SANTA CLARA – The game was part tragedy, part comedy. It was tragicomedy.
The 49ers lost at home to the Los Angeles Rams 39-10 — a comically lopsided score.
Before Sunday’s game, the 49ers unveiled a larger-than-life statue of Dwight Clark making The Catch. Clark died tragically of ALS on June 4.
The current 49ers receivers no-showed the game, doing nothing to honor Clark’s legacy and the most iconic touchdown catch in franchise and NFL history. They caught four passes total. They played like the Invisible Men. It was comical.
The 49ers also honored their 1994 team, which won the Super Bowl. They invited 20 former coaches and players from the championship squad and gave them a ceremony on the field during halftime. Steve Young, Jerry Rice and George Seifert all were there.
While the 49ers celebrated that team and its pristine jerseys, the current team committed four turnovers, lost its second straight game at home by double digits and fell to 1-6 on the season. Comedy.
To top it all off, R&B singer Montell Jordan sang his smash hit “This Is How We Do It” during halftime. That song came out a week after the 1994 49ers won the Super Bowl. Another tribute to their era of dominance.
During Jordan’s performance, he changed the lyrics to the chorus. Instead of singing, “South Central does it like nobody does,” he sang, “The 49ers do it like nobody does.”
Jordan had a point. This year’s 49ers commit turnovers like nobody does and lose games like nobody does. On Sunday, they embarrassed themselves, their alumni, ownership and fans like nobody does. High comedy.
“It’s always embarrassing when you lose like that,” head coach Kyle Shanahan explained during his postgame press conference.
Click here to read the rest of my game story.
‘Because CJ is the best QB we have in our building’.
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I would respectfully say they should bring in a better QB.
I can’t believe I agree with Grant..and sebnyah
I do believe CJ beathard needs to be benched..
CJ is hurting this team’s chances to win for 4 straight games now..
I’d rather see Mullins makes those kinds of mistakes… knowing he has no regular season game experience…then CJ..
Either Kyle is saying that to defend CJ in the heat of the moment…or he wants to keep it close to the vest…and not handle it in the press….
Or maybe he’s not confident in Mullens..
I trust Kyle when it comes down to that decision.
He pulled Hoyer last year and inserted CJ..then put Jimmy G in..
.and never gave CJ the job back once he was healthy
So I dont think Kyle would hesitate to make a switch..
Kyle taking the temperature of the locker room and his coaches..in the next day or two..
Will determine matters..
“It was comical.”
“Comedy.”
“High comedy.”
Your bias is showing.
Some of it was the type of stuff that would make Football Follies if they were still doing those.
9 turnovers, a blocked punt and so on, to go along with 28 points in the last two home games. It’s an embarrassment.
Embarrassment, yes. Comical, no, unless you’re not a Niner fan.
“unless you’re not a Niner fan.”
LOL
A comedy makes one laugh, not cry. This is a tragedy, a farce.
A farce is a comedy wordsmith, so you just contradicted and undermined your own point, which is itself farcical!
Try harder. This dumpster fire does not make me want to laugh.
I don’t have to, you provide enough unintended farces around here.
Remember when this was a thing?
https://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/stat/penalties-per-game
8. San Francisco
That’s good to see.
Watching CJB he just seems….. slow. In more ways than one. Yea, he’s tough and all that but dude, how many times on 3rd and short are you going to hold the ball and expect not to take a sack or turn the ball over? Seriously. Breida should be shelved…. He’s glass and more worried about his ankle than ball protection. Foster has disappeared this year… Hearing his postgame PC in the locker room gives one the impression he’s about as intelligent as Darren. He looks lost out there but then again so does most of the D as usual. Overall this team is SOFT. Watching the Rams physically manhandle the OL and DL is disheartening and for every Niner that dropped in agony (only to walk away) the Rams had a sack or TO… I don’t know if Mullens could be any worse but if Shanahan sticks with CJ and they lose these next 3 games, he’s going to have some serious explaining to do unless they’re going for that #1 pick.
We argue about whether KS can handle both HC and OC roles at the same time. KS the OC hand picked CJ to be his backup QB and blew it, but he doesn’t want to own up yet. KS the HC needs to step in objectively and do what KS the OC won’t. Seriously, for Kyle to say he’s the best we got shows he really isn’t up to the task because CJ would not be playing for any other team in the NFL with his performances. He’s that bad.
No, I argued that KS needed to hire an OC before TC, and everyone else told me to shut up and let KS run his team the way he wants to.
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Glad to see some are now calling for the hiring of an OC after this putrid performance. Still, KS is stubborn, and likes to play his favorites to the detriment of the team, and still thinks he does not need an OC. Too bad the results on the field scream out that KS is wrong in so many ways.
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I am glad that KS has stopped blaming only the players, and actually took some of the blame, himself. This was a poorly coached team, and the ineptitude is directly related to a lack of preparation, bad game scheming and incompetent game management.
Wondering if the hiring of a offensive coordinator comes with a corner who can lock it down, holy water to pour on Jimmy G’s knee so he can play next week and 2 WR’s who can catch and take it to the house as well as a new starting strong safety, 2 premiere pass rushers and while I am asking, how about a healthy RB ?
Prime, are you armchair quarterbacking? Playing the GM? Second guessing?
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Thought you did not do that…..
I am a realist. I understand the reality of the situation. Blaming the loses on coaching while considering all the other stuff, is ignorant.
Yes it was a charity event hosted by the 49ers, but the Rams are the best team in the league. Sack Shanny? You must be joking….
In the cellar.
Its just a shame how this season is unfolding. The expectations of improvement during the off season hasn’t come to light. In fact I might even say they are a worst team this year then last year. The loss to the Rams doesn’t bother me near as much as the loss to the Cards.
The coach on this staff that needs to be sacked immediately is Hafley. Too bad Ed Donatell wasn’t available, but if we were to sack Saleh, he’d be a great hire as the new DC….
Out coached
Out gunned.
Razor – I agree, they were also out gunned. However, a lot of the mistakes can be cleaned up with better coaching. The team seems unfocused and lacking discipline.
How were they outcoached Nick?
Outmatched and outmanned more like it.
If anything can be blamed on Shanahan is his not featuring Mostert more, sticking with CJB and selecting him in the first place.
Fire Shanahan?
Click bait Click bait Click bait Click Click bait Click bait Click bait!!!!!!!!
Would Sean MCvay, presumably everyones coach of the year, have the 49ers at .500 or better with the 49ers roster?
People calling for Shanny’s head should be embarrassed at even the suggestion of it!
I have to honestly ask the ones who are complaining about the loss, what in the heck were you expecting? The Rams are easily the best team in the league right now, while the 49ers are most likely the most injury and mistake prone team in the league.
WRT to Beathard: Yes, he was awful on Sunday, but he was the reason the team lost; the OL, a unit that is considered to be improved from last season, lost the game. I don’t care what QB is behind center. Anytime an OL allows seven sacks, your team is going to lose the game.
Is time to consider Shanahan on the hot seat? Uh no, and anybody thinking this needs to sit on their hands and abstain from being a 49ers fan until they get back to being a contender. The offense is playing bad because of injuries and underwhelming returns from players who looked good in 2017 such as Garcón and Staley. Sure Shanahan has called some bad plays, but every coach or coordinator is capable of that. We as fans have nothing to worry about until defenses start knowing the plays before the offense breaks from the huddle.
Is it time to fire Saleh? Again, the answer is no. Saleh has had his lumps this season, but it is difficult to be a good defense without a true edge rusher and a capable centerfielder (FS). If anything, I would argue that it is time to sack Harley because he is in his third season as the secondary coach, yet the secondary sans Sherman does not look like it is ready to play most of the time and keeps screwing up their assignments.
Is it time to hit the eject button on the rebuild? Sure, if you like the Browns.
The bottom line is that this is only the second year of what is a long-term rebuild. Year Three and Four will give us a better idea of where the team is at.
to much sense for all the crybaby fans on this blog.
Mid,
I agree with most of what you say. Shanahan should not be on the hot seat. This is what happens when the Citadel takes on Alabama. The Niners are completely overmatched and the only team in the NFL they have more talent than currently imo is the cardinals.
However, there are still some coaching issues that need to be addressed… blown assignments in the simplest defense in the league, discipline issues, ie pre snap penalties, players not improving. Those are real issues that this team needs to address.
However, there are still some coaching issues that need to be addressed… blown assignments in the simplest defense in the league, discipline issues, ie pre snap penalties, players not improving. Those are real issues that this team needs to address.
I agree with what you said, but when the players are on the field, they need to do their jobs. Things such as the dropped interception by Tartt and fumble by Breida are on the players.
Don’t forget not allowing the ball to be extracted, and how about a WR that can get open?
Yep.
Shoup,
They took 2 penalties yesterday. The defense didn’t really have any breakdowns that I saw. There are always players who are going to get beat on some plays, but the defense held up pretty well considering the position they were put in. I keep saying it every week but this is not a Coaching issue. You have a QB that turns the ball over at an alarming rate and often deep in his own zone. You can’t win when that happens and other than continuing to stress to the player that he needs to protect the ball better there isn’t a whole lot the Coaches can do other than replace him. As expected there are fans calling for Mullens and they may get to that point, but they see these guys in practice and haven’t put Mullens on the field so that tells you how they feel about him at the moment.
They will replace Beathard with Savage before they decide to start Mullens
Agreed.
I thought Tom Savage was cut to make room for Powell.
When Ward and/or Sherman are healthy, Powell will be cut for Savage.
He was but I expect they will re-sign Savage as soon as Sherman is ready to play again.
And just as I posted this the news surfaced that they have indeed resigned Savage and cut Powell.
Won’t speak for others, I didn’t expect them to win. The way they have played in the last 2 home games is terrible.
“mistake prone team in the league.”
Yes, and the coaching staff needs to share in the blame on that.
“Anytime an OL allows seven sacks, your team is going to lose the game.”
Stuff like that happens when you’re predictable and taking 7 step drops.
“the secondary sans Sherman does not look like it is ready to play most of the time and keeps screwing up their assignments.”
Yet without Uncle Sherm, Goff was held to his 3rd lowest ypa of the season.
Say what you’d like about the Browns, but they’re 1.5 games better than the 49ers and are doing that with a rookie QB.
I agree with almost everything you said here Jack but the Browns even with their rookie qb are a more talented team.
“the Browns even with their rookie qb are a more talented team.”
When you have a head coach and GM that have turned over about 80% of the roster since taking over that doesn’t qualify as a worthy excuse.
– I agree that the coaching staff deserves some blame, but the players do as well. The dropped interception by Tartt and fumble by Breida are not the coaching staff.
– Stuff like that happens when OL has a bad game against one of the best DLs in the league.
– That argument is irrelevant since the team kept gifting Goff and Co. a short field to work with.
– Which misses my point about the Browns entirely.
“The dropped interception by Tartt and fumble by Breida are not the coaching staff.”
Yet coaches are on the hot seat or fired every year as a result of things like that translating to losses. This team turns the ball over 2.6 times per game. It’s a nonstarter after that.
“Stuff like that happens when OL has a bad game against one of the best DLs in the league.”
The Rams defensive front is very good.
“– That argument is irrelevant since the team kept gifting Goff and Co. a short field to work with.”
Guess you could say that. Goes back to what has killed this team all year.
On the 4 possessions in which LA started on their own 25 or worse they were forced to punt 3 times and kicked one FG, and averaged 5.2 yards per play. They averaged 5.4 on the day overall. 1.5 less than they average on the year.
“– Which misses my point about the Browns entirely.”
No, I got your point. 49ers fans look down on Cleveland, when the fact is this is Cleveland West.
– Most teams aren’t in the beginning of a long term rebuild, and those who do let their coaches go during such a rebuild tend to set their team further back.
– Not just very good; they are one of the best.
– No argument there.
– That still misses my point.
It IS on the coaches. This reeks of sloppy, mistake-prone practice sessions that deserve …more reps ’til you puke. I cant imagine that either Walsh or Seifert tolerated this KRAP
Say what you’d like about the Browns, but they’re 1.5 games better than the 49ers and are doing that with a rookie QB.
No injuries and better talent. Did Hue Jackson all the sudden this year become a good coach? No chance!
Hue Jackson will likely be fired before the end of this year.
Possibly but they are playing better because of the added talent. Talent driven league.
If you say so
Of course I say so! Why else are they in games? And why are the 49ers not in games? Talent.
Mayfield is a legit QB. Beathard is not an NFL QB. I don’t think he’s ’s a good back either.
“ And why are the 49ers not in games?”
49ers have been in plenty of games this season only to choke them away, see San Diego, Arizona, Green Bay and to a lesser extent Minnesota.
“Beathard is not an NFL QB. I don’t think he’s ’s a good back either.”
Another bad move by Shanahan?
Prime where does the majority of this team’s talent come from? They were mostly acquired by Shanahan and Lynch. CJB is all Shanahan.
I agree CJB was a mistake. In fact they over drafted a couple guys.
But, perspective for a minute. Prior to Kyle Shanahan and John Lynch taking over, how many drafts did the 49ers completely whiff on? My recollection about three, maybe four.
So now they take over a 2 win roster and after 2 years fans are critical of a couple drafts that include some good pieces to build around, and some picks that are head scratchers.
My point is it’s going to take multiple drafts and multiple free agency periods to build a roster that’s going to account for all the past failures.
Let’s not forget this organization hasn’t drafted well for a long time. And the result is when your depth players have to become starters, you won’t win many games.
Prime, can’t have it both ways. If you say the team is not talented and the coach and GM are largely responsible for bringing in those players (and the holdovers perform at or above them), then the criticism is somewhat valid. It has little to do with previous draft mistakes and more to do with the current acquisition of talent (and those strategies)
If the team is inexperienced then it is because they got rid of more veteran players. That is also part of the strategy, perhaps! It may bear fruit down the road but it certainly isn’t now.
You say there are good pieces to build around (and I agree) however these same players are creating some of the lost opportunities. Is this due to poor performance? Perhaps, but a lot of different players are doing the same thing. Think back to the close losses last year and the same held true for many of them.
Is it due to inexperience? Perhaps that also plays a factor. However, every team suffers from inexperience at some point. The good ones fold in the inexperienced ones without much of a hiccup.
Is it due to lack of talent? Who drafted or brought in said players would be my question.
At some point the mental errors, the turnovers, the challenges of having a QB who cannot thrive (especially when he has 7 step drops), the overall holes in talent, one has to look at the common points between them. And that is the coach and the front office.
Not saying everything is their fault but the regime leaves a lot to be desired, especially for someone billed as a QB whisperer and a genius.
I don’t think Grant is advocating the firing of Shanahan, but a one win season could certainly spell doom for this young coach, so I agree with him on that point. Regarding the firing of Saleh, that would be premature, given that the offense was more responsible for the loss than the defense.
“I don’t think Grant is advocating the firing of Shanahan”
He’s not, and he said as much on the postgame periscope.
If he’s not advocating Shanny being sacked, why bring it up?
If he’s not advocating Shanny being sacked, why bring it up?
Comments are down so he needs some click baits!
Because he thinks Shanahan will be on the hot seat if they finish with only 1 or 2 wins.
He’s not alone in that sentiment among Bay Area media members.
Well that’s just a way of keeping interest in a team rebuilding. Its not easy reporting on a dud team so what sells, controversy. So lets start a rumor about firing a coach and try to create a buzz. Its lazy journalism!
What other Bayarea reporters have suggested that?
Larry Krueger, host of 49ers Pre-Post game and has a daily radio show on KNBR.
No one is calling for Shanahan to be fired. So not really lazy journalism.
It totally is lazy because anyone who cannot comprehend what the 49ers have endured to date, is not following the team closely enough.
Jed certainly can appreciate what this team has gone through and he would be the one to pull that trigger!
Cohn and Krueger sharing the same sentiment doesn’t mean dink. Give me someone with NFL credentials that shares their sentiment, and I’ll listen. Until then, Grant has a 1st mate on his ship of foolish sentiment. Whoopity doo!
Hmmmm… Interesting.
I always thought it was spelled Whoopty Doo.
I like that extra syllable.
;>)
I go with the wooptie doo spelling.
Whenever a team goes on a losing streak the talk inevitably turns to the firing the Coach. Time honored tradition but it’s not going to happen here. Like it or not the Niners gave Shanahan and Lynch 6 year contracts and they will be here another 2 years minimum imo. That is because the Niners have fired HC’s after one year previously and eaten a lot of money, while they have also developed a reputation as a place Coaches don’t want to go which is why they had to give out those 6 years deals in the first place.
There is also the fact that they have lost a large number of man games to injury including their QB, so they have built in excuses in that regard as well. Shanahan is going nowhere, nor should he, at least not yet.
And no one is saying he should, yet, either.
Yep I know. I didn’t watch the periscope but I haven’t read Grant say he should be fired. Just throwing this out there for those who think he’s going to get fired anytime soon.
I think if he goes this season with one win, he might get canned. There would certainly be a lot of talk regarding that in the post season.
I would think another year of lackluster results (and I mean a record that puts this team within reach of the playoffs , then that talk would grow louder). Or One more year of a 1-2 win season after this and I think he would get the axe, regardless of the 6 year deal.
but a one win season could certainly spell doom for this young coach,
How so? Unless the players come out publicly and say they have quit on him or show zero effort from here on out, how does Shanny deserve to be fired East? What has he done to even be considered on the hot seat?
A one win season doesn’t mean he deserves to be fired. I am merely pointing out the realities of coaches in the NFL. It is especially so here with the Yorks.
I think several things have hampered Shanahan:
1- he was given too much control from the outset. A little restraint can be a good thing
2- Lynch isn’t really a GM (to use es phrase overworked phrase “he’s a D.J.”). His character is great for the camera but his talent evaluation….
3- Lynch defers too much to Shanahan. He was hired after so he knows his gravy train. But it may not be great long term.
4- Too many young coaches and psychopaths. These guys would never question Shanahan and don’t provide veteran experience to a very green coach. And it shows.
5- His one ego. This can be good or not Good depending on situation, experience and track record. Problem is, Shanahan has none.
From the beginning the organization seemed to want to avoid what they had done before. Too much power to the GM, well let’s give the coach more. Coaches fired too soon? Give them long term contracts and Carte Blanche. They don’t learn their lessons.
Mid, I expected basic competence. This was the Keystone Cops.
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I am not calling for KS’s head, I just want him to learn from his mistakes. I want him to improve. I want him to grow up, and make the right adjustments. I want KS to look in the mirror, and make some hard decisions.
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KS with his -‘What, me worry?’ attitude, does not instill confidence. KS just admitted he does not have a clue. He needs help.
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I agree, Hafley may be the sacrificial goat, but until the overall coaching improves, nothing will change.
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At least Jed is happy. He likes being rewarded with a high draft position.
– You expect what you want, and anything less than that disappoints, as it does other fans.
– Exactly what mistakes do you want Shanahan to learn from? You keep saying make the right adjustments, but that is hard to do with a banged up team that is shooting themselves in the foot when on the field.
– You’re seriously using how Shanahan reacts as a claim that he is not instilling confidence? Really?
– Better coaching may be part of the equation, but it is not even close to the overall solution. The players need to play better and avoid shooting themselves in the foot with mistakes and missed opportunities. It does not matter who is wearing the head coach headset if the players can’t do their job. Also, going into a third season without improvement is not a good sign for secondary coach and is why Harley should be sacked; it isn’t because he is a sacrificial lamb.
I wanted KS to roll out CJB more, so he does not get bludgeoned in the pocket 7 times, and hit 11 times. When CJB did roll out, he hit Kittle for a good gain. I wanted KS to spread them out, then gash them up the middle. Mostert did well, but then KS used Breida who fumbled and Alfred Morris in the 4th quarter, and basically ignored Mostert.
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He was shaped by McVay, and thoroughly out coached. KS needed to be less predictable. In fact, he should carefully study what Mcvay did, and copy him.
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Maybe now, you will agree that hiring an OC might help the team. Maybe the OC could work on reducing the unforced errors, and concentrate on ball security.
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I just watched the PC, and that was my impression. Others may differ.
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My premise is that better coaching will help the players play more focused and in control. Better coaching will put players into positions to succeed, and help the Niners exploit the other team’s weaknesses.
– You’re assuming that would have lessened the number of sacks and the Rams defense wouldn’t have adjusted. You’re also wanting runs up the middle from an offense that is built on the outside run.
– You mean come into a team that isn’t depleted by the previous GM?
– No, and you’re only basing this on what you want.
– See my response to you missing the Tomsula pressers.
– Better coaching may help, but it won’t improve Tartt’s ability to intercept a pass, Breida’s ability to hold onto the ball and stay on the field, or Richburg from being blown up.
This is where you and I totally disagree, with all due respect.
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Every team in the NFL have players who can run fast and are strong. The overall difference in talent is not insurmountable. The biggest difference is in the coaching. The teams may be similar, but how the coaches utilize the players is a big difference between winning and losing.
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McVay took a 4 win team and got them to the playoffs. Now they are undefeated, and stomped all over the Niners. Bellichick can take couch potatoes, shoe salesmen and food waiters, and make them help win SBs. Coaching matters, and maybe better coaching could have gotten Tartt to hold onto that pick, Breida to fall down so the ball is not stripped, and CJB rolled out so Richberg is not driven back into CJB’s lap. Maybe they should have coached Tartt to concentrate on catching the ball, and even fall down to secure it with both hands, instead of looking to run before catching it, and dropping it.
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Yes, coaching matters, and how they form the team into a cohesive unit, and playing as a team, is just as important as individual performances. The Niners were shaped by McVay, and it was not pretty.
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Yes, the Rams are a playoff team, but the Niners had a 7 point lead in the 4th quarter at Lambeau. With better coaching, better game management, better clock management and a more focused and disciplined team, the Niners had a chance to win. The Niners should have run players through a gauntlet of players trying to strip away the ball so the ball carrier could work on securing and protecting the ball. Instead, KS had them do walk throughs with no contact.
Seb Beathard has the worst lateral movement I’ve ever seen a NFL QB have. He’s slow and even his scrambles look awkward. Rolling him out is like asking a fish to walk on land.
Come on, use your head, watch the player, try to identify his strengths and not regurgitate the popular answer.
While your overall statement is correct…
This particular part…
KS with his -‘What, me worry?’ attitude,
Kinda goes with the never let them see you sweat mantra you tout.
He should act like this to the media, and put this out Publicly for the teams sake. But he should absolutely be asking these questions privately just as BW did.
Shoup, I just want KS to be truthful, admit his own mistakes, and vow to make the hard decisions to improve.
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‘What, me worry?’ , is just denying reality. We, long suffering Niner fans can handle the truth.
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After the coaches performance last game, they should all be sweating silver bullets.
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Like Tomsula said, they should own it, fix it, and move on. Rainbows and unicorns are not needed.
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I totally agree with your last part.
Who says he isn’t doing that in team meetings and just putting on a poker face with the fans and media?
You may be right.
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I can’t believe that I am actually missing Tomsula PCs. He, at least, was brutally honest and took all the blame.
He also looked like he was in way over his head.
True.
One of the problems with hiring a young first time head coach is the quality of coaching staff he can assemble. McVay lucked out and got a DC in Wade Phillips with enormous defensive coaching experience as well as some head coaching experience. While I’m sure Phillips handles his defense, I’m he can provide an excellent sounding board for Mcvay on head coaching matters. Look at Shanahan’s stafff. Its mostly made up guys who are in the first time at their positions. Someone on Shanahan’s staff needs to offer a different and experienced perspective.
I agree and this has been mentioned a number of times before. It took so long to hire Shanahan that a lot of the Coaches he may have wanted had taken other jobs by the time he was available. Getting a guy like Phillips was huge for McVay and a veteran DC may have done the same for Shanahan but we are well past that now. I don’t know if hiring a new DC will be good or bad at this point because it will likely mean a change in system instead of going into year 3 with what we have. With a better pass rush this defense could look a lot better. A new CB opposite Sherman and a FS wouldn’t hurt either.
I think Shanny needs to be a bit more harsh on certain players if not sooner of later pressure will come from the media and the fanbase.
I am so sick of Jed York parading out statues and teams from yesteryear while the current organization remains a joke for about 15 of the 20 years the Yorks have been in control. He doesn’t care as long as he keeps making money.
Jed is looking at that empty mausoleum, and watches his dollars float away.
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Glad he has thick skin, because he was thoroughly humiliated yesterday, with all those Niner greats looking at an embarrassment.
“Grant Cohn says:
October 22, 2018 at 7:50 am
What impact does Foster make?”
None. Put Brock Coyle or Elijah Lee in there and you get the same results.
You can pretty much say that about guys across the board. We keep reading about the lack of talent yet Shanahan hand picked his current QB, his WR group. Witherspoon, etc.
All that being said, this team beats itself on a weekly basis. Opposing defenses basically sit back and dare them to drive the length of the field and the strategy usually pays off with a turnover of some type.
All that being said, this team beats itself on a weekly basis. Opposing defenses basically sit back and dare them to drive the length of the field and the strategy usually pays off with a turnover of some type.
Yeah that’s what young teams do and when you have a lack of talent. Of course teams just wait for you to make a mistake because that’s what happens when you have those 2 things.
We are who I thought we were.
1. First and foremost, Sherman taking a day off to make the pro bowl and get bonus is the most absurd ludicrous and paranoid thing I have read here within the last few weeks.
2. The portrayal of Jed York as a decisive owner who may fire SHanahan for this loss is a close second to the Sherman thing. Jed is a wuss. He made a big stink about Harbaugh losing the Thanksgiving game on National TV because Baalke convinced him to do so.
3. If Jed had been a strong decisive owner he would have realized that Harbaugh was a great coach and Baalke was a terrible GM. Harbaugh turned around a struggling team and took a bunch of talented older veterans to the Superbowl. Baalke failed to replace them with younger talented players. Harbaugh was the fall guy.
4. We are in trouble. We may win one of the next three games – Cards, Raiders, Giants but I would not count on it. Players appear to be shutting in it down.
5. Fans have already shut it down. Many empty seats – again. Yeah, I know 2 year rebuild which is actually a 20 TWENTY year rebuild.
6. Trading up for CJ was a mistake. Solomon thomas was also a mistake but he was a consensus top 5 pick. At least 20 other GMs would have taken him at 3 overall. Cant put ST on Lynch.
6A. The lesson to be learned from Solomon Thomas is that we should not look to the Pac 12 for linemen O or D. There have been far too many busts and disappointments.
7. My concern is about this year and next. We could have drafted Derwin in the first and traded up for Courland Sutton or Harold landry in the 2nd. Our team would be far stronger if he had. Why did we trade up for Petis. Was that another Shanahan blunder which Lynch failed to veto? What is the hierarchy? Why draft a punt return specialist when our D is so poor, we can stop the other team from scoring.
8. So what happens in 2019. Another top 5 pick and and high second round pick. Are we going to F those up also? This is exactly why we need a President of Football Operations. He will have veto power over KS so he does make any foolish picks.
9. Friendly reminder that one month before the season started , I picked KC CHiefs to win the AFC West and reach the Super Bowl in the Press Democrat season prediction post. Needless to say I was passive aggressively criticized. If the Chiefs do reach the Super Bowl, I feel like I should be awarded a Press Democrat t shirt or coffee mug.
Yes the first point is pretty ludicrous. Especially considering that Sherman gets more money if he plays at least 90% of the Defensive snaps.
The FO should have signed Joe Montana to a 3hr emergency contact.
But seriously, this is who the 49ers are right now.
I was hoping for a much better overall performance yesterday, but then reality set in – the 49ers are a few years away from being able to compete with the elite teams right now.
I like CJ’ toughness and grit but he’s not ready to move the needle forward.
Maybe we resign Savage and see if he can help improve the offense.
AES,
I could be way off base, but I don’t think they are that far away from being a playoff contender as long as they add some outside pass rushers and stay healthy. This was the first game where they really weren’t competitive and that will happen when you play one of the best teams in the league and turn the ball over 4 times. We’ll see if the team is still playing hard over the next few games which are very winnable if they don’t turn the ball over at the rate they are.
Correction, the best team in the league. They have the best RB, they have the best defensive lineman in Donald, they have one of the best DC’s with one of the top CB’s, and they have Dr. Goff who has been operating McVay’s offense to perfection….
They don’t have many weakness’ that’s for sure. I think they get Talib back at some point later in the year too so they aren’t going away anytime soon.
And it helps that through 7 games, their undrafted free agent LB has stats like this…
58 Total Tackles, 2 sacks, 1 Safety, 9 PBU and 1 Interception
Yeah, I agree.
Nothing has changed since last week. Its still exactly the same team we thought it was. Good enough to be competitive against bad to average teams, not good enough to compete with good to great teams. Injuries are part of it, as is missing a few key pieces in other areas.
I don’t know what some fans were expecting from this game, but what we saw was what happens when a team continues to give good ball away. Only this time they were against probably the best team in the NFL so couldn’t find a way to still make it even slightly competitive despite the multiple errors.
I am far more frustrated about how they couldn’t beat the Cards or GB despite dominating those games for large stretches than I am about getting blown out by a far superior team.
It’s not losing to the Rams that’s bothersome, it’s the way they did it.
They lost to the Rams the same way they lost the past few weeks. Only difference was the Rams are a better team than they have been facing.
No, they didn’t lose to GB the same way. They had a chance to win there despite the 3 turnovers.
Yesterday wasn’t only about the turnovers either. Special teams really struggled too.
They were able to do more offensively against GB, but they still lost due to TO’s when it comes right down to it, which is the same reason they lost to AZ and got blown out yesterday.
One of the main reasons they had a chance to beat GB and not the Rams is that the Rams are just a better team. Like against GB, the 49ers gave up an early lead due to turnovers. Unlike against GB they couldn’t move the ball and put up their own points to get back in the game, because the Rams D was able to constantly pressure CJ and either force sacks or bad throws.
The game was very similar to previous games, except the 49ers were considerably outclassed this time.
“7. My concern is about this year and next. We could have drafted Derwin in the first and traded up for Courtland Sutton or Harold Landry in the 2nd. Our team would be far stronger if he had. Why did we trade up for Pettis. Was that another Shanahan blunder which Lynch failed to veto? What is the hierarchy? Why draft a punt return specialist when our D is so poor, we can stop the other team from scoring.”
This was very astute and I agree 100%. I just don’t think that Lynch is a great judge of talent (by and large).
Rocket,
I hear you.
The team will improve by filling some critical holes such as EDGE, CB, B-up QB, WR and now I believe RB.
I’m also concerned about the LB corp.
So far, Warner has established himself as our best LB.
Foster is not consistent and Smith has not provided higher level play than our previous LB’s.
We will be better next year when we get Jimmy G and McKinnon back, but even with that, we still need a solid off season with FA and Draft.
Raiders going to have big firepower in the next draft. Will they actually doing anything smart with those picks remains to be seen.
Dallas is desperate. A first for Cooper who is going into his 5th year option? Oakland may wind up with 3 first round picks in the top half of the draft.
As Gruden and the Raiders will discover, building a roster thru draft is a long-term affair because the draft is overvalued — it’s a numbers game and the average franchise is assured of 50-60% failure rate. I guess they have nine more years to complete the rebuild. However, dismantling a functional franchise by getting rid of their best player is downright criminal.
That’s true to some extent Mood, but they have increased the odds by having 3 picks in the first round where your chance at a hit is far greater. I didn’t see trading Mack this year as a smart move, but ultimately he was going to be traded at the end of the season for the same reason they traded Cooper and got rid of other Mackenzie picks. The team wasn’t very good and the talent is subpar overall. The 12 win season was a mirage accomplished because of a great year by Carr and coming out on top of every close game they were involved in which is an anomaly. The defense was terrible even with Mack and Cooper is in the midst of a freefall production wise yet they wound up getting 3 first round picks between the two of them. The Raiders are really putrid right now, but they have made some good trades here as far as getting maximum value for two guys who weren’t helping them win and were going to command huge money.
Agree with you on Cooper, and I think they got a great deal from the Cowboys. However, disagree on Mack. A player like Mack is the centerpiece of a D. The position is paramount for D and qualified players are very few and far between. Raiders fade despite Mack because of many other reasons. Mack is definitely worth $20+M per year for 4 years. There is absolutely no assurance that any edge rusher they draft in the first round will be an adequate replacement for Mack.
It comes down to one thing for me: defensive players cannot influence the outcome of a game enough to warrant the money Mack is making. Mack is fantastic no question about it, but defensive players have been handcuffed in today’s NFL. It is an offense driven league that is completely dependent on QB play. As good as Mack is, and again I agree he’s an elite level player at his position, he’s not going to help the Bears reach the playoffs unless the offense leads them. We’ve seen it first hand the last two weeks where a very good Bears defense has been shredded and the offense couldn’t keep up. I’ve come to the conclusion that to win in today’s NFL you have to have a top QB, a great Oline to protect him and a defense that is strong at every level, but not needing a star at every level. The Patriots have done this for years as have most of the regular contenders. I don’t know if the Raiders will hit on those picks, but paying Mack 23+ mill a year while you continue to lose and play lousy defense doesn’t make a lot sense to me. It’s the ultimate team sport and playing defense in the NFL is truly dependent on all 11. Hard to have 11 quality starters if you’re paying one that kind of money. The Bears are going to find that out in the not too distant future.
“As good as Mack is, and again I agree he’s an elite level player at his position, he’s not going to help the Bears reach the playoffs unless the offense leads them.”
That’s the wrong way to predict football success. No single player will help a team reach the play-offs. But the Bears damn well will not be successful in play-offs without a dominant rusher like Mack.
“It is an offense driven league that is completely dependent on QB play…”
Yes, and stopping the pass is the next most important thing. The dominant rusher is the the most important tool by far in the tool-chest for stopping the opposing QB. The market will dictate the price of the dominant rusher. So unless the team has an All-Pro starting QB or HoFer shoo-ins like Brees, Brady and Rodgers, a team better pony up the market price to stay competitive in post-season play.
I disagree. An elite QB can take a team to the playoffs. The only position that has that kind of impact which is why you don’t pay a defensive player like a QB.
I disagree even more with this statement than I did the first. The Bears had a top ten defense last season – 7th against the pass – and didn’t come close to making the playoffs. The only way they have a chance to make the playoffs is if the offense becomes a top half of the league unit. They really didn’t need Mack honestly. He’s a great player, but their biggest issue is improving offensively not defensively.
Which they were already pretty good at as I pointed out above.
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It’s a big part but you also need pressure from other areas on the line and good CB play. A pass rusher can be taken out of a game which is why you need a strong defense overall at all three levels. It’s hard to achieve that long term when you are paying one guy what the Bears are paying Mack.
Going by market value both Mack and Donald were severely over paid. There was no contact anywhere near what both got in guaranteed money at their respective positions. The Rams did it because they see a window to winning a SB while they have a young QB on his entry level deal. The Bears did it because…well the only reason I can see is they got caught up in the idea of adding an elite talent and forming another 85 Bears defense. Problem is defenses will never be at that level again due to the rules favoring offense and they Bears are still questionable in the secondary and LB which were bigger needs than adding a pass rusher.
Here’s all the perspective you need Mood: the Bears are currently 10th in pass defense with Mack. They are coming off two straight games of giving up 30+ points and are 3-3. They still have games on the road against the Vikings and Lions and have to play the Rams, GB and the Vikings at home. They will be very hard pressed to make the playoffs or achieve a winning record for that matter. Not impossible but very difficult and that assumes that the offense continues on an upward swing.
As good as Mack is, he is not going to affect this team enough to warrant what he was paid imo.
I’m sorry, I mistyped. What I meant was: “No single player will help a team reach deep into the play-offs. ”
Let me make this clear that I fully agree with the conventional wisdom that a franchise QB is essential for sustained playoff success from season-to-season. The franchise QB is the most valuable player — more by far any other position by 50-100% as measured in pay.
It’s a necessary-but-not-sufficient argument. A dominant pass rusher is not necessary for compiling stats towards becoming a highly-ranked defense, but is absolutely necessary to get deep into the playoffs unless the franchise has a top-five QB. In play-offs teams win because elite playmakers make elite plays at critical moments. My argument is not about regular season rankings.
Yes, that is done mostly thru double-teams which opens up opportunities for other rushers.
That’s incorrect, IMO. Market value is based on what another teams paid for the last player with similar valuation, and what the team in question is willing to pay for this player in question. It has little to do with past contracts. It’s just like house prices in the Bay Area!
The sack leader in the NFL last year was Chandler Jones. Second place was DeMarcus Lawrence. Neither made the playoffs. Half the top ten sack leaders didn’t make the playoffs. The highest paid defensive player in the league before Mack and Donald signed their deals – Von Miller – hasn’t made the playoffs since Manning retired. The two SB teams didn’t have an elite pass rusher. The Eagles had a good rotation and the Patriots rely on scheme more than individual players.
Yes a great pass rusher can make a game altering play in the playoffs, but they have to get there first.
Exactly and at that point you are relying on the players you haven’t given 90 million in guaranteed money to make the plays. This is the point I’m trying to make Mood. A team is better off with a group of good players on defense than they are with one high paid DE. The Bears have more than Mack of course, but the money they have paid Mack will restrict how much they can improve the defense moving forward whereas if you put together a rotation of good players you can achieve the same result at a cheaper cost and put together a better defense overall.
I understand that but the point was the increase in contract value was far bigger than the price increases that came before them, especially in the case of Donald. A player is worth whatever a team is willing to pay them, but there is a cost structure teams can refer to and overpaying the way the Rams and Bears did in a hard cap league will cost them at some point.
The 3 biggest margins of defeat at Levi’s Stadium have been accomplished the last 2 years.
Crazy when you consider how poor the roster was prior to Shanahan taking over….
Disturbing!
Alarming.
Average age of 49ers roster, 25.8. 15th in the league and only .3 years younger than the 2016 team.
Older than the Rams, Eagles, Packers, Chiefs and even the Browns.
Wonder what’s the average age of 49ers starters as opposed to the 53.
Average age of the current 49ers starting offense is 27.1
Singling them out because they’re the group that is routinely turning the ball over on a weekly basis.
Well, most of the turnovers on offense are directly attributable to one 24-year old at the most important position …
Uh huh, he is.
There’s a few other QB’s ranging from 24 and below too.
“49ers are too young” or “49ers don’t have enough talent”
Yep. Works until you realize the Browns are 1 1/2 games better with 3 rookies starting on offense alone and a 4th on the defensive side.
Meanwhile the 49ers have 2.
49ers aren’t losing because they’re young.
They’re losing because they make too many mistakes on a regular basis.
If you want to blame it on lack of talent, won’t dispute that either although I think they’re more talented than their record, then your indirectly blaming it on the ability of Shanahan and Lynch.
Is this team much better if Garoppolo is playing? Before the season started I had them at 3-5 for the 1st half, they should be 2-6. The only game they’ve lost that I didn’t expect them to was the first Arizona game.
I’m not making any generalizations here about team-wide youth and inexperience. Some of the Niners players are making repeat mistakes because of youth & inexperience, and the rest of the repeat offenders are backup-quality players who are inherently inconsistent when pushed into starting positions. It’s the same in every NFL team. It’s just that the Niners have too many of these combination right now repeating mistakes, along with coaches learning on the job… There is no one dominant reason why Niners are 1-6 right now. You are using statistically-insignificant data base to draw whatever conclusion you want to draw. Fine by me, but not convincing.
Really fishing now aren’t you Hammer?
San Francisco 49ers vs Los Angeles Rams
7th game of the season.
Final Score: 49ers – 17 / Rams – 31
Rams led 24 – 3 until the 49ers got 2 garbage TD’s in the 4th quarter to make the final 31-17. 49ers give up 4 passing TD’s and a QBR of 126.7 to the opposing QB. 49ers effort was extremely sloppy. 49ers QB threw 2 interceptions and they had 2 fumbles but were able to recover both fumbles. In a slap in the face to local sportswriters, who believed the 49ers should run the ball more and stop relying so heavily on the passing of their unproven 2nd year QB, the 49ers coach called 37 passing plays vs only 28 runs. At this point, all sportswriters knew this coach was only a glorified offensive coordinator. It was obvious this coach couldn’t act as a head coach and an offensive coordinator. It was obvious to every sportswriter that this coach “stinks.” It was obvious to every sportswriter that taking this QB in the third round was a terrible move that would hurt the 49ers for years. It was obvious this roster was full of overrated players and busts.
Date: October 19th, 1980.
Head Coach/Offensive Coordinator: Bill Walsh
QB: Joe Montana
Alarming!
Thanks for that … Houston … a great lesson fer sure
but… I must ask …
Can history repeat itself .. ?
In terms of the 49ers, I think they will be great again under Shanahan but it won’t happen in the same way Walsh did it. I’m convinced Shanahan is a great coach. He needs to develop on the personnel side and I think he will need to seek to listen before being heard.
In terms of sportswriters being blowhards and having absolutely no clue what they are talking about – it happens every year so that is definitely predictable.
Houston,
Nice find.
Even the genius needed talent to help him become a legend.
I see where you are going but…
Unfortunately there are no Ronnie Lotts, Eric Wrights, or Craleton Williamsons waiting to be drafted in 2019. Moreover there is no Fred Dean like holdout who can be grabbed in a trade in 2019 to shore up the pass rush.
And most importantly: There is no Eddie Debartolo in the owner’s role, burning with a desire to win this time around. Instead we have a Jed York who has to ask mommy and daddy permission before he can so much as order a new box of staples.
Welcome to the land of the perpetual rebuild….
Rick, were Wright and Williamson no miss draft picks in ‘81? I seriously don’t know. Maybe if the Niners draft DBs 1,2,3 next year like they did in ‘81 they just might find sleeper talent (they’d better be at those rounds). As far as a Fred Dean waiting to be traded for, there was this year. Who’s to say there won’t be next year either.
Nice Houston
Ugh I was that game. Secondary was torched repeatedly. No wonder Walsh drafted DBs 1-2-3 the next off season.
Bill Walsh was great. One of his biggest strengths was surrounding himself with terrific people. That’s the area where all of the comparisons between then and now fall flat.
If the Cardinals agree to Patrick Peterson’s trade request, Niners should be looking into a trade, perhaps a second-round pick, which would be in the op 40 most likely. Niners have drafted 10 CBs in the last half decade or so and none have panned out so far.
If Peterson wants to be traded, I am thinking its because he wants to go to a winning team. I know he doesn’t control where he gets traded to, but given how good he has been for the Cards it would be a slap in the face if they sent him to a team just as bad.
I doubt they would agree to only a 2nd rounder or a trade to a division rival anyway.
Seems he just wants to leave the sinking ship:
Adam Schefter
✔
@AdamSchefter
Cardinals’ All Pro CB Patrick Peterson has asked Arizona to deal him by the Oct. 30 trade deadline, per league sources. Peterson feels as if the situation is deteriorating and continues to reaffirm to others that he “desperately” wants out, per source.
11:34 AM – Oct 22, 2018
Something tells me he isn’t interested in abandoning one sinking ship to join another.
This years ship has sailed but it’s not sinking. There are pieces in place, however the Cardinals aren’t going to entertain ideas of trading Peterson to any team in the NFC West regardless. That I can assure you….
I agree with Scooter. He’s not going to want to leave AZ to come to another bad team. I don’t see AZ trading him either unless they get an offer like the Raiders just got for Cooper.
Scooter,
The Cardinals ARE sinking.
The 49ers are learning to swim with floaties. Not a good look, but still above water ?
And yet the Cards beat the 49ers.
Don’t get me wrong, I believe the 49ers are in a better position than the Cards. But the record speaks for itself. I don’t imagine any top line players are gunning for a move to the 49ers right now.
The 49ers should do their best to trade Sherman and Staley to a contender. Let them have a chance to win a SB.
I disagree with that. Staley and Sherman are both going to be counted on to be key players next year. Unless someone offers a lot in compensation for them I would hold onto them.
The Cardinals are a clear example of a team that is playing worse than their talent says they should. If you look at the two rosters side by side, they have more talent than the Niners imo. They were a playoff caliber team a year ago until they lost their QB, and still have some difference makers on the team. The error they made at least so far imo, is they hired a defensive Coach with no experience for a team that still has a number of veterans ready to win now. They took a complete 180 from Arians and it’s blowing up spectacularly.
“They have more talent than the Niners imo”.
Nah, I don’t think so. The offense is rubbish. Its not just the OC, its the overall talent on that side of the ball. A rookie QB with nobody to throw to (Fitz is too old to be more than a complementary piece these days) and an OL that can’t open holes for their one star player. At least the 49ers have a good running game and a TE (Kittle) and WR (Goodwin) worth throwing to.
Scooter,
Their offense has been rubbish but it’s got a lot to do with the OC imo. I don’t know if Byron Leftwich is going to be any better, but he can’t be much worse. When you look at the players individually I see the Cards as having more talent and more key talent especially on the defensive side of the ball. They have a great pass rusher, CB, good S’s, and LB’s, decent OL overall even though they lost their C to injury, great RB, some good young receivers along with old man Fitzgerald. The QB’s are a wash at this point because of Rosen’s youth but he’s a lot more talented than Beathard.
This was an 8-8 team last season even after losing Palmer halfway through the season. I think you are underrating their talent.
https://www.ninersnation.com/platform/amp/2018/10/22/18009772/49ers-rams-pff-grades-week-7-best-worst-arik-armstead-joe-staley-cj-beathard-reuben-foster
I did not think for one second that the 49ers would win this game. I. Did. Not. But… I thought they made some serious strides last week in GB. They did not build off that this week. At all! I expected this game to by a shoot out, much like their first meeting last season. I though it could be entertaining. But it wasn’t. At all!!
CJB is not the guy, but was never expected to be. He is playing because Jimmy G is injured. I am not sure why that is being missed. He is a back up, who was drafted too high because he was thought of has a game manager that could come in and mop up for Cousins when he would sign the following season. That was the plan. He was never drafted to be a starter. He doesn’t play like a starter, no surprise there! But, the games are being planned like he is, which exposes him. Sadly, I think he is the best QB in the building or they would make a switch. Savage, if/when he gets resigned, is not going to come in like Jimmy G and turn a season around. If he was a serious talent, he would be signed somewhere. There is not some guy sitting on the couch unsigned that will come in and save the season. There is no one worth giving up a valuable draft pick to bring in from someone else’s roster. THE SEASON IS OVER. I am just hoping for competitive games, where growth can be seen. Something to build off of.
Kyle is safe this year and even next. Year four is where the rubber hits the road for him. He has to not just win in year four, but reach the playoffs.
In order to do that, they’ll have to load up on talent and you can either draft or sign players. Players are now into player movement and want more say over where they want to play. SF will likely need to overpay, because they aren’t even anywhere close to the Rams. So that leaves the draft. The Niners don’t have all their picks in 2019, because they dealt a fifth to the Lions for Tomlinson. Lynch did not stock up on draft capital in last years draft. They need to deal some players.
It looks like Sherman can still play. The Eagles need a CB. So do the Steelers. Trade Sherman to one of them for a 3rd round pick. Sherman has a very club friendly contract.
I would trade Staley as well. The Vikings have had some line issues. The Texans could really use him. I think they could get a 2nd or a third for Staley. Move McGlinchey to right tackle.
I would also trade Ruben Foster. Fred Warner hasn’t played as well with Foster in the line up. I think they “might” be able to get a 3rd rounder for him. I’d target Tampa since they just lost Kwon Alexander.
If they could get three, third round picks, then they would have some draft capital to move up and get some blue chippers.
Maybe they could deal Armstrong too (a 4th?).
There’s no way this team can compete with this cast, even with Jimmy G and Jet back in 2019.
Get rid of Saleh. The defense has no identity. John Fox as we talked about would work.
I agree with all of this except Foster. If that dude can keep his act together off the field, he is a keeper. Realistically, I am not sure Sherman would get us more than a conditional pick based on his ability to stay on the field. Dude can still ball when he is out there. There would a lot of interest in Staley, I think we could get a third for sure. I am not sure Armstead would get us anything more than a 5th rounder. Saleh is managing to get better as a coach, but I would love to get John Fox or Rex Ryan in as a DC. We need experience, an identity, and a bit of swagger.
Great plan. Get rid of some of their best players for mid round picks. How could this possibly go wrong?
Yup, buy high sell low always a winning strategy for whatever market you are playing in in.
Cheap owners like York have figured out a way to game the system. Year in and year out, the vast majority of the team consists of players playing under their rookie contracts. They almost never sign a player after his Rookie contract. This leads to a perpetual state of rebuild and every year York can pocket a big chunk of salary cap money instead of spending it on putting a competitive product on the field.
The so called salary floor is a total joke. Jed is only required to spend on AVERAGE 89% of the salary cap over a rolling 4 year period. This obviously means that 11% of the salary cap can disappear into the York’s greedy pockets every year. This year the salary cap is 167 million. 11% of 167 mil is 18.3 million.
What are the chances that the Yorks will ever average (or have ever averaged) over 89% of the salary cap over any rolling 4 year period since the black day when Denise and John blackmailed Eddie into signing the 49ers over to them. I bet they have NEVER gone over 89% over any rolling 4 year period. Even during the Harbaugh years they were always way under the cap most years.
I like the NBA salary cap better. In the NBA, if a team does not spend the cap money on players, they are required to distribute the amount under the cap to their players at the end of the season.
I am not a fan of the Yorks, but this idea that they are cheap and the team suffers because of it is complete nonsense. They haven’t signed many players after their rookie contracts because there has been no one worth signing. They drafted so poorly for so long they didn’t have players they wanted to sign long term. They have signed a lot of FAs the past two off seasons and have paid top dollar to get some of them. It’s been a terrible run for the most part under the Yorks, I agree with that, but it’s not because of them being cheap.
Michael Crabtree would have been worth keeping. Mike Iuapati ditto. And just this year Eric Reid.
You did not answer my main point. Have the Yorks ever averaged above the minimum required 89% of the salary cap over any rolling 4 year period since they took ownership of the team. If you can show me even one instance where that happened (even in the Harbaugh years) I will admit I was wrong.
Rick: I have no love for Jed, but is he responsible for averaging above the 89%. Isn’t it up to John, Kyle and Paraag to work together to build the team. Do you have evidence that Jed has told the triumverate that they are not to spend money?
Crabtree has been inconsistent his entire career, Iupati became an afterthought once he went elsewhere, and Tartt was considered by many to be the better of the two safeties. But sure, we should have resigned each player. ?
Crabtree couldn’t find a suitor for sometime when he left the Niners and wound up signing with the Raiders for 3 mill for one season. He was a decent player but letting him go was not a game changer. I don’t think they had a ton of cap room when Iupati came up for FA and they had – or so they thought – other players like Aldon Smith who were going to command big deals in another year.
I don’t know the answer to your question, but there are a couple of things to keep in mind: You always want to have excess cap room for injury protection and the chance that a good player unexpectedly becomes available and there is also the fact that teams don’t have to roll over cap room but the Yorks have done that every year from my recollection. Bottom line is they’ve eaten a ton of money both in players and Coaches, while also handing out a record deal at the time to a QB with 7 career starts. They followed that up by giving the ok to sign a 3rd down back to a top 5 RB contract. They are not keeping the guys making the personnel decisions from spending money. The problem has been the decisions themselves have not worked out more often than not.
The one that got away that really hurt was Delanie Walker. That was all Baalke. Jed kept Baalke around and got rid of Harbaugh. And he compounded it by hiring Tomsula.
The Yorks aren’t cheap. They are football dumb.
Ted Ginn Jr.?
It’s amazing how not being on the 49ers makes players so much more attractive than when they are on the 49ers. Nobody seemed too upset to see Crabtree or Reid leave. Those two received plenty of criticism during their time here, and constantly had many people here and elsewhere calling for them to be replaced. Now they aren’t here they become guys that should never have been let go. Go figure.
Rick, I agree. Jed, under Baalke’s influence, treated the players like they were pieces of meat.And yes, they manipulated the bottom line for profit.
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The most obvious proof of your assertion is that they were so cheap, they jettisoned Harbaugh, and he does not even affect the salary cap. Baalke had such a terrible cheap rep, he could only sign Devey, Pears and Beadles.
.
However, under JL, the mindset has changed. They even over spent for Jet, Juice and Richberg. They signed JG to a huge contract. Still, they have 43 mil under the cap, so your premise is holding true.
.
Players they should have kept? They should have retained veteran leadership by signing Delanie Walker, Iupati, Boone, Gore, Kaep, Hyde, Looney, and Reid. Other players include Crab, Brock, Aaron Lynch, Ellington, Cooper and Easton.
Colbert to IR.
One good thing is Marcell Harris will be eligible to return soon . Let the rookies play, we know what we have with Colbert.
He’s not a FS.
Well, Colbert was drafted as Cornerback and he converted to FS. This regime seems bent on playing players out of their natural position – Like Solomon Thomas, Ward etc.
So I wouldn’t be surprised if they ask him to backup both Safety positions.
Maybe they should look at Tarvarius Moore, who was a safety that they want to convert to CB.
.
Colbert down? Next man up is DJ Reed.
Yes we do, Colbert sucks as a starter and is a backup. He should be treated like one. They gave him a shot at the title. In my eyes, he lost. Back to backup duty where he belongs.
I want to be on record that I am strongly in favor of KS. The buck stops with him as far as team performance is concerned and the team doesn’t look very good right now. The lost against the Cards needed to be reprimanded no excuse for that performance, on the other hand this loss to the Rams, eh, means nothing the team was overly matched. (I hated the first play of the second half).
go sharks.
Dodgers in 6, Kershaw is Series mvp….signs with giants in off-season because Dodgers low balled him on new contract. Why he wasn’t resigned before walk year is beyond me……..
I’ve heard a few Niner fans clamoring for a tank season, I have always felt that is a loser mentality. Sadly, it appears that’s exactly what they are doing by running cjb out there. Just like last year before they stumbled into jg, all they had to do was say yes plz and thank you mr.kraft.
Aside from JG trade, name their top 3 personnel moves……
Agree Undercenter. The buck does stop with the coach, whoever it is, whatever sport it is, and at any level. But, in the end it’s the players that have to perform. As a coach of over 25 years (retired), I understand this. Anyone who has coached understands this. Folks like Grant, Seb and some others on this site, who have never coached so much as a checkers team, don’t understand this. They couldn’t be more wrong, especially when we are talking about professional athletes, not middle school, high school, or even college kids. They don’t have a clue about coaching. Kyle and his staff are working hard to prepare this team, and doing a great job of it. I guarantee it. Once those players are on the field, it is on them to take that preparation and transform it into success. If a player fumbles the ball, thats not the coaches fault. If a QB throws a dumb pick, its not the coaches fault. It’s the players fault, period. They weren’t coached to throw picks, drop easy interceptions and fumble balls. When your coaching less talented players, as Kyle is doing right now, these things are going to happen and your going to lose games, especially in the NFL. The Niners are basically an expansion team right now, and other than yesterday, against probably the next SB winner, they’ve competed. I compliment Kyle for that. He’s handcuffed with an inferior team. Highly inferior. Now I understand that having inferior players is partly Kyle and the entire organizations fault, including previous staffs with the lousy drafting and FA signings they have done. That I agree is their fault. Having said that, this constant “blame the coaching” theme I keep reading from posters (you know who you are) for everything the players are doing wrong is just idiotic. I ask you, at what point do you hold the players accountable for their constant mistakes?
I deja vu’d reading Grants comments after the game. They were very, very similar to comments I read back in 1979 (2-14) and 1980 (6-10) written by Lowell Cohn calling for Bill Walsh’s head with numerous weekly disparaging remarks. It was continuous criticism. Sound familiar? Hopefully our current ownership will treat this nonsense with the same weight that the ownership back then did. After all, we all know how it turned out.
Where did you coach?
Juan, you can blame the players, I blame the coaches, and we both can be partly right.
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I have coached. I helped the Davis Sr High coach, who only had football experience. I outlined basic strategies, and ran drills.I designed plays and assigned positions. I kept records and used them in the assessments. We did well that season.
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I also volunteered coaching the UCD women’s soccer team for 2 seasons. I let others coach the overall strategy,and game management, but I worked individually on defensive techniques, and aided in the practices.
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I played for years in club soccer, and it was coaching by consensus. There were many different styles. Brazilian, Mexican, English, Columbian, Egyptian, Chilean, and home grown American. We made it work.
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I coached coed teams. I taught many novices, and they became good team players. When we played, the men would be restricted to single touches of the ball. the women could dribble all they wanted.
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Then, I finally coached my son’s youth soccer team. I have coached for years and coached all sorts of styles and players. I know a lot about patience, failure, stress, defeat, diplomacy, rules and chaos, but have also known the exhilaration of victory, while making fun the fundamental goal.
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Being a toady for the coaches, and totally absolving them of all blame is specious. Coaching is so important, it is literally the difference between winning and losing.
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When a player drops a ball, the coach should be blamed for not coaching proper techniques. When a ball is fumbled, the coach did not stress ball security, and go over the 5 pressure points, well enough for the player to keep from fumbling. When the player runs the wrong route, it is incumbent on the coach to teach the player well enough so that running that route becomes second nature. With proper preparations, a player will know how to react in any situation, so he plays error free, efficiently and in control. Proper coaching will enable players to maximize their potential. A good coach will accentuate a player’s strengths, and disguise his weaknesses. A competent coach can take any player, and make him better.
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If a QB drops back in the pocket and gets sacked 7 times, is it the fault of the players? Maybe the coach should have devised better protective alignments, and protected the QB by letting him roll away from their best pass rusher.
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If a RB slams into the teeth of the defense and gets 1 yard, is it the player’s fault? No, the coach should have devised a play so that the RB attacks a weakness, and gains 7 yards.
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There have been so many false start penalties, I wonder what the coaches do with their time. They obviously do not instill control and discipline, because the errors keep occurring.
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The coaches control the players, so if a player fails, it is the coaches fault for not directing the player well enough to succeed.
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One wise man once said- With thorough enough preparations, the outcome of the contest will be predetermined.
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If a coach prepares well enough, he will not have to rely on the bounce of the ball to achieve victory.
Coaching is a process. A coach makes plans, devises plays and schemes, assigns players and manages from the side line. Once the game is over, assessments must be made, and if a player is failing, hopefully, there is a superior option. If not, the same player could be used, but the strategy should be adjusted to give him the best chance to succeed.
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If a player keeps making the same mistakes, he should be replaced, but it is not as simple as it seems, or CJB would have been benched by now. It is KS’s decision to keep starting CJB, so if he fails, is it CJB or KS’s fault?
The peninsula 10 and north bay 15 Grant. Ages ranging from 8U’s to 18U’s, high school, summer leagues, and travel ball. How about you?
It’s always the youth coaches who object to coach criticism.
Constructive criticism is essential to success.
No only from former soccer and track runners who think they have a clue about football.
My question to you Grant is when do you hold the players personally responsible for their play on the field?
That’s the coaches job Juan. That’s the point. I too have coached and if a player did something that I expressly told him not to do. I would sit them down, even when it cost a game because I was trying to instill discipline and team mentality.
I hold both players and coaches responsible.
Lol. Thats funny Grant. I wouldn’t know though because I never encountered any criticism. Only accolades. ;) I’m 63 and they’re still trying to get me to come back!
Respect! :)
But I am sincere when I say that you are really good at what you do. You keep me coming back, and many others so kudos to you. I don’t always agree with you but believe it or not I do respect you. Don’t take my needling (the PD as an example, which I have been a subscriber for over 30 years) and other silly stuff. Just trying to get a funny response. I don’t think anybody visiting this site should take anybody too seriously. I certainly don’t. It’s just a fun getaway.
Juan oh yea, I am on the players cases more so then the coaches. A lot of these mistakes are directly on the players….yup they have to perform.
I certainly would have wanted to play for you Seb. No personal accountability whatsoever as a player. How great is that? I could make mistakes all over the field and when I was asked how I did today, I could just say lousy, but its all coach Seb’s fault. The fault in your premise, in just one example of many, is that anytime a player makes a mistake, like dropping a ball, your assuming, outright, that it’s because he wasn’t taught proper techniques. How do you know that? How about maybe he was taught the proper techniques, over and over again, but he still dropped a ball because his talent, or lack of, didn’t allow him to implement what he was taught successfully, every time. His fault, not the coaches.
Let me ask you, since you were there along with me. What changed from 1979 to 1981 on the Forty Niners? Was it the coaching or the talent? I think the coaching was always there. Bill didn’t dramatically change his style between those 2-3 years. What changed was the overall talent on the team. Right? Yes! Of course! Though you always learn and adapt while coaching, and I always did, I personally still kept to the same regiment for most of my career. It worked for me and more importantly my student/athletes. I had some great teams, a bunch of really good teams, some not so great teams, and a few lousy teams. The difference in success was mainly due to the talent level of the players I had. The better the talent, the better the team, and the overall success. The coaching style remained consistent. It’s the players Seb. It’s really that simple. Coaches get too much credit for success, and too much criticism when not.
Let’s face it. Kyle has a horrid team. The lack of talent is staggering, made even worse with the ridiculous amount of injuries. Who’s fault? The entire organization, past and present. He still has them competing, which has to be tough. My hat is off to him. Can he improve as a coach? Yes, and I think he will. Give him some players. Get off his a$$!! :)
Juan, the biggest difference in the evolution of the team was upgrading the personnel.
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However, it also took BW leading them. In fact, the 81 Niners were not superior in talent compared to the Cowboys. Look at the RBs. Bill Ring, Lenvil Elliot, Ricky Patton, Paul Hofer, Amos Lawrence and Earl Cooper.
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Other than Dwight Clark and Freddy Solomon, who were the other WRs? Mike Wilson, Matt Bouza and Mike Shumann. Not very recognizable.
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It took a genius like BW to beat a superior squad. It also took an extreme amount of luck to draft a defensive backfield, and the planets had to align with Joe performing his magic.
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I will agree, the Niners need an upgrade in talent, but the unforced errors, missed tackles and turnovers are all areas where the coaching is lacking. They could avoid those pitfalls with better coaching.
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Get off his arse? ANY 1- 6 coach should expect criticism. That is part of his job description. It is especially true after that embarrassing performance Sunday. I am not calling for his head. I am pointing out deficiencies so I hope KS can learn from his mistakes, and not repeat them. I am making suggestions in how they can improve.
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I wish to differ with you. I do not think this team is horrid. They do have some talent. They shut down Gurley for most of the game. The defense made stops, and forced them to kick field goals. If only they could have avoided giving away the game, they could have been competitive. They just needed better QB play. CJB is like Deberg. JG is kinda like Joe with his accuracy, but he is out of commission. You know who I think would improve the QB position, and his name is not Savage.
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I would have liked to have coached you, Juan, despite your lack of talent. ;p
In the club soccer, our international players allowed us domestic players to thrive. You could have ridden on their coat tails, but they would have given you an earful.
It just goes to show how upgrades in very key areas can make all the difference. I’d say between the 79-80 and the 81 teams were DBs and pass rush. 4 players at most. And another few NFL games of experience under the QBs belt.
No wholesale changes are needed with this current team, no coaching cleanout, just those key upgrades.
Juan,
I agree with your premise regarding the talent disparity.
I believe that we do have players on the team who are still developing and show the ability to become viable stars in the near future.
Young players like McGlinchey, Warner, Foster, Kittle, Breida and perhaps Pettis once he’s healthy are significant foundational pieces.
While the coaches are not exempt from criticism, I do happen to believe that they are setting the team in the right direction.
Coaching and talent is a must. Bill Walsh needed talent to make the west coast scheme work. Walsh had the vision, he just needed the players.
Even in the modern era coaches like Bill Belichick needed talented players to become this century’ genius.
Belichick only had one winning season in his four seasons as the Browns head coach. As great as BB is, he like Walsh, needed talent around him to succeed.
Funny, these are the same excuses used first couple months of last year…no talent, rebuild, 2-3 yrs, blah, blah, blah. Jg shows up and we are the hottest team in the league with that same roster that supposedly was lacking of talent. Doesn’t take a coaching back ground to see these guys aren’t being coached well, jg hid many flaws of ks. Clock and time mngmnt, qb choice other than jg which wasn’t a choice, more of a gift. The guys he hand picked are useless…….and don’t get me started on the running game or the avalanche of penalties each and every wk. Above i asked for 3 good personnel moves they have made and I’m still waiting…….
Juice, Kittle and Goodwin.
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I can hardly argue against you, because I agree that the coaching is lacking.
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However, they needed to clear the stench of Baalke, so they cleaned house and retained only 9 players from the past regime. This was not a big renovation. This was a teardown and total rebuild, brick by brick.
Look, you know I’m not a Shanahan apologist but he did pick up JG (that although gifted was a good move), Kittle, and Breida all seem like decent to good pick ups. There may be others as it is too soon to tell. Though I would say he needs to hit on many more to get this team out of the hole and he and Lynch have certainly not done that in the draft or FA.
dReed,
Garoppolo, Breida, Kittle, Goodwin, McGlinchey, Sherman, Foster just off the top of my head. As for the Avalanche of penalties every week, they took 2 for 10 yards on Sunday. They have the second best running game in the league right now. Stop with the hyperbole and pay attention to what is really happening.
“Garoppolo, Breida, Kittle, Goodwin, McGlinchey, Sherman, Foster just off the top of my head.”
Garoppolo yes if he gets healthy and can stay healthy.
Breida yes if he can stay healthy.
Kittle definitely. Best offensive draft pick.
Goodwin mixed. Good second half to last year but very hit or miss in other 15 games.
McGlinchey mixed but leaning towards yes. Good start against middle of the road guys, struggling a little bit lately with ramped up competition.
Sherman mixed. Teams won’t test him because there isn’t much reason to. Defense doesn’t play worse without him.
Foster mixed. Not a difference maker and easily replaced with little to no drop off. Would expect more from a 1st round pick.
Goodwin was a homerun for what they signed him for and the way he’s played with Garoppolo.
McGlinchey is a rookie which means some inconsistency but he’s played very well overall.
Sherman was signed to a team friendly deal and while he’s missed two games, has looked good when he’s been on the field. He’s also a very good leader.
Foster has struggled at times this year, but his talent is through the roof if he can stay healthy and keep his off the field life in check. He’s one of these guys that we need to be patient with along with Witherspoon.
Goodwin has played ok with Beathard too when he’s been on the field. That’s been the issue with him this year and years prior to 2017.
McGlinchey I agree, and think there’s some upside there and he’s going to be a good player. Can he become a dominant player like you’d want from a top 10 pick we’ll see.
Sherman is a good talker, not nearly the same guy he once was and doesn’t really help the team.
Fosters talent is through the roof? He makes some tough plays, misses some easy ones and his tackling has taken a step back. Very overrated.
I disagree. Sherman helps the team both on and off the field. Foster as I said has struggled at times but has a lot of talent. Way too soon to make an assumption on what he is long term.
I’m wondering how all those wins last year helped to breed a winning culture on this team? Conversely are they learning apathy now?
Easily one of the funniest topics around here in the offseason.
Each year is it’s own story. That debate didn’t make a lot of sense.
That’s all well and true, I was using the five games losing by three points or less as points of reference – which is equally as bad. Yea well…..
Lol Seb, definitely lack of talent on the soccer field! Lots of speed, but not much footwork! My point about get off his a$$ pertains to you and others “pointing out deficiencies” to people that have forgotten more about football then you will ever know. That’s the humorous part about this sight that keeps me coming back. Couch hacks offering suggestions on how to better coach! It’s great stuff!
As for coaching you, I think the first order of business would be to tell you to shut the “F” up and listen! Presuming you small in stature and fast, I’d probably coach you as a lead off left handed slap hitter, getting you on base and letting you steal your way around the diamond. Can you catch a ball? Center field maybe? ;-)
Juan, when the ‘genius’ KS presents a team that acts like the Keystone Cops, I am not impressed.
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If he was 6-1, I would be quiet and let him coach, but at 1-6, KS deserves no praise. His team is unfocused, unprepared and undisciplined. KS is not above reproach.
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The problem is, KS has forgotten more football than me, so now I believe he has gotten so clueless, he does not know how to coach.
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The very first thing he should do is hire an OC. An OC might help him, and the team. No one has explained to me how hiring an OC would hurt the team. It might hurt KS’s feelings, but at 1-6, KS needs all the help he can get.
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My feelings are hurt having our beloved team embarrassed like last game. The Rams shaped the Niners, and the offensive ineptitude was just too glaring. KS, being the Head Coach, owns that 1-6 record. His player assessments are garbage. First, he thought Hoyer was competent, then he thought CJB is the answer, now he is insulting our intelligence with Savage.
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BTW, I fully admit I was probably the slowest player on the team, but I also was proficient in defense, and few could dribble around me, because I learned from some masters of the craft. My position was Left Fullback, so I usually had the speediest right footed forward on the opposition to mark. Our defenses worked together, each supporting each other as a cohesive unit. I knew exactly where to be, and the others could count on me to do my job. Some years, I played like the Orange Crush strategy. I would attack up field and try to double team against a position, and center the ball to the penalty mark for a dangerous play. Then I would sprint back to my position.
Seb, I never claimed he was a genius. Saying he “stinks” (not you) is a bit much though. Agree he needs an OC. Always have. Also a DC and a ST.