline. The side judges path was not impeded even slightly. It was an obvious FU to our head coach. The head coach is yelling at the head official about the call and I’m watching the side judge walk up the field looking our coach in the eye and just smiling. It was truly despicable. Our team went on to win the game so it ended ok for our team. But officials are people too. They don’t like getting yelled at.

    3. I was actually good with Shanahan’ outburst because it showed his passion and expectations for the officials to call a fair game.
      Sure, it wasn’t very professional on a head coach level but I’m sure that the players didn’t mind seeing their head coach showing some fight.

      Shanahan’ action goes against Grant’s opinion that the team “quit on him.”
      I did not see a glimmer of quit from this team and to make that assertion is based on a personal opinion.
      Players won’t quit if they know their coach won’t.

      Another reason why players won’t quit is because they could be playing for a job next season.

        1. I haven’t looked at him yet, but if he’s as good as Smith was prior to blowing out his knee then I will like him!

          1. “Devin White was a high school standout at running back and linebacker, so he brings an understanding of offenses to his spot at linebacker,” Miller wrote. “He flows to the ball with natural athleticism and agility but also packs a punch with a 6’1” 240-pound frame.”

            1. CFC,
              D. White’ high school highlights look very much like D. J. Williams when he played at De La Salle (Concord CA.).
              I got to see D. J. play against So. Cal powerhouse Mater Dei when they played each other at UOP in Stockton.

              D. J. was a man among boy’s and dominated as RB and LB.
              Devin White will earn his keep as an ILB. But his 6’1 height may be a detriment in coverage in the pros.
              But the kid is a wrecking ball who will cause turnovers.

        2. He’s a good player but I’m not sure he’s even the best LB who will be in the draft. No way they will take a LB with the first pick regardless imo.

          1. I don’t see anyone else close to him in this class. He’s an elite prospect.

            They had no business taking a DT in 2017 but that didn’t stop them. I haven’t seen anything from this front office that suggests they wouldn’t take a LB first.

            1. Josh Allen and Mack Wilson will be in the conversation. You could be right and it would be a mistake – unless they took Allen due to his pass rushing ability – because they have much greater needs than another ILB and a lot of options to choose from.

              1. This will be the easiest pick they’ve ever made if they follow the three B’s. Bosa, Bosa, Bosa!

              2. Sure listen to the guy that thought Solomon Thomas was going to have 10 sacks in his first season. At this rate he’ll have no problem hitting that number sometime in his third year.

              3. Not sure why I have to keep addressing this fake news. I expect better from you, CFC. Maybe I need to remind the viewers of your Michael Turner prediction in the NFC Championship game.

                Razoreater says:
                May 10, 2017 at 12:11 pm
                What do you expect from the fool on the pill? Try more like 6 sacks, with tackles for loss in the running game. Pressures and disruption that assist his team mates in making plays. That’s what I’m expecting from King Solomon in his first NFL campaign….

              4. My interest in Bosa is not based on Razor’s assessment of him. We agree on the player because it makes the most sense based on BPA lining up with the teams biggest need.

              5. Help? Not really, but it does factualize it instead of sensationalization. Btw, the same ones that chose Thomas will be making the draft decisions in 2019. In the spirit of full disclosure, I did not participate in the decision that went into selecting Thomas….🤣

              6. You said the guy would get 6 sacks his rookie season. He’ll be lucky to get 6 in his first 2 seasons combined.

                Gee I thought you were in the draft room. Doh!!!

                As for this conversation, it’s pretty clear who has had more correct draft hits. It ain’t you.

              7. Yea, but at least I got the picks right. You, not so much.

                Armstead, Buckner and Thomas. Not bad for a hack.

              8. Yeah, there’s a reason I don’t comment a lot on players in the draft. It’s called knowing what I don’t know.

        3. Cfc,
          That’s a good comparison. My only concern with DW is that he looks to make the big hit. That could either by a curse or a blessing.
          Curse – personal foul penalties
          Blessing – creating turn overs.
          Who am I kidding, I’ll take the blessing!

          1. Cfc,
            Thomas has been underwhelming, but I’m giving him one more year before throwing in the towel.

            At what number would you pick DW?
            If we lose out on the Bosa sweepstakes I would like to trade back and find our EDGE later in the 1st rd and possibly get another second rd pick with the same trade back.
            Players like Burns, Polite, Sweat could still be available later in the 1st and we can look to shore up the LB and WR positions with our two 2nd rd picks.

            1. I’d take Quinnen Williams in the first two slots and then try like stink to trade Solomon Thomas. I’d take Devin starting at #3.

              I’d love to trade back also but I don’t want to get to the point where I’m just accepting that as what will happen if so and so has already been taken. Trades are so hard to predict.

              Until draft day arrives I’m going to project players that I expect to be at the spot we’re given at the end of the season.

              With all of that said. My ideal draft at this point is to trade back to around #7 where I would draft DeAndre Baker. As far as an edge player, I like Chase Winovich in the second round.

              Given that we’re likely drafting in the top 3, I’d prefer it to be either Williams or White.

              1. CFC,
                Q. Williams is a force in the interior.
                Heck, if we can’t find an EDGE that can get to the QB, we can find a dominating interior DLman that can chase the QB to the Edge.

  25. In regards to Mike McCarthy. I hope he gets rehired somewhere, as he will make some program worse. He has had the consensus best qb in the NFL for a long time… and has struggled to even make the playoffs (or even win a game when Rodgers was out.)

    1. NFL offense has passed Mike McCarthy by….
      Packers did themselves a favor in firing him early and getting a jump start on the HC hiring process.

  26. If this team had players in place for this scheme I would be against changing it. But they don’t. There is one good player, Buckner. The rest range from replaceable to trash. Niners need to get the best DC they can, regardless of scheme. Because this D is a dumpster fire.

  27. A few takeaways from this game:

    Did Solomon Thomas play? I didn’t notice.
    Saleh is a good coach in a bad situation. Unfortunately, he has to pay the price. Needs to be fired.
    49ers defense is pretty good against the run. Terrible pass rush and and even worse secondary. Bill Belichick couldn’t win with this personnel.
    O-line has promise. They really aren’t terrible. Immediate need is another guard and then a center – in that order.
    Dante Pettis is a player. Trent Taylor is a good slot receiver but the QB’s timing with him is critical. Taylor can get open on quick routes but he doesn’t have the longer speed to stay open. QB’s need to hit Taylor right out of his initial cut and then he can be super effective. Richie James could develop into a nice player. Kittle is a great TE and could develop into a mini Kelce. In 2 years Lynch/Shanahan have acquired three times the number and quality of NFL receivers than in 8 years of Baalke.
    Shanahan has done a phenomenal job with Mullens. He deserves a ton of credit for getting the maximum amount out of a guy with limited physical skills. The play designs and the play calls for Mullens are outstanding.
    Shanahan needs to cool it with the refs. The fumble on Wilson was an atrocious call. The PI in the end zone on Witherspoon was an atrocious call. Shanahan can’t turn into a mini Harbaugh and develop a confrontational relationship with refs or he will never get any calls. Tone the anger down even when the refs are God awful. His complaints don’t help him this year. Complain to the refs with next year in mind.

  28. Their needs are a three year project.

    They need 4 cover corners to play in the new NFL.

    They need a thumper of an inside linebacker.

    They need a competent edge rusher.

    They need a competent receiving corp that actually gets on the field every week.

    Sadly, these are some of the most difficult slots to fill and will require three years of great drafts to make it happen.

    This team was always a 5 year reclamation project and although Jimmy’s fools gold was a nice development, no one guy could have possibly solved this mess.

  29. The notion that the 49ers are losing football games due to injuries has no legs (excuse the pun) ….. In the AFC New England, Pittsburgh, Houston and Kansas City are division leaders. NE with 14 on IR, Pitt, 8, Hou, 6 and KC, 13.. In the NFC, Dallas, Chicago, New Orleans and the Rams all lead, Dallas with 11 on IR, NO 12 Chicago, 4 and Rams, 7.

    The 49ers with 10 players on IR… So 4 of the 8 division leaders with more players on IR than SF… It is not the number of injuries that defines the team’s ability to win but the coaching and the talent acquired through draft and Free Agency that defines their ability to win..

    10 teams in the NFL with more players on IR and all with better W/L records. 14 with equal to or more players on IR with better records… Almost half the teams in the league. Another 6 teams with 8 or more players on IR with better records than SF.

    So 20 of the 32 teams in the NFL with 2 less players on IR or more with better records than the 49ers.. It’s obvious that talent acquisition and coaching drive success or failure in the NFL..

    Key injuries can play a role but does anyone think that if Jimmy G was on the field it would have had a significant role in the outcome based on what we saw prior to his injury this season?

    1. How many of those 20 teams are in year 2 with their GM and coach? How many of those teams have their starting QB and starting RB on IR? How many of those teams have had their top 2 WR’s miss significant time? Lynch and Shanahan had the lowest starting point of any of these 20 teams in terms of roster talent when they took over. It’s a rebuild. Give it time.

      1. You guys are funny….I began the season calling for trading Thomas, Ward, and Celek, as well as a couple of others…Now, I’m no expert (I.E. Seb…), but other than showing up for meals, and changing bandages, what have these ‘stalwarts’ done to deserve to start ahead of more deserving team-mates ?Trade ’em, sell ’em, cut ’em, ….

        1. Wow, you just called me an expert? No, I am just a die hard faithful Niner fan, who wants this team to win multiple more rings. Grant is the expert, not me.
          .
          Glad you embrace my strategy to trade away players to get more draft picks. Maybe they should bundle players to facilitate the deal.
          .
          However, they should trade them away, and get something for them, rather than cutting them, and getting nothing for them. Foster is a good example.

    2. I think the niners have 4 more wins with Jimmy.
      2 against AZ, 1 against NY, and 1 against either SD or GB. The teams talent level would have still shown in several losses but they would have been much closer to where they were expected to be.

      1. I’d agree with you except for one thing…

        Who’s he throwing the ball to?

        Their one and two can’t get on the field, their three and four are both learning on the job.

        You can’t throw Kittle every ball.

    3. It’s not the number of players on IR don. It’s the fact that they lost so many key players. None of the teams you mentioned lost their QB which pretty much ends the discussion.

      1. I think the bigger point is that while the team has had plenty of injuries, and it has impacted their play, injuries alone do not account for the woeful record.

        I think that I projected 6 wins with all cylinders firing and 8 if they really blew the top off. My low was 4 wins. I didn’t fall for the hype regarding all the players being marked as rookies of the year or possible all pros. I also didn’t believe we had the key players to make a real splash. The team was/is dangerously thin in many key areas and not strong in some very important ones.

        I do think, however, that injuries have had the most negative impact on the defense as they haven’t been able to get any cohesion in the unit. That and no pass rusher which is the biggest head scratcher of all.

    4. Don,
      So, if a team (49ers) who was already alarmingly bereft of talent going into the 2017 season loses their top two players it should not make a difference?
      It takes talent in every phase of a team to win. Heck, even future HOF QB Aaron Rogers can’t win without being surrounded with talent.

      Many of our players and head coach are young and growing. It’s been a tough season for all no doubt, but I’m starting to see a nice little harvest of our young players that will become the foundation for years to come.
      I said at the beginning of the season that this year would be all about development and patience.
      It still is.

  30. Shanny’s remark to the officials had no bearing on the loss. I have no problem with the words uttered, the officials needed to hear it, the league needed to hear it, the team needed to hear it and most of us fans needed to hear it. Its basically words uttered when enough becomes enough.

    1. I agree. He was frustrated as everybody is at this point and it probably had a positive effect on the players seeing him fighting for them.

    2. Yup it’s like the NBA coach getting double T’ed. It may not help in a already lost cause, but it sends a message. Especially to the team, I have your back.

    3. I actually thought it was a good thing. Shows fire and that can help inspire a team that is lagging in energy!

      I have to confess, I was hoping Shanahan would get tossed after punching Pete Carroll square in the mouth too! But that was an evil fantasy!

  31. John Brown is on a one-year-deal with Baltimore. He’s a more reliable version of Goodwin.

    Sign him and let Marquise sort his life out.

  32. Yeah, yeah yeah, the Niners played hard, from whistle to whistle, and they are professionals, who take losing in stride.
    .
    However, after getting blown out twice, they need to change. It is not that they lost, it is how they lost.
    .
    The Niners were shaped, and the coaches did not counter the stacked box. The Seahawks stacked the box, and dared the Niners to pass. KS obliged by passing twice as much as running. KS ran bunched sets.
    .
    I stated before the game that the Seahawks would keep everything in front of them, force the Niners to make sustained drives and expect the Niners to make mistakes. The Niners obliged by beating themselves. If a casual fan on a blog site can detail exactly what was going to happen, and outlined the strategies needed to win, how come the Niners cannot think and understand about the same things?
    .
    The Niners were unprepared, out maneuvered, shaped, undisciplined, uncontrolled and deserved to lose. The Seahawks were thoroughly prepared, employed the right strategies, shaped the Niners, played with discipline and in control, and deserved to win. KS thinks spewing expletives makes him look smart. He did the opposite. KS even helped the Seahawks score a TD twice. First, by using time outs that helped the Seahawks at the end of the first half, then by giving them 15 free yards. Did his histrionics fire up the team? Not that I could see. They had that hang dog look by that time. It was embarrassing.
    .
    The Niners need to learn from their mistakes, or just expect a repeat of the outcome. KS seems incapable of making an adjustment. He holds onto his scheme, but it has resulted in a 2-10 team. KS should throw his scheme in the trash and start all over. Saleh is trying to emulate the Seahawk defense, but does not have the right players to make it work. Saleh needs to throw out his scheme, and start all over. He needs to utilize his players correctly, and put them into positions to succeed. He needs to accentuate their skillsets, and disguise their weaknesses.It was embarrassing to see the Seahawks score after only 16 seconds in the second half.
    .
    Did I see any exotic blitzes? Buckner is 6’7″. Armstead is 6′ 8″. Wilson is 5′ 11″. Did I see a hand in the air? Wilson casually eluded the pass rush and sliced and diced the secondary. RW rolled out at will. Saleh had a LB covering Tyler Lockett. That sure was a genius move.Receivers were running uncovered, and posters want to blame only the players. Saleh owns that.
    .
    Hopefully the Niners will learn from this debacle. Sherman should be effusive with praise, so he does not provide any locker room board motivation. If he had provided any more motivation, the Seahawks may have run up the score. In the end, Pete Carroll took pity on the Niners, and took his foot off the accelerator. Sure, the truth hurts, but I am not going to sugar coat the situation.
    .
    Change is needed. JL should call up Grant and give him an opportunity to interview him. Who knows, maybe his job will depend on seeing JL man up and accept some blame. Being petty, and hiding from the media is doing JL no favors, and doing puff pieces just make him look clueless.
    .
    KS needs to swallow his ego, and admit he needs help. He should have hired an OC yesterday.
    .
    Saleh needs to junk the Pete Carroll defense, and do something else. 3-4, Tampa 2, anything. He should take a page out of the Bill Walsh playbook, and start 3 rookies in the backfield.
    .
    Oh, how I yearn for a return to the Glory Years. With the present leadership, that is a distant lost legend.
    .
    I know, I know, Rome was not built in a day, but they are building a foundation on quicksand, and the bricks are disappearing like a puff of smoke.

    1. Six hundred and seventy four words in one post (or thereabouts).

      C’mon Sebbie, go for an even 1000. Go bold! You could have gained another 100 or so easily with more of your well-worn cliches…

        1. Nope. Darren is Doctor Football…or is it Nurse Football. He put on quite a show yesterday.

          In terms of blog status, rest assured you are a rung or two above Nurse Football. Hang in there Sebbie!

      1. Cassie, when I posted my 10 point plan, I left something out because I thought it related to JH more, and I did not think KS would need to be told this.
        .
        1. Read Rudyard Kipling’s poem-IF…..’ Stop being so demonstrative on the side line. It seems to tick off the refs, and is counter productive. Use biting humor to get your point across’…… Channel Bill Walsh. Study the game winning drive before ‘The Catch’.
        .
        In hindsight, KS would have greatly benefited from reading those words.

    1. Coach,
      Mr. Paul Hofer made us forget about O.J. Simpson and that in itself makes him legendary in my book.
      But aside from that, Hofer played with fearless abandon that has been missed in today’s NFL. He was a shooting star that burned out much too fast, but will always be one of my all time favorites.

      1. When Hofer carried the ball, it seemed like his arms and legs were all going in different directions. He just kept fighting for yards until the whistle blew. He had barely made it back from his first knee surgery and was starting to hit his stride when he blew out the same knee again. He wasn’t physically imposing and not a great athlete, but that man had a lot of heart!

    2. Wilson reminds me of Bill Ring, a go for broke type runner who weighed 208.
      .
      I really liked Hofer’s moxie, but he weighed only 195.

  33. Just watched the game again and while the defense wasn’t great, they weren’t terrible and the scheme wasn’t the issue. This was a pretty close game in the first half both in score and play on the field. What turned it into a one sided blowout were the usual cadre of mistakes by different areas of the team. Some key points that decided the game:

    Jeff Wilson’s fumble (may not have been a fumble but I digress) in the RZ. At worst they were looking at a chip shot FG and came away with nothing.

    James’ fumble on a punt return with 2 minutes left in the half. Instead of getting a full two minutes to try and get to within one score, they wind up giving up another TD.

    With those mistakes alone the Niners went from possibly being within 3 at half time to being down by 17. The second half was more of the same:

    Giving up an 80+ yard KO return to open the second half to give Seattle yet another short field and a TD.

    Exum takes a 43 yard pass interference penalty to move the Seahawks from deep in their own territory to the Niner 41 yard line

    4 TD’s by way of Niner mistakes leading to short fields or a TD return.

    Just a few plays often make the difference in a game and that was the case here. The Niners aren’t as talented as Seattle at the moment, but could have kept the game fairly close without key mistakes. That is what has killed them all season along with simply not having enough talent and experience on the field due to injury.

    As to the claim that they quit, it’s complete nonsense. The defense was facing a first and goal after another questionable penalty with the game pretty much decided and they held Seattle to a FG. The offense kept moving the ball right to the end. There is no quit in this team which is good to see.

      1. Yeah, that was probably the best open-field tackle I’ve ever seen a defensive lineman make on Wilson. And speaking of Wilsons, I was very impressed with the way our Wilson ran the ball. A back with both power and speed!

        1. You think Niners have found their short-yardage back? The kid seems to have put on some weight since March and tends to run north-south.

    1. The Niners aren’t as talented as Seattle at the moment, but could have kept the game fairly close without key mistakes.

      Many of the mistakes are being made by the less talented, low draft picks who have major roles due to injuries. There is a connection there, IMO.

      As to the claim that they quit, it’s complete nonsense.

      Only the football-ignorant or disingenous rabble-rousers make that claim — so it’s not worth any discussion.

      On a different note, I really liked the way Blair hunted down nanobubbles like a bear homing in on a prey. However, a few years ago, nanobubbles would have probably juked his way out of trouble…

      1. Mood,

        Good points and I agree. The revolving door of players doesn’t allow cohesiveness which predictably results in mistakes being made.

    2. Yes, this was the most frustrating part of it for me. The D admittedly started poorly, but they were starting to hold up alright after the first 2 TDs. But then turnovers and STs gaffes reared their ugly head. This has been a bit of a season long story unfortunately. Offense and STs giving the ball away and piling pressure on a D that has some glaring weaknesses.

      I didn’t see the team quit. I just saw the same team we have seen all year.

      1. As you probably know, I am not a Saleh fan and I was calling for his ouster last season. But even if you don’t agree with me, sometimes an organization has to make a shift – has to do something to try and shake things up, chart a new course, etc. Saleh really has no resume as a successful DC; in fact, it is the exact opposite. Firing Saleh and perhaps the special teams coach would be easy choices and appropriate in my opinion.

        1. I can’t speak for Scooter, but my point wasn’t that Saleh is beyond criticism and should be kept on staff no matter what. All I’m saying is that scheme can’t overcome a lack of outside pass rush and being put in poor field position. That happens every week with this team. The defense hasn’t been great, but pinning it all on Saleh is completely missing the broader points as to why this team struggles defensively.

          1. A leader has to inspire confidence. It’s no stretch to suggest that Saleh does not inspire confidence in the fans. Okay, you’ll say the players are much more important, which I agree. I’m not convinced that he does inspire confidence in the players. Kyle has taken a few veiled shots at the defense this year. Equally important, I think, is that to my knowledge Sherman has not said anything about Saleh. He generally praises KS for his knowledge, scheming and game planning – but I have not seen a single comment about Saleh. Given the heat this defense is taking from fans and press, doesn’t that surprise you a bit (assuming I’m right about Sherman).

          2. Cubus,

            Both Sherman and Shanahan have defended Saleh and said the same things I’ve said previously:

            “It’s simple day one football,” Sherman said. “Once again, that’s why it’s frustrating because it’s simple day one football that we’ve got to figure out how to translate. I hear a lot of stuff out there, blaming the coaches and Saleh and the DB coach (Jeff Hafley), and it’s like it doesn’t really matter. If you call the perfect call and you don’t run the play the way you called it, what else can you do? You call the play, a guy has man, you don’t take the man and it’s going to lead to a big play. Aaron will find him if he was covered, and for him to not cover him, it’s frustrating, but we’ve got to find a way to get that done.”

            https://247sports.com/nfl/san-francisco-49ers/Article/49ers-postgame-quotes-Shanahan-Sherman-defend-Robert-Saleh-123394882/

            I get that many on here are unhappy with Saleh for various reasons, but I just try to balance that with the fact that it really isn’t the scheme that is responsible for most of the problems we see week after week. I don’t know how good of a DC Saleh is because I’ve yet to see him call a game with the talent needed to succeed consistently. Not only do the Niners not have a pass rush, but they keep having to replace people in the secondary and LB core due to injury. There is no opportunity for cohesion. If they find a veteran DC with a great resume to take over next season, I’m fine with that, but they shouldn’t be looking to replace Saleh just for the sake of replacing him to appease the fans. You’ve got to replace him with someone you know will get better results.

            1. “You’ve got to replace him with someone you know will get better results.”

              Absolutely agree. I think Richard in Dallas is better. If Dallas “allows” him to be lured away, he would be a good get with no change in scheme required. As some have pointed out a scheme change might not make much difference given the current players. If so, this opens up more candidates (Fox, Bowles, etc.).

              Thanks for posting the article, but I’ll note that Sherman does not specifically praise Saleh as he does KS. Isn’t Saleh the guy he reports to (well, at least in theory)?

              1. He does praise Saleh:

                “People don’t know ball,” Sherman said. “This is one of the most sound schemes in football. That’s why you see so many people executing it. When you don’t play sound it can lead to busts, but any scheme when you don’t play sound it can lead to big plays, and we’ve got to find a way to just play disciplined. When we got stops and we got three-and-outs and things like that, it wasn’t anything special. It wasn’t guys making stuff up, it was guys just doing their assignments. Nothing special… (Saleh has) called great games, and he’s continued to call great games and we’ve got to find a way to reward him and finish.”

                As I said, I’m not opposed to changing coordinators if they find one with a great resume, but that is the least of our problems. No coordinator is going to have success without players at all three levels who can play consistently and the Niners don’t have that.

              2. OK. Fair enough. That article did not come up in my searches.

                Still, it’s the same story every week and this was week 12. At the professional level is the excuse of these are Day one mistakes valid? Day one mistakes, really??? Day one mistakes that happen every game. Are our defensive players really that mentally incompetent that they can’t execute one of the simplest defenses in professional football? Are the reasons Sherman presents bonafide reasons for the owners/fans of a team to continue to stay the course. There’s been very little if any improvement.

                Companies that want to remain profitable would never survive with this kind of “sustained” lack of performance. Why should a football team? Something needs to change. In a company, it is difficult to “wholesale” fire the rank and file, so managers get the axe.

              3. Cubus,

                NFL teams are not companies. The entire premise is to practice the same things with the same people as much as you possibly can. Getting rid of Coaches early on in a rebuild rarely if ever works because the problem is talent not scheme. I’m not saying Saleh is a great DC and shouldn’t be questioned. I’m saying the scheme is not the problem; the lack of players is the problem. If you want a good example, look at Wade Phillips in LA. One of the best DC’s in the game and his defense has struggled a lot this season in every facet. Players matter.

              4. “NFL teams are not companies.”

                Far more in common than not in common. Both produce a product for sale (it’s just a different product). Both companies and individual teams are for profit organizations with similar management structures. Managers/coaches are both tasked with getting the most out of their employees/players. The NFL, however, is somewhat more monopolistic since even the worst teams don’t lose money. This “inherent” characteristic of the NFL can lead to severe inefficiencies (think Cleveland) that don’t need to be corrected since the organization will remain profitable (albeit the object of fan “ire”).

                When an organization has a problem with selling it’s product (winning games), they replace management (coaches). Coaches get fired all the time just like management regimes in companies are replaced.

        2. Yeah, as rocket said, I wasn’t suggesting Saleh or the D doesn’t deserve any blame. Not by any stretch. Just that the rhetoric that the D is the reason the team keeps losing is off the mark. The team keeps losing because the whole team keeps making mistakes. The offense may put up yards but they are also directly contributing to the losses with key turnovers and failing to score when in the red zone. STs is contributing to the losses by giving up big plays and turnovers. The defense is bad, but is also being asked to do far too much.

  34. We keep complaining about bad calls, but we better get used to it now. Thanks Kyle.

    Seattle predictably wanted to pressure Mullens early and often. So our first two drives end after getting sacked on 3rd down, against an empty backfield both times. Thanks Kyle.

  35. Yes the DC needs to be fired ASAP. Install a new system and get better players who fit that system. Thats what they should of did the past 2 seasons but they have not. Then fire the OC which would be Shanny and either give it to his top assisant or bring in a offensive guru to help out and Shanny just needs to be a coach or he should resign along with lynch.

    If its true and he lost his players then thats bad. Yes they have injuired players but thats no excuse every team has players go down. They probably need a new trainers or just better players who dont get injuied. Now they have the same ppayers injuired again who shouldnt be on the team or starters. Ward, Tarrt, Garcon, Garnett, Goodwin, Tart and Goodwin got contract extensions. They should of traded them if they did have a chance.

    It all starts from the top Jed wont resign but his the owner, lynch/ wont resign because of their egos. Even with JG healthy this would of still been a losing team. Its better that he did get hurt instead of taking this beating. Next year its going to be the samething unless management is gone or they start thinking like winners check their EGOS and do whats needed to win

  36. Okay all. Most want Saleh tossed. Who are the best–and most realistic candidates (potentially available and willing to work in Santa Clara)? I’ve asked Grant to set up a candidates poll but he won’t do it.

    Anyway, who are the most likely and best candidates?

    1. “realistic candidates”

      There’s the rub.

      Not sure how realistic these are but…

      Sean McDermott
      Kris Richard
      Ed Donatell
      Manny Diaz
      Brent Venables
      Marvin Lewis

  37. Geez! Look at all the coaches in here! It doesn’t take 1000 words to tell you what is wrong with this team! Shanahan sucks! He’s horrible. Look at what he has around him. You think they are goi g to win anytime soon with these clowns? Injuries! All on team Shanahan! Poor tackling , how many broken arms? How about his handling of Goodwin? The dude needs to play! Period! Time for your issues are after football! It’s always secrets with this organization! Bring big Jimmy T!

    1. As in Tomsula? Do you think Jimmy T would tell Goodwin to man up? Tomsula was known as softie much of the time when it came to player issues. Maybe you’re thinking Singletary?

  38. Brady is the consensus best QB in the NFL. McCarthy has a great offensive mind. Like most teams that don’t win it every year, or even make the playoffs, his defenses have been horrid. I’d hire him in a second as the OC. He has Niners roots, he’s a WCO guy. Whoever scoops him up will be better for it.

    1. McCarthy will have a number of HC offers if he wants them. The talking point of the day is that offensive football has passed him by and yet the Packers were top ten in yards and middle of the pack in points scored. They have had their share of injuries too. The last full season he had Rodgers healthy (2016) the Packers were 8th in yardage and 4th in scoring. McCarthy hasn’t turned into an idiot that doesn’t know offense anymore. He just reached his shelf life with the current roster. He’s been the HC in GB for the past 13 years, the message wears thin after awhile. Same thing happened to Andy Reid in Philly and look how things have turned out for him.

    2. Last time Mike was an OC, his offense was ranked 30th in points scored and was dead last in yards per game. He was better in New Orleans but its not like he was a top flight OC.

      1. McCarthy was the untitled OC in GB. same with Holmgren in GB and Seattle, even though both gave titles to other coaches. McCarthy took back play calling duties from Tom Clements several years ago, and that miffed Rodgers, too, because Rodgers and Clements were good friends. As head coach for 13 years with the Pack, McCarthy probably called plays for 11 1/2 of those years. Dirk Koetter is another HC who is the unofficial coordinator and play caller, although he let Monken call plays for a few games this year and be titled as the OC.

    3. McCarthy has a great offensive mind.

      Seriously?! Over the last few seasons, I used to wonder how he managed to keep his job while not optimally using Rodgers and the supporting cast, not developing a reliable running game, and keeping Dom Capers for way too long. Actually, Capers (whose D did great in his early years with Pack) and he have something in common — both have not evolved over the past decade even as football has changed.
      Rodgers must look at the Rams, Chargers, Chiefs, Pats, etc and wonder why he has deserved to be in this rut. McCarthy would not have lasted 5 years without Rodgers and Ted Thompson and his staff’s decent drafts. He reminds me somewhat of Mooch as someone who learned a proven offensive system (WCO), inherited a good roster, had some excellent seasons, but did not grow as a play caller.
      McCarthy will probably get another job pretty soon replacing one of these DC-turned-HCs on the hot seats. But I won’t be surprised if that gig ends like Mooch’s in Detroit

    4. The Browns will be drooling over McCarthy, given the front office is filled with old Packer front office personnel.

      I think McCarthy’s offensive mind and abilities stop at 2013. He is not who we need in the new NFL; in fact, part of the issue with McCarthy in Green Bay has been his unwillingness to adapt to the changes in the NFL and his putrid playcalling. Let us not take someone else’s turd just to make turd sandwiches.

  39. Sebbie… Serious question. What are your thoughts concerning the Alliance of American Football?

    Under 200 words would be appreciated.

    1. Cassie, typical troll tactic. Why don’t you expound upon the subject, so I can comment on it?
      .
      I know, you will struggle to string 200 words together into a coherent post, so 100 words would be fine with me.

      1. Impossible! How could Sebbie be caught unprepared! Guess you are not Doctor Football.

        The AAF. You know, it has ties to the NFL. Play begins late winter. Eight teams.
        https://aaf.com/

        You being all knowing on matters dealing with player development and coaching, I naturally thought you’d have a strong opinion or two on AAF prospects. You could always send each franchise a framed copy of If. Suitable for hanging in every AAF lockeroom.

  40. Hey all. Jobs with the newly formed AAF…

    https://aaf.com/jobs/

    A sampling of jobs being filled. Sebbie? Grant? Others? Here’s your chance to shine!

    Data Scientist, Game Analytics — San Francisco, CA
    Information Security Engineer — San Francisco, CA
    Senior Software Engineer – Backend Web Development — San Francisco, CA
    Senior Software Engineer – Frontend Web Development — San Francisco, CA
    Senior Software Engineer, Native Mobile (iOS) — San Francisco, CA
    Senior Software Engineer, Test — San Francisco, CA
    Technical Marketing Engineer — San Francisco, CA
    Sr. Manager of Lifecycle Marketing — San Francisco, CA

    Team reporting jobs…
    https://www.teamworkonline.com/football-jobs/alliance-of-american-football/aaf-jobs/communications-community-relations

  41. Pettis has been trashed by many since he was drafted. Rice had his detractors too.

    Rice as a rookie: 49 receptions, 927 YDs, 18.9 Y/R, 3 TDs
    Pettis: 16 receptions, 314 YDs, 19.6 Y/R, 4 TDs.

    Of course Rice had a full season. Pettis has only played 9 games due to injury and were on our third QB.

    https://www.footballoutsiders.com/walkthrough/2006/too-deep-zone-jerry-rice-rookie-bust

    “Rice, the team’s top draft pick, had 26 receptions in 11 games, but he also dropped 10 balls, some of them at the worst possible times. He was coming off a game in which he dropped two passes, fumbled once, and caught just one pass. Niners fans booed the rookie; local columnists made him the butt of jokes.”

    “When I was drafted out of Mississippi Valley State, the word was I had good hands, could get open and ran well when I got the ball,” Rice said after the Chargers game. “But they also said I wasn’t really a speed-burner.”

      1. I like that they both look to score on every play, Kittle too. Pettis should have took the 1st down on that one play, but he ran parallel to the 1st down marker because he was trying make a bigger play, looked lile he was running back a punt. It was a rookie mistake, but his awareness will improve with more experience.

  42. I have never been a fan of Kyle Shanahan and hoped that the 49ers would not hire him. However, I do not believe he should be fired as HC, yet. The 49ers do need to fire both of their Coordinators though.

    Reasons I never liked Kyle:
    1. He was fired from the Redskins and the players did not like him. I lived in the dC suburbs in VA during the Shanahan reign. Everything that people complain about Kyle today is exactly what was said back then.
    2. He quit on the Browns.
    3. The Falcons fans wanted him fired after his first season as OC.

    That’s not HC material in my view.

  43. ” . . . .. played better than any QB in recent memory.” That’s for sure.

    Alex Smith beat the Seahawks four games in a row, from 12/12/2010 (3 TDS, 0 INTs, Rating of 130), through 10/18/2012. No Niners QB has had much success since Smith left the team. Smith’s playoff rating when starter with Niners was 101, with 5 TDs and no INTs. Good thing he was replaced.

    The second meeting of the 2012 season had Smith on the bench and Kaepernick throwing an interception in a 13 to 42 loss (QB rating of 72). CK7 through 7 TDs and 5 INTs in playoffs, when Niners had the best defense in the league.

  44. There’s only one coordinator (Saleh -defense) Frustrated. Kyle is his own OC. Kyle has shown what he can do when he has had decent players on the field, including the most importantly, the most significant position, QB. 5-0. This season is an aberration. How can any sound minded person analyze the results of this season and Kyle’s performance when he is basically coaching an expansion team, and a lousy one at that. The worst thing he has done was win 5 in a row, of which 2 were against playoff teams, at the end of last year. High expectations this year were snuffed out with the season ending injuries to key players that left the team in shambles. You can’t win in the NFL with second and third stringers. Is he and John responsible for the players on the roster? Yes! No question they have not done well with their drafts and must improve dramatically this coming draft, and in signing FA’s. Just remember 1979, especially when reading and listening to Coach/GM Grant. Bill Walsh was crucified in the press by no other than Lowell Cohn, and others, similar to what’s happening to Kyle. Fire him was the main theme. After the 2-14 season, it was ugly, and continued the next year when they went 6-10. Thank god cooler minds prevailed and ownership wasn’t pressured into doing something stupid, too soon. In Walsh’s case, we know how it turned out. The third year, 13-3 and a SB victory. To me, the jury is still out on Kyle. Does that mean he has unlimited time to get the team winning? No, not at all. But he must have at least this coming year and probably the next. If they haven’t improved dramatically in two years, then make a move. 6 wins to me next year is realistic. At least 10 the following year. JMHO

    1. Juan, Can you show me where I fired Bill Walsh? I don’t remember doing it, but it’s possible. I was new at the Chron his 2-14 season and barely wrote about him. If you have the facts about my firing him, please share with this blog. If you merely assumed i fired him, well, I’d call that sloppy reporting. Eagerly awaiting your details. LC

    1. Juan, this is what you wrote — I copied it from your previous comment: ‘Bill Walsh was crucified in the press by no other than Lowell Cohn, and others, similar to what’s happening to Kyle. Fire him was the main theme. After the 2-14 season, it was ugly, and continued the next year when they went 6-10. ‘

      As I read what you wrote, I crucified him when he went 2-14 and called for his firing. Please show where I wrote that. It’s important you take responsibility for what you write.

  45. Pack Shanahan’s bags now. How much more do we have to endure? His handling of GOODWIN is a total joke. Tell us why or make that patty cake player play. Why is everything a secret with the 49ers? I’d rather endure Tomsula for two more years than watch this so called GENIUS bury this team for the next 10 years. The new CLEVELAND is the 49ers. These injuries only happen to losing clubs. My goodness how many arm tackles does this team have? Well, by the amount of broken arms the last two years it’s probably a lot. Fire Saleh, Fire the conditioning coach, that is at least the minimum. McCarthy is out there we could dump KYLE and changes horses. Bottom line Shanahan isn’t HC material at best a OC.

  46. Sorry Lowell. Driving to a reception. Your splitting hairs Lowell with all do respect. Please tell me that you didn’t call for Bill’s head more than once.

    1. Juan, It’s obvious you can’t answer me or provide the evidence for your assertion that I said Walsh should be fired. Shame on you for writing about something you don’t know about and for maligning me. Please don’t answer. I’m done with you.

      1. Just thinking back with no research, I know some one who wanted to fire Bill Walsh.
        .
        Eddie. Thankfully, John McVay talked him out of it. Carmen may also have been a conciliator a few times.

  47. Solari’s offensive line has committed 31 penalties for 258 yards.

    Benton’s offensive line has committed 15 penalties for 105 yards.

    1. Razoreater – and your point is??????

      Mine point is Solari is coaching a bunch of retreads, waiver acquisitions, low draft picks and FAs and an ex-basketball player, etc. while the Niners have at least 3 first rounders and a 2nd rounder starting.

      Solari’s O-line is blocking for a run game leading the league in rushing and doing it with less.

      Niners can’t run the ball in the RZ while the Seahawks walk in untouched from 20 yards out yesterday. In fact, the entire Niner RZ offense and 4-minute offense stinks. Niners have no 4-minute run game to close out wins, which due to such ineptitude have become losses.

      Have to look at the positive results, too, and Seahawks O-line has the edge

      1. I thought that would be obvious. Discipline and technique.

        I hate to break this to you, Mike but Solari has 1st round picks in Brown, Fluker, and Ifedi. Britt is a 2nd rounder. 🤣🤣🤣🤣Solari may be a disciple of McKittrick, but he’s no McKittrick.

        Cue Grant in 3…2…1… with the, “nice post, Mike”.

        1. brown from the Houston franchise drafted 11 years ago; fluker drafted by chargers then signed as a retread from Giants; ifedi is a seahawk selection; fant undrafted FA signed in May 2016; britt 2nd round seahawk pick; hunt is a 6th round 2016 seahawk pick

          staley is niner pick, so is mcglinchey; garnett; tomlinson is a lion #1; richburg a giants high pick;

          solari is closer parallel and comparison to mckittrick than any niner coach is to anybody of note. if solari was with niners, they would have a RZ run game and a viable 4-minute offense to eat up the clock to close out those wins the niners peed away

          1. I believe your contention was Solari was coaching a bunch of “low draft picks”, Mike. If wishes and buts were candies and nuts, we’d all have a very fine Christmas….🎅

    1. I sure hope the Raiders get the first pick. Then the Giants trade up with the Niners for the best QB. Then the Niners trade back from the Giants position, so they ultimately obtain 5 picks.
      .
      Gruden is desperate for a pass rusher, so Bosa is a no brainer for him.

      1. Gruden will need to give me two 1st’s this year, a 1st next year and a 2nd this year if he wants Bosa. In other words, forget about it!

      2. sebnynah says:
        November 28, 2018 at 7:43 pm
        Grant, by calling me a legend, elevates my status,

        Can you come up with a ten point plan to improve ones status?

        1. Yes, Prime, since you said that Kaep took the league by storm, here was a 10 point plan for Kaep to improve, which would help elevate his status if he had beaten the Seahawks that day. Hopefully, Mullens could benefit, too, which will elevate his status to be backup to JG next season.
          .
          10 things Kaep (Mullens) should do on Sunday. 1-17-14
          .
          1. Run the no huddle with (varied) quick snaps to negate the crowd noise. (Try to catch the defense with 12 on the field, for a free play, that should morph into a long bomb down field.)
          .
          2. (Almost) always put a man in motion, and read the defense’s reaction. ( A man in motion will be at full speed at the snap of the ball. A MIM could allow a receiver to avoid the jam at the line of scrimmage. A TE in motion could pinch in the DE, and allow the QB to roll out. A MIM could create a mismatch).
          .
          3. Fake a handoff or pitch, then roll out the other way to befuddle the defense.
          .
          4. Invite the blitz, then roll away from the blitzer, or complete a quick (slant or hook) pass. ( Attack the area the blitzer left.)
          .
          5. Take advantage of the defense’s speed by doing counters, misdirections an reverses.
          .
          6. Look off the safeties by facing one way while looking in another direction.
          .
          7. Consider time outs to be precious, and saved for (legitimate challenges, and) the last 2 minutes (of each half. Do not use time outs so they help the opponent.).
          .
          8. Shake hands, win or lose. Read IF, by Rudyard Kipling. ( Be bold. Do not settle for field goals.)
          .
          9. (Be efficient in using the clock. Lead the Niner offense by being well prepared, focused and disciplined. Hope to see crisp quick effective execution. Never let the play clock go past 5 seconds before getting a play off, unless you are bleeding the clock. Use deception, and pump fakes. Be innovative, and do not run into the teeth of the defense.) After the game, go to the Niner section and hand out pre-autographed hats.
          .
          10. Get the ball in Frank Gore’s (Playmaker’s) hands as much as possible.

      3. bosa is a trap pick – look at the family history, agent history, injury history – picking him is like a moth being drawn to a flame, and we all know how that turns out –

        1. They may not be red flags, but they are cautionary tales. Need to see the Senior Bowl and Combine.
          .
          It also depends on which Free Agents are signed.
          .
          It also depends on whether Kentavius Street has fully recovered and rehabbed.
          .
          Anointing Bosa number one is a tad premature.
          .
          I remember Razor declaring that Connor Wiliams would be the Niner first round draft choice last year. Then he got injured, and fell to 40th.

  48. This tweet alludes to a point I made earlier in the season:

    Josh Dubow‏
    Verified account
    @JoshDubowAP

    #49ers 5 takeaways are fewest since at least 1940 through 12 games, beating the 7 by Jacksonville in 2016

    1. Yep, that has to change. Best way to affect that change is by making opposing quarterbacks hurry their decision making process through the pass rush….

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