As hard as he tries, you’d think Nick Mullens would get a break. That’s not how this works

Nick Mullens made some nice throws Sunday, and some he never should have attempted.  (AP Photo/Ross D. Franklin)

By now it almost seems cruel to keep running Nick Mullens out there as the 49ers quarterback.

Everyone can sense the poor guy is giving it everything he’s got. He’s energetic and enthusiastic. He is cooperative and honest in interviews.

And he just can’t do it.

Asked to assess Mullens’ performance in Sunday’s 23-15 loss to Washington, former 49er QB Jeff Garcia said he was “very sporadic, late on throws, not very accurate.” That’s a trifecta of bad quarterbacking.

But what are you going to do? If anything third stringer C. J. Beathard hangs onto the ball longer. Jimmy Garopollo is still high ankle sprained, presumably returning for the last two games.

But this was definitely the nadir for Mullens. I have a recurring vision of him sprinting frantically down the field, hoping to catch the defender who had just taken the ball from him. No such luck. His fumble was returned 47 yards to the end zone and his long, looping throw to the sideline was collected by a waiting Kamren Curl and returned for a 76-yard TD.

Coach Kyle Shanahan called the interception return and the 17 points given up by his offense a “borderline backbreaker.” And if that was only “borderline,” I think we’d all hate to see a genuine backbreaker.

The really tough part was both turnovers were the kind of preventable mistakes that Mullens has clearly been drilled on. The fumble came with him holding the ball in one hand in traffic, a recipe for a swatted turnover. And kudos for going to alternate receiver choices, but that pick personified the Mullens experience.

It was the end of the third quarter, the game was in reach, 16-7, and he had the team moving. He had just converted a third-and-11. They were inside the Washington 25, it was second-and-two. Mullens was flushed out of the pocket, spotted Kyle Juszczyk as his outlet and tried a long throw to the sideline while on the move. Curl was standing five yards up the field, waiting and watching Mullens. It is true that Juszczyk turned upfield, but Curl broke on the ball immediately.

Again, it’s second down. You’re on the edge of the red zone. There is nothing there. Throw it away.

Afterward, for the first time, Mullens looked shell-shocked (at least to someone watching on a screen.) He must have said, “I have to take care of the ball” five times. What you have to wonder is if he has lost the trust of the team. Have the players given up on him?

All of which is building into a big, tight ball of quarterback anxiety over these last three games. And that’s true for everyone, from GM John Lynch to third-stringer C. J. Beathard. And, by the way, you can count on us in the media to try to contribute plenty of wild speculation and knee-jerk opinions.

But consider: If the 49ers stick to the Jimmy G for the last two games plan, there’s still next week’s game with Dallas to deal with. Do you stick with Mullens? Or go with Beathard?

Because the 49ers could beat Dallas. It’s not just their 4-9 record. The Cowboys were publicly called out by their former franchise quarterback, Troy Aikman last week. The Hall of Famer said “I feel like they gave up a little bit,” in a loss to Baltimore.

And if the 49ers were to beat Dallas they would keep their faint, but the mathematical, chance of making the playoffs alive. Which would then make the game with Arizona, the day after Christmas, kind of a big deal.

So to review: Shanahan has to make a call on a starter for the Dallas game. Mullens probably, but Beathard has to believe this could be his last chance to show something to the rest of the league. Mullens, meanwhile, wants a shot at redeeming himself in hopes that his career is not over.

And now this Garoppolo start is taking on oversize importance. He, of course, is well versed in the chatter around the team that there is the consideration of cutting ties with him and saving some $25 million in each of the next two years. He’ll be coming off an extended injury layoff, and he knows every move will be scrutinized. We keep talking about Garoppolo’s “even keel” personality. This would be a great time to show that.

And, let’s not forget that Shanahan/Lynch are going to have to make a quarterback call. They can remember what Jimmy G. did in the past, but they’re going to judge him on what he sees right here and now. It is critical that they get this right.

So, given all that, I am going to offer a little unsolicited advice. Earlier in the year Shanahan made a reference to the fact that he doesn’t exactly toss compliments around. Which is very football, although maybe a little old school.

And he’s a stickler for getting things right. Which – not many compliments, but quick to point out errors – is kind of a setup for undermining confidence. Shanahan is a smart guy. I continue to be impressed with how he’s handling public appearances – despite this awful year, he hasn’t gotten defensive.

But playoffs or not, the last three weeks of the season are going to be fraught with tension. Decisions will be made there that will affect the direction of the franchise for years to come.

I just feel like everybody could use a little positive reinforcement.

This article has 886 Comments

    1. Call it informed intuition but I concluded after game one that this team was not going to the playoffs this season. One can tell a lot from an opening game. I felt even before the injuries that production would be down, even in Bosa and Kittle. I was
      saddened by how right I was.

  1. The offensive line played well. McKivitz gave up no pressures. Bodes well going into next year.

    If we’re drafting 10-12, Lance could fall right into our lap.

    1. Lance is the guy I want. Not a flawless prospect, but I really like what I have seen.

      I take your point from previous posts about being worried about him starting as a rookie though. They probably should have a decent vet around that is capable of starting and holding the fort while he gets up to speed. If he needs to sit for a year then so be it.

      1. I feel that way as well, and like him better than Wilson believe it or not.

        I know he is further behind but I think with his traits Kyle could scheme up so many plays to give him easy yards while he matures. The Deebo, pop pass for example, with threat of Lance Pulling it back and going the other way could freeze the defense up for a bit, then their are the routes you can run with it, so if the backside safety or corner decides to cheat up to to take make lance pay, a receiver going deep or a TE leaking back could be counter to it.
        That and safeties knowing that he can really push the ball down the field with accuracy (deep outs, fly routes completed with around 50 air yards) should open up holes for the running game. If that goes well he should have some really defined reads with larger than normal windows as the threat of these will stretch defenses every way possible.
        Additionally, the concepts should be similar because NDSU asked him to do a lot of the same things Kyle does and they appear to run a lot of the same plays.

        1. That’s definitely part of it Shoup – the fit in the system.

          But I also really like his game in general. He has all the physical tools you could want. He’s calm and poised in the pocket. While he wasn’t pressured often at NDSU, when he was he showed he can navigate a muddy pocket as well as escape pressure, and keep his eyes downfield to make plays. Obviously he is a winner, and that includes winning some tight games where not everything has gone his way. Takes care of the football. Despite being on the younger side, he seems quite mature from everything I have read. To me he looks like a guy that once he gets up to NFL speed he could be a consistently good performer. He may not have the real wow plays that a guy like Zach Wilson can make, but I think he also won’t have as many WTF plays.

          1. Scooter:

            I haven’t been able to watch any of Lance’s games. Since you seem to be following him, let me ask you this question. Why should we feel that Lance will be a success when Carson Wentz’s arrow is trending way down?

            1. Wentz was good (to the point he was in the MVP conversation just a few season ago), but injuries have affected him. He’s not the player he used to be.

              If Lance can be what Wentz used to be that would be an excellent outcome.

          2. I agree, and the only reason I mentioned the traits that I did were because I believe they could allow him some success year one, while he adjusts to the pro game.

            1. Agreed. Shanahan wouldn’t want to give him a full playbook, but I definitely think Shanahan could tailor the offense around his skills year 1 and produce a good offense.

    2. I was struck by how many fans, bloggers and podcasters have been ready to dismiss McK after just one or two games considering the important role of the off-season or the lack thereof for a rookie O lineman.

      On “Big Slim’ McG, Baldy thought that it was technique issues with his pass blocking. Didn’t mention anything about his weight.

      If McKivitz continues to improve and McGlinchey continues to shrink, I’m gonna call them Big Mac and Small Mac.

        1. Yup, the one without cheese needs another beef patty.

          Turns out, McKivitz had a pretty good game — didn’t allow a single QB pressure against the top D line. He followed thru his blocks all game and even had a pancake

          Big Slim Mc is unlucky that his poor plays come at critical moments. One Niner tackle has allowed 5 sacks and the other has allowed 3 sacks. Want to guess who has allowed more sacks?

              1. A question – are you using this stat as a basis to say McGlinchey hasn’t been that bad, or that Williams has been worse? If you use it to suggest either of those things then imo you’re using the stat inappropriately. But not sure that is what you’re getting at.

              2. I’m using it in jest to show that (1) small sample sizes can be misleading, and (2) indirectly suggesting QB pressures are a better measure of protection than sacks. IIRC, Small Mac has allowed many more pressures than the Silverback. Some of Williams sacks came for misunderstanding with Tomlinson or a back supposed to pick up a blitzer. There is no comparison between the two.

                At the same time, I don’t think that the Big Slim is the Big Bust. His issue seems more technique than weight based on what I have heard from multiple ex-NFL D linemen turned-analysts including Baldy and Dennis Brown. He’ll get his 5th year option picked up but needs to work with his buddy Staley in the offseason on anchoring technique and hand usage on obvious technique.

              3. Scooter,
                No one can argue that McGlinchey has been better than Williams but if you believe Matt Barrows McGlinchey hasn’t been as bad as people think (other than his 4th quarters) If his 1st 3 quarters have been as solid as Barrows said they were then I don’t believe that it will be too difficult to get McGlinchey back to his 2019 playing level. Which was no worse than the middle of the pack when it comes to pass protection and an A+ run blocker.

              4. I don’t get why people get so worked up about McGlinchey. No worries with this dude. He’s committed. He’ll come back next season a better player with more continuity working next to McKivitz….

              5. I don’t get why people get so worked up about McGlinchey. No worries with this dude. He’s committed. He’ll come back next season a better player with more continuity working next to McKivitz….

                Very ironic coming from you somebody who has turned the page on a QB who took us to the SB less than a year ago. I agree with you on McGlinchey. The negative opinions are based on mistakes that come at very inopportune times. Overall he’s still a good fit for this system at RT and will likely improve his game with continuity across the line. I see the same thing in JG.

              6. Yeah cool. I have seen some people using those stats as a away of inferring McGlinchey hasn’t played poorly or that Williams hasn’t been much better, both of which are wrong.

                McGlinchey has been very poor this year. Blaming it as a 4th quarter thing only is not accurate. He has struggled with power in pass pro all year, and it has translated to issues with speed as well as he sometimes oversets for power to compensate. However, what I do agree with is that it is fixable. Get his weight and strength right, like it was in 2019, and he’s a fine RT.

                The issues with the OL heading into 2021 is the interior, assuming they re-sign Williams.

  2. I listened to Matt Barrow on KNBR this morning. He spoke about McGlinchey he said something that I found very surprising. He said that if you grade McGlinchey in the 1st 3 quarters of games he grades out very well. Then if you grade his 4th quarter performance he grades out as extremely terrible. I believe his problem is more than weight loss but his conditioning is very bad. That is something that is very correctable. So if that is McGlinchey problem and they resign Williams they only have to worry about their IOL. We may have the answer to one of those position McKivitz, Brunskill or even Shepley. Could let us pay more attention to pass rusher and CB. The only QB’s I would use a 1st on would be Lawerence, Fields or maybe MAYBE Wilson after that we should wait until the 4th round and pick Book. Trade back and load up.

  3. I think they should start Bethard this week. I’ve seen enough of Mullen’s to last me a lifetime. I know the plan is to start JG the last 2 games but hopefully only if he is 100%. They aren’t going to make the playoffs and they know who Mullen’s is. Give Bethard one last chance. They will both be gone after this season.

    1. Shanahan said that JG and Kitt could be back for the last two games of the season. If he decides to shut them down instead, I suspect that Shanahan has thrown in the proverbial towel.
      Perhaps the best thing for the 49ers right now is to position themselves for a higher draft pick.

      Not going for a first down on 4th and 1 with about 5min left in the game didn’t look like a head coach who was desperate to win.
      But that’s just one man’s opinion.

      1. I think they should have gone for it, but when the punt died at the one yard line, I was hoping for a safety, so it turned out well.
        5 minutes is a lot of time, and I am glad they saved their time outs to stop the clock.

      2. Normally I completely agree, but I think he read the tea leaves well in this game. Washington wasn’t moving the ball and SF’s defense probably had as much chance of scoring as their offense when they were able to down it that close to the goal line.

  4. If McKvitz has done so well this last game, maybe they should move him to RT, and move McGlinchey to RG. That holding penalty caused them to be a few yards short, dooming the game tying drive.
    There were false starts and dropped passes, so nobody shined. I hope they go all out to win, and start JG. The Niners do have the slimmest of chances, but they would be throwing in the towel if they start Mullens again. He is actually hurting his team with his preventable mistakes. If not JG, CJB should start instead of Mullens. Maybe CJB is mobile enough to avoid the pass rush.
    Since this season has ended this way, maybe they should go bold and think outside the box. Move Arik Armstead to TE to help with the blocking. He played forward in basketball, so he should be able to catch the ball. Maybe line him on the right side, to aid McGlinchey. With the emergence of Givens, the stellar play of Hyder, and the surprisingly good play of Dion Jordan, Arik Armstead is not critically needed on the D line.
    The Niners may be out of the playoffs, but they should still strive to win. Winning is contagious, just like losing is. Losing out sets such a bad example, and displays a losing mindset. I hope the Niners can at least be a spoiler against their last 3 teams.

    1. Armstead is outstanding when they play him inside. Just let the kid where he fits and that ain’t TE. Next years DL will be Bosa, Armstead, Kinlaw and Hyder if they don’t draft a DE and they will be very good.

      1. Well, Armstead was pretty invisible last game, so he may be of better use as a blocker. If Bruce Miller can be converted from a DE to FB, Armstead could do the same sort of thing. Imagine comparing Dwelley to Armstead. Armstead can put O linemen on skates. Dwelley may bounce off of pass rushers.

    1. Coach,
      It’s taken about three seasons for Mayfield to hone his skills. But it also helps when the Browns are perennial losers and have high draft picks.
      The Browns aren’t pretenders, they look like the real deal this year.

      Their headcoach has done a very good job of galvanizing all the talent they’ve accrued over the last four years.

  5. If he keeps playing like he did last night I don’t think anyone cares if he is active politically. The bigger question about him is cvan he stay injury free?

    1. That’s my point. He hasn’t evolved his game as a quarterback, and Greg Roman hasn’t evolved his offense. It’s Roman/Kaepernick 2.0. He’ll be out of the league when the mileage on his tread wears out….

      1. Watching Jackson slice through the defense like a hot knife through butter was impressive. Then he rolled right, the DBs became discombobulated, forgetting about the receivers, and Jackson threw a strike to Brown for an easy TD. He is a true dual threat QB. Roman learned from his mistakes with Kaep, and is not forcing Jackson to be only a pocket passer.
        BTW, gratz on winning a playoff spot. I thought you would defeat me this last game. The projections had us neck and neck. Then, during Sunday, I thought I had it wrapped up with Henry, but Monday, Chubb came roaring back. Fortunately for me, Landry saved my skin. Good luck, I hope you win it all.

      2. Razor, that’s the issue with QBs that rely so heavily on their running ability. It doesn’t last. Not only do teams plan against it, age and injuries catch up over time. And one thing you can’t have is your QB consistently missing time due to being nicked up (as we all know all too well).

        The ability to pick up yards with your legs is a nice ability to have, but it has to be a secondary skill.

        Jackson’s game is largely built off his running ability, much like Vick’s was. He’ll have some fantastic games, but I seriously doubt his game will last the test of time unless he improves considerably as a pocket passer.

        1. That’s where the dual threat definition comes in for me. If a QB uses his legs to generate a large percentage of his offensive production then that is a dual threat. A QB who is mobile enough to run for a first down once in awhile and buy time in the pocket is a pocket passer. Even JG who is thought to be a poor athlete is capable of this and was actually one of the better passers in the league outside the pocket last season from what I remember. I don’t want a runner who looks to escape at the first sign of trouble and that is usually what the dual threat does imo.

  6. The jury is still out on whether Jackson’ athleticism will be enough to secure a SB ring.

    While Jamar is a phenomenal athlete, he still needs to work on his accuracy.
    He’s going to find out in 3-4 more years from now that passing skills will outweigh running.
    IMO, the Ravens window for a chance at a SB will depend on Jackson’ sustainability.

    1. Jackson will not develop his passing game under Roman, whose passing play design for Jackson, according to Greg Cossell, is very simplistic. Also not sure how interested Jackson is to put in the work for developing his passing game. With his QB skillset as it is now, and with Allen and Mahomes as contemporaries, I don’t see the Ravens winning the Conference let alone the Super Bowl. But they can have some 10+-win seasons with Jackson, and he has definitely helped extend Harbaugh’s coaching career.

      1. Maybe simplistic isn’t such a bad thing. In his last 8 years as an OC, Roman’s offenses have been worse than 12th in scoring only once.

        1. Being simplistic is not bad, but it sets you plumb in the mediocre column, as in that scoring metric. Even for mediocrity, Roman’s offense depends on a strong defense where the offense does not have to play down two scores. It’d be interesting to see where the ranking of Roman’s offense would be based on games where all the teams where down two scores starting from the beginning of the second quarter.

          When playoff comes, every team will have a plan to effectively take away Jackson’s running, The D’s will try hard to shut down the running lanes and scheme up zone coverages that will muddy the middle of the field and test Jackson to (1) rapidly read coverages shifting after snap, (2) forcing him to make fast decisions, and (3) throw accurately outside the numbers. No more man coverages where defenders turn their back to him.

          Sure, with a championship caliber D and strong ST (Harbaugh’s strength), Jackson could win the Super Bowl . But he’d still have to be more accurate and read coverages better, say as well as Foles.

    2. The Ravens have also been devastated with injuries.
      You know me, I have never been impressed with Roman.
      Jackson needs a better defense, because he cannot out score every team. I think he is accurate enough, but you seem to disagree, and that is fine.

  7. I know that the game on Sunday was rough, but check out the film breakdown when you have some time. Different format this week. No Good Nick/Bad Nick. Just ran through the game as it happened. If you’ve watched the previous shows, let me know what you think of the format change.

      1. Oof. Mullens missed so many open players. He also stared down receivers, and forced it into tight coverage.
        It is nice to watch the end zone views, to see how the blocking succeeded, and failed. Both Mullens and McGlinchey are hurting their team, so they should voluntarily bench themselves. Another thing I noticed were all of the drops by Bourne. Richie James should replace him, until Bourne learns to catch the ball.

        I am glad they modulated the mikes, so Grant is not shouting while Jack is whispering. Good content, but maybe they should try to keep the podcast to around 30 minutes because over an hour seems a little long. I think they could get their points across within a shorter period of time.

  8. So I’ve had a chance to view the top QB prospects in the upcoming draft, and frankly I am not sure why fans are ready to dump Garoppolo for one of them. The only one I think would work is Zach Wilson, but I feel like he is Garoppolo 2.0 based on what I have seen and read. Trey Lance is considered by some analysts to be a year or two from starting, and I concur with that assessment. Finally, Mac Jones looks the part, but he seems to be more of a benefactor of that Alabama WR corps rather than a main factor; he also seems like a QB who needs the right system and protection in front of him to be able to play well.
    Bottom line is none of these three prospects move the needle for me to even feel comfortable about the 49ers taking with their first round pick. Edge, CB, S, and OL (not necessarily in that order) are the areas I still prefer the 49ers address with their first round pick.

    1. “Bottom line is none of these three prospects move the needle for me”.

      I would argue that not moving the needle at a fraction of the cost would make taking one of the QBs a bit of a no brainer decision for me.

      “Trey Lance is considered by some analysts to be a year or two from starting”.

      Being able to sit for a year probably wouldn’t be the worst thing in the world for him, but sitting for two years? If a coaching staff can’t get him ready after a year they should be fired. And tbh, I think analysts saying he is a year or two away are basing that purely on his lack of experience, not his ability to pick up an offense. What he showed in 2019 is he is capable of picking up an offense and executing it at a very high level quickly.

      “Zach Wilson, but I feel like he is Garoppolo 2.0”.

      I will need you to explain that one for me.

      1. I would argue that not moving the needle at a fraction of the cost would make taking one of the QBs a bit of a no brainer decision for me.

        That is based on only part of what I said in that sentence; the rest of it states that it doesn’t move the needle for me to feel comfortable with the team taking a QB with their first round pick. In other words, I don’t see the sense in it where there are areas of bigger concern.

        And tbh, I think analysts saying he is a year or two away are basing that purely on his lack of experience, not his ability to pick up an offense. 

        It is also because his mechanics need a good amount of work on them. Lance has the highest ceiling of the QB prospects, but he needs to get drafted by a team who can sit him for at least a year.

        WRT Wilson, see my response to Shoup.

        1. “I don’t see the sense in it where there are areas of bigger concern.”

          The sense of it is the team can use the cap space saving of going with a rookie instead of JG to shore up those “areas of bigger concern”.

          “It is also because his mechanics need a good amount of work on them.”

          His mechanics? How so? He has very good mechanics. Crisp footwork, good base, nice throwing action. Nothing wrong with his mechanics.

    2. I agree with the idea to focus on Defense and Oline rather than take a QB, but I don’t see Wilson as Garoppolo 2.0. Wilson seems far more athletic and leaves the pocket quickly if pressured (which hasn’t been very often which is another concern of mine with him) while Garoppolo stands in there to make a play sometimes to long. Wilson actually looks like he could be a good prospect though along with the other 3 that seem to be top ten candidates. I just think the Niners are better off gaining more picks if possible and strengthening the secondary, pass rush and C position.

      1. Tend to agree with you in general. But Shanalynch have repeatedly said that they want a difference maker in the first round. If a QB they like is on the board and graded significantly better on their board than the nearest first-round edge rusher, I can see them taking the QB.

        1. There’s always that possibility. I’ve been giving my opinion on it and what I think will happen but it wouldn’t be the first or last time I’ve been wrong if they do wind up drafting a QB in the first round. If they win another game or two it will be a moot point most likely because they won’t be in position to draft one of the top guys.

  9. Why Garoppolo 2.0?
    Just curious about your thoughts.

    As to Jones, I like him and would take him but no where near the first rd. Maybe late 2nd at the earliest but more likely in the 3rd.

    1. Both guys:
      – have a quick release
      – a bad habit of sometimes putting the ball into contested traffic instead of finding a better option
      – are best when throwing in a rhythm and not so much on long passes
      – tend to get too cute
      – have an issue with injuries
      – do not always set their feet when throwing a long pass
      – at times try to do too much
      – are inconsistent in taking what the defense is giving them
      – every now and then telegraph where they are going with the football
      -are considered to have good leadership skills

      1. Some of this I can see, others not at all.

        Wilson’s long passing game is one of his biggest strengths. Very accurate and catchable deep pass when he can set his feet. Even when he can’t he has plenty of arm strength to make the throws, but his accuracy can suffer (as it does for most QBs in that situation).

        Wilson is not really a rhythm passer. When he plays in rhythm he can do so well, but one of my biggest issues with him is that he tends to hold the ball waiting for longer developing plays. Very early years Roethlisberger-esque.

        Key differences between Wilson and JG are that Wilson loves throwing outside the hashes, and can do so accurately, and he is very happy to push the ball downfield, and can do so accurately.

        1. I believe that Wilson will be the 3rd QB off the board in the draft. I’m putting him just a smidgen ahead of Trask because of his ability to throw on the run and extend plays.

          I watched Trey Lance in the conference championship game last season against James Madison and although he won, he was greatly helped by a couple of PI’ against JMU’ CB’.

          Lance did enough to win the game, but I didn’t feel like he was dominant. He also got lucky on a couple of miscues by not turning the ball over.
          IMO. Lance would not be a day one starter.
          He will need some work, especially in his rookie season.
          But he may have the highest ceiling among all the DT QBS.

          Is he better than Wilson? The numbers can be debated. But he is about 2″ taller and 25lbs heavier and that makes me feel more comfortable when he needs to run out of the pocket.

    2. I also like Jones but don’t see him as a good fit for Shanahan’s offense. I also believe the Alabama WR corps makes him better and not vice versa.

  10. No matter what, they should not move on from JG, just because of the salary cap. They should not move on from a SB QB, until they have a superior replacement.
    Counting on an untested rookie is just fool’s gold. It takes a quantum leap from the college game to the NFL. The best strategy would be to draft a QB, then let him sit and study behind JG for a couple years, like Rodgers did with Favre, and Mahomes did with AS.
    Mullens just played his way off the team. He is a liability. It is hard enough to defeat an opponent, without having the QB give the game away. Running around while holding the football like a loaf of bread just shows that he does not have a clue about ball security.
    CJB may hold onto the ball too long, but at least he holds onto the ball. It would be hard for CJB to be worse than Mullens.

  11. We all have an opinion regarding the upcoming quarterback class, but I think we can all agree that the potential is there with the first four. The status quo at the position isn’t going to move the needle any further. Lynch/Shanny/Peters/Mayhew, they’re all getting paid a lot of money. Seems to me they’re at a crossroads where a decision has to be made that could either make or break the franchise. I can think of a hell of a lot worse quarterback classes to have to make that decision. But if they decide to punt that decision into next year, play it safe and draft a later day quarterback, tell us they liked him better than higher drafted ones; I’ll start to question their confidence in assessing the position and being able to develop it….

    1. Razor,
      I would say 3 not 4 and if they continue to lose I think they will have a chance at #3 without trading back. Even then I will have no problem with them trading back multiple times to take care of our salary cap for a few years and getting younger and better. What I will have a problem with is if they stand pat and one of those QB’s are available and they don’t pull the trigger unless of course they can pick up a once in a generation talent like Bosa but I don’t see any Bosa’s in this draft, yet.

    2. The status quo at the position isn’t going to move the needle any further.

      The best options though are not attainable since Lawrence and Fields will be off the board unless the 49ers choose to trade up to the first or second pick. Meanwhile, Lance needs time to fine tune his mechanics, but the 49ers are not in a position to do that. And if you want Wilson, then the team should just stick with Garoppolo because they are one in the same.

      1. Yea, I’m not sure we’re watching the same quarterback if you think Wilson and Garoppolo are the same. The only similarities I see is the quick release. Jimmy Garoppolo can’t throw the out from the opposite hash, and Wilson isn’t a turnover machine.

    3. The problem is- the Jets, Bengals and Jags have the first 3 picks pretty much locked up, and their fans will howl if they do not draft QB.
      The Chargers, Texans, Eagles, Cowboys, Panthers and Falcons all have worse records than the Niners, and the Giants and Lions both have equally bad records as the Niners. 8 teams that could all have worse records than the Niners, so the Niners may be picking 12th. That would put them out of the QB sweepstakes, and after the top 4 QB prospects, none of the others could be guaranteed successes.
      Moving up in the draft will just result in the Niners having only one pick in the first 3 rounds. It is a better strategy to trade back a couple times, and get 5 picks in the first 3 rounds, because then, the Niners could draft an OT, CB,G, DE and Center.
      I will say it again. The Niners may draft another Joe Montana, but he will fail if the O line keep acting like turnstiles. If they cannot afford JG, they certainly cannot afford TW.
      Some may compare TW with McGlinchey, but to me, McGlinchey is far inferior. Yes, TW may have allowed sacks, but McGlinchey acts like he is on roller skates, letting the pass rusher to collapse the right side. At least TW will put his pass rusher on the ground, at times, and can anchor well.
      Another elephant in the room that no one is talking about, is Laken Tomlinson. He is also struggling mightily, so the entire O line may need upgrading.

        1. Burrow tore his MCL and ACl, so they may not want a one legged QB.
          The history of NFL players coming back from ACL/ MCL injuries, is not promising. He also sustained additional knee cartilage damage. He may return in 2022, but I am not going to hold my breath.

          1. They aren’t going to give up on the #1 overall pick after 1 season, especially given he played well.

            They probably will be in the market for a vet option though to play while Burrow recovers.

            1. Sure, he played well, but that was before he tore his ACL, MCL and meniscus.
              Can you name any players who have recovered fully from such a devastating injury, and played as well as he had before his injury? The only 2 I can think of is Adrian Peterson and NaVorro Bowman, and Bowman was a shell of his former self.

              1. Carson Palmer and Carson Wentz are two QB examples that had similar injuries. One came back fine, the other was fine until he then hurt his back. As was the case with both of them, the team will stick with Burrow.

              2. It is all relative. Wentz walked back to the side line. Burrow had one of his O linemen fall on his knee, and was carted off, so Wentz’s knee injury was not as devastating. Now, they are howling to bench Wentz.
                Palmer was a poster child for players who never played as well as he did before his injury. His entire career was pretty pedestrian.
                I would say, those 2 QBs prove my point. BTW, Burrow also suffered a partial tear to his PCL.

              3. Deshaun Watson
                Tom Brady
                Donovan McNabb
                Sam Bradford
                Teddy Bridgewater

                Some pretty good QB’s there who came back and played well.

                Seb, looks like you enjoy egg on your face!

              4. Wentz tore his ACL and LCL. It was a significant injury. Yet he was ready to start the next season and was playing well up until he hurt his back.

                Palmer’s knee injury in 2006 was very similar to Burrow’s. Shredded multiple ligaments. Happened at the end of the 2006 season, in the playoffs. Palmer was back starting at the beginning of the next season. Palmer’s best seasons came later in his career, after the injury.

                The Bengals are in no way, shape or form going to move on from Burrow due to this injury. You are being ridiculous, as usual.

              5. Reading is fundamental.
                Recovery from an ACL tear is pretty common, with the miracle of modern medicine.
                However, I was referring to players who had ACL and MCL tears. Good for you, you used Tom Freakin’ Brady. He is one of a kind. For every Brady, I could cite hundreds that did not make it back. Warner was never mobile before. Bridgewater was the next RG3, but he is a shell of his former self. Has Bradford ever achieved, greatness?
                Burrow may more likely follow Marcus Lattimore’s career path, over Brady’s. Burrow tore his ACL, MCL and partially tore his PCL, along with meniscus damage.
                Zac Taylor is confidently declaring that Burrow will play next season, but that is just Coach Speech. They said the same thing about AS, and he almost lost his leg.

              6. Scooter, they may be forced to move on from Burrow. Realistically, they should be expecting his return in 2022. They better draft a QB, because Brandon Allen and Ryan Finley are scraping the bottom of the barrel. Kaep is superior to those 2.
                However, you may be right. I am thinking that the Bengals are not that stupid. The Bengals have made so many stupid mistakes, making a smart move may be beyond their expertise. They do have talent, because they are picking high in the draft most years, but they just keep shooting themselves in the foot.
                Now, you are assuming they will rush him back, and throw him to the wolves, AGAIN. What could possibly go wrong?

              7. No, I am assuming they do not want to give up on their #1 pick from last year by picking a #3 overall pick QB in this year. They will sign a vet as a placeholder in case Burrow isn’t ready next season. It is common sense.

              8. But you and others have been touting these QBs as slam dunk/ can’t miss winners.
                Yup, I could see them thinking that way. Let’s count on a QB with a shredded knee, going against the Browns, Ravens and Steelers twice a year. Bring in any drek QB, because no decent FA QB will touch this team with a 10 foot pole. They will be ecstatic, being rewarded with such a high draft pick. Too bad that is what perennially losing franchises do.

              9. “But you and others have been touting these QBs as slam dunk/ can’t miss winners.”

                As you said earlier, reading is fundamental. I most certainly have never said that.

                If you think the Bengals are giving up on their #1 overall pick from last year you are delusional. So… nothing new to see here.

              10. Mid- ‘Bottom line is none of these three prospects move the needle for me.’
                Scooter- ‘I would argue that not moving the needle for a fraction of the cost would make taking one of the QBs a bit of a no brainer decision for me.’
                Yup, writing is fundamental, too.

              11. Yes, reading and comprehension, very important. You lack the latter.

                It should be clear in that statement that what I am saying is that if Mid believed taking one of those QBs didn’t move the needle compared to JG, then drafting one makes perfect sense given the cost saving. But hey, I am not surprised you didn’t understand that.

              12. Yup, your no brainer appellation fits.
                On one hand, you think that JG is equal to those 3 QBs, then you infer that the cost savings is worth it, when I think that going cheap on a QB produces cheap results. Drafting an inferior QB is not worth the cost, which usually entails losing.
                Your problem is that I understand you too well. I can read you like a book. No, an untested rookie QB is not superior to a SB QB, no matter how many times you surmise about the possibilities. The Niners should consider JG like they would treasure a precious ruby, and build a team around him. They should give him adequate protection, and potent weapons.
                That is why I want them to trade back, to get more draft picks in the first 3 rounds. The Niners had 2 first round picks, then nothing until the 5th round. They missed out on all the talent in the second, third and 4th rounds. Those draft picks in the second, third and 4th rounds, could have provided the Niners more depth, but you seem to want to trade up to get a QB, so they might not have a draft pick in the second, third and 4th rounds, AGAIN.
                Yup, cutting a SB QB over money is pretty brain dead, but imagine the cost savings!

              13. Thank you, Jon Snow was considered one of Martin’s finest creations. He was heroic and noble. He fulfilled his oaths and did his duty. He voluntarily relinquished leadership, something other’s should consider. In the end, he knew EVERYTHING.
                To associate me with Jon Snow is quite a compliment. Tyvm.

              14. Scooter,

                No one has said their were 3 can’t miss type prospects, only one might be considered as a can’t miss prospect and that is Lawrence.

                Every other one has risk but that is true of nearly every prospect in this draft. Maybe you could make a cant miss case for Sewell, Chase, and Pitts.

              15. Can’t miss prospect? Like Joe Burrow? He is now going to miss some time rehabbing a shredded knee. Lawrence was defeated by Joe Burrow, and look where he has ended up.

              16. Ok Seb,
                Show me where someone said there were 3 can’t miss qb prospects in this draft.
                I’ll apologize when you find it.

              17. Razor- ‘We all have an opinion regarding the upcoming QB class, but I think we can all agree that the potential is there for the first four…… I can think of a hell of a lot worse QB classes to have to make that decision.’
                OC- ‘Razor, I would say 3, not 4…’

              18. December 17, 2020 at 8:00 am
                Razor- ‘We all have an opinion regarding the upcoming QB class, but I think we can all agree that the potential is there for the first four…… I can think of a hell of a lot worse QB classes to have to make that decision.’
                OC- ‘Razor, I would say 3, not 4…’

                Sooo… no can’t miss qb prospect mentioned.

              19. Shoup, the issue here is Seb either genuinely doesn’t comprehend the nuance in what people say, or he intentionally ignores it to fit his narrative.

              20. What kind of potential do you think they have?
                Bench warmers or starting QBs?
                I knew you would not acknowledge posters touting the top QBs in this draft.
                Here is another exchange.-
                Razor- ‘That’s why I look for difference makers in the first round at that position (QB). Guys like the top 4 prospects that can make those off script plays and can extend opportunities downfield. ‘
                AES- ‘I like the top 4 QBs as well, but what will it take to get one of them? The best is Trevor Lawrence. Do we go all Mike Ditka (drafting Ricky Williams) to acquire him?’
                Guess you think the Niners should spend their entire draft, selecting a QB who is NOT a slam dunk prospect.

              21. So you posted a bunch of new quotes where once again no one touted the draft as having 3 or more can’t miss prospects. So we are still waiting for that.

                Yeah I know that Scooter, and even so I get drawn in to these stupid arguments :/

              22. Quit leading with your chin. I did not throw out snark about my comment. I have left you alone, and you were the one who chose to engage.
                If you want to parse words, no, no one declared that any QB is a slam dunk winner that will lead them to win the SB. However, you all are dissing JG, who HAS led the Niners to the SB.
                You think so highly about those top QB prospects, that JG is expendable, so there is a strong implication that those top QBs would lead the Niners to the SB, when I think they have just as good a chance to end up like Haskins, Darnold, Jones or Jamarcus Russell.
                Scooter just could not help himself. He wanted to get in his snide remark. I have been leaving him alone, but if you and he wants to engage with me, do not whine when I give a little pushback.
                No. Joe Burrow should not be in their long term plans, and Cincy should seriously look at one of the top 3 QBs in this QB class. Burrow will try to come back too soon, get thrown to the wolves, and probably get injured again, ending his career. Taylor will allow him to pass 40 times every game, then wonder why he is getting bludgeoned so much. He is 2 weeks from surgery, and I guess you refuse to consider any possibility of complications. Both Verrett and McKinnon took 2 years rehabbing before getting back on the field, so I think it is perfectly logical to assume Burrow’s injury will take at least that long to fully heal, since his injury was so extensive.
                Posters on the Bengals site were praying that Burrow escapes that shirt show with 2 healthy legs. Why would any decent FA QB want to come to Cincy to destroy his career? Taylor just does not have a clue. I want Kaep to play, but even I do not want to see him go there, because it is a dysfunctional dumpster fire. I hope some needy team with playoff ambitions, allows Kaep to lead a decent team to compete for a ring, and he can take the league by storm, again.
                I hope you will finally learn your lesson. Engage with me at your own peril. Lately, I have left you alone, so bug off. Ignore my posts.
                Thankfully, there are some good posters who can actually behave, like AES, who refrain from the vicious screeds. I am civil and polite with him, even though we may disagree. He has class, you are crass. I am entitled to my opinion that the SMART thing for Cincy to do is draft one of the top 3 QBs, since Burrow may never play again. If he does play, it will not be at a high level like when he played for LSU. The DUMB thing to do is try to find a low level FA QB, and expect to win, Then put all their eggs in one basket with Burrow. It is truly delusional to think that he will be fully rehabbed before the start of training camp.

              23. ” If you want to parse words, no, no one declared that any QB is a slam dunk winner that will lead them to win the SB. ”

                So you admit you were wrong.
                Fair enough, that’s all you had to say.

              24. ‘But you and others have been touting these QBs as slam dunk/can’t miss winners.’
                Reading is fundamental. I never claimed that you STATED that they were slam dunk/ can’t miss winners, because I do not believe that for any QB in this draft.
                However, you and others have been TOUTING these QBs, wanting the Niners to move up to draft one. That is foolish, when they have so many needs to fill. Like Old Coach says, maybe the best move is to move back in the draft, and get as many second and third round picks as possible.

              25. Is this the catfish?

                Now you’re quoting yourself saying you didn’t say what you quoted yourself as saying?

                I know I didn’t say that… but rather, as I stated “no one” has said that. Not me, scooter, or razor, not a single regular poster. Then I simply challenged you to find a single post where someone claimed there 3 or more “can’t miss prospects” and you couldn’t do it.

                Razor saying there are 3 qbs with the potential to be franchise level or maybe great qbs in no way says that they are can’t miss. That difference is huge.

                To put it simply since 1980 the number of consensus can’t miss qb’s can be counted on one hand. Elway, Manning, & Luck. Lawrence May enter that list depending on how he finishes the season but that’s it.

                However, you can’t let the perfect be the enemy of the great. Waiting for that guy means passing on the Mahomes, Rodgers, Big Bens, etc.

                Which is more in line with Razor and Scooters argument based on what they are saying. Feel free to correct me if I’m wrong Scooter or Razor. I’ll apologize if I have misrepresented your views.

              26. Like a moth to a flame, you just seem to not learn your lesson. Thanks for proving my point.
                You declare that some poster who may advocate a Ditka strategy in which a team will give up their entire draft class in order to select Lawrence, is not considering Lawrence to be a slam dunk/ can’t miss QB. You are a stable genius.
                First you ascribe what I wrote as saying they declared that those top 3 QBs are slam dunk/ can’t miss QBs, when all I did was say that they TOUTED those QBs as if they were slam dunk/ can’t miss prospects. I merely wrote exactly what I said, to show you that I did not write what you think I wrote. I do not need your apology, because I do not expect you will have enough class to do it.
                So desperate. MY whole premise is that there are no slam dunk/ can’t miss QBs in this draft.
                I cited verbatim what they wrote. When Old Coach says- ‘3, not 4’, he is saying that the 4th prospect is not a slam dunk/ can’t miss QB. By using the power of deductive reasoning, he IS implying that he thinks the other 3 are elite.
                Your whole argument is specious, because you all have been dithering about moving on from JG, and drafting a QB. Guess you are implying that JG is not good enough to get back to the SB, but some rookie QB will, when it has almost never been done before.
                This all started when Scooter declared that the Bengals would not draft a QB, because they have Burrow. I merely pointed out that you all have been touting these college QBs as if they have elite skills and will lead their teams to the SB. Burrow has a shredded knee, and you all think it is ridiculous to move on from him, and believe what the coaches said, when they expect him to be as good as new for the 2021 season. I think reality will force them to select one of the top QBs in the draft, because the damage was so extensive, there could be complications. I will also declare that no decent FA QB will want to come to the Bengal dumpster fire, so blithely thinking that a QB like Mariota may want to come to the Bengals, is delusional. If the Bengals do not draft a QB, I will admit I am wrong, but I am confident that they will do that, because Burrow will probably not play all 2021, if ever. There are some very good QB prospects in this draft, but I also think that the top 3 teams will select those top 3 QBs, and especially the Bengals, because they do not have a competent QB right now.
                Razor stating that there are 3 potentially elite QBs, then saying he does not think they are slam dunk/ can’t miss prospects, is belying the definition of elite. They are so elite, others want the Niners to trade up to get one of those 3. That would be a huge gamble, and they better be slam dunk/can’t miss prospects, or the Niners will look clueless.
                The Niners should trade back to get as many draft picks in the first 3 rounds as possible. They should keep JG and draft O linemen to protect him. Letting Trent Williams go was their decision, when they signed him to that contract. Other teams with plenty of cap space will throw money at him.
                He most likely will make a business decision. It might be affected by the fact that some want JG gone, and some untested rookie may start the rebuilding process.
                BTW, I like to debate, and get in the last word, so bring it.

            2. Seb is the catfish. Why else hasn’t he changed his email and avatar?
              This guy is a lying POS cancer and the sooner you guys realize that and keep him in the loop, the sooner this blog will officially die.

            3. Hmmm this looks like a bunch of BS thrown against the wall to misdirect from the fact that you still can’t find some proof of people saying or implying that there are 3 or more can’t miss qb prospects. Here’s a newsflash, most first rounders are not considered can’t miss prospects.

              Ahh yes, this reminds me about the argument we had where you swore Bill Walsh had several Offensive Coordinators… or maybe more recently, where you declared Jimmy was fully back and his ankle was recovered because he scrambled for a few yards to get a first down. I’m sure you still believe you were correct on that.

              I know you right on both of those in your own head.

      1. Seb,
        I believe that the 9ers will be picking lower than you think. According to Matt Barrows they are currently in the 12th spot. I don’t see them winning more than 1 more game and if Beathard starts this week I don’t see that happening. That puts them at 5-12 and possibly the 5th pick and with that pick they will be able to draft one of the top 3 qbs without trading up.

        1. Old Coach, I am hoping for the best. I hope JG and Kittle come back, and help the Niners go out on a high note, with at least 2 more wins.
          However, with the play of Mullens, you may be right, especially if they bench JG for the rest of the season.

      2. Seb,
        Bengals won’t draft a QB next year. They will draft the best Oline player in the draft.
        The Bengals are committed to JB and will wait until he is fully healthy to take the field.

        We’ve waited for players like Taylor, Street, McKinnon and are still waiting for Hurd.
        I like these guys, but they don’t compare to the value and level of importance of a Joe Barrow.
        The Bengals fans would likely howl if the team uses their first pick to draft a QB.

        1. Joe Burrow is damaged goods, and may never play up to the level he played at LSU.
          The Bengals have the opportunity to possibly get one of the top 3 QBs in the draft, that many here are touting so much, they want the Niners to trade up to get one.
          I think the Bengals would be smart to select a QB, then if Burrow does come back, they could trade that QB away. If that QB does lead them to winning, Burrow could be traded away.
          Of course, the Bengals may miss out on the one player that could turn the team from a bunch of bunglers to team of winners. That is something Burrow could not do. Now he has a shredded knee, with no guarantee of success.

          1. Finally the rest of you see how ridiculous Seb’s football IQ is.

            Continue on fellas, it’s time now I sit back and laugh and watch the rest of you deal with his idiocy!

            1. Well, if the Bengals manage to get the first pick in the draft, do you think they will pass on Trevor Lawrence?
              This is like you betting 200 bucks that the Niners would draft Trubusty, when Mahomes and Watson were available. Talk about clueless.

              1. Seb says:
                December 17, 2020 at 7:49 am
                Well, if the Bengals manage to get the first pick in the draft, do you think they will pass on Trevor Lawrence?

                Yes! They will trade out for a bus load of draft picks for the next 3years.
                It wouldn’t surprise me if some team goes all Mike Dikta to acquire the service of Lawrence.
                Joe Burrows isn’t going anywhere my friend.

            1. Glad you dote on my every word.
              I certainly have not been impressed with your football takes.
              There may be every intention of returning, but this is a brutal sport. Burrow may never play again, because an O lineman fell on his knee, shredding the ligaments.

          2. Sustainability for any QB is mainly about talent and also about a stout Oline.
            The Bengals have vested their future on Burrows, they’re not going back to the well for a top 4 QB.

            Had this type of injury happened to a 8-10 year veteran then I think it makes good sense to secure a top 5 QB. But Burrows has age on his side.

              1. “Burrow has a shredded knee that may end his career.”

                Has the medical staff made that assessment?
                Have they said that Burrows is damaged goods and may never play again?
                Has anyone in the Bengals front office make a statement or dropped a hint that they will draft a top tier QB?

                You might have over stepped a little here.
                But if for some unforseeable chance that the Bengals do draft a top 4 QB, I will man-up and apologize and give you kudos.

              2. No, I am only stating my opinion that it would be the smart for them to select a top 3 QB.. Drafting Lawrence, if they have the chance would be mana from heaven. Their fanbase would be giving them praise, instead of constantly ripping them.
                There certainly would be howls of protest if they pass on Lawrence, even if they did get a boatload of picks.
                No, I do not think they would be stupid enough to speculate about all of their options, so recently after surgery, before they see how the rehabbing is going. Sure, they are supporting Burrow, but if he is gone for the entire 2021 season, they need to vastly improve the QB position.
                AES, I may be totally wrong, But I too will admit I was wrong, and say you were right, if that happens.

    1. Good for him. I am glad men like Payton, Shanahan, Kerr , Greg P et al have used their platform to do good and speak out against bad acts. As much as I dislike him as a coach I have to include the Seattle’s Carroll in this group. It is funny how some people get in a tizzy when folks assert their first amendment rights.

      32 more days !!!!!!!

  12. Just out of curiosity I went through the teams and did my best guess on which teams would prefer to have Jimmy as their starter vs their current starter when both are healthy. It must be noted that in doing this I also took into account rookie contracts and expected growth… so Cinci for example would not likely choose Jimmy over Joe when taking everything into account nor would Pitt.
    Here is a list of the teams that would likely replace their current starter with Jimmy.
    Car, Chi, Den, Indy, Jack, LAR, NE, NYG, NYJ, Wash. maybe Minn
    Here are some other possibilities for next year due to the age of their qb’s.
    TB, NO, Pitt,

    Using this logic I would say that SF’s qb situation is about the 18th to 22nd best in the NFL with a healthy Jimmy. This is securely in the bottom half of the league. This isn’t to say Jimmy is a bad qb, but I no longer think he is capable of playing like a top 5 but occasionally he might play like a top 10 qb. However these type of qb’s need loaded teams to win superbowls

    1. I think the main thing with JG is that after 3.5 years with the 49ers (and 3.5 years with the Pats before that) we still don’t really have a great handle on what he is.

      1. We have a QB who was able to get the team to SB 10 months ago.
        Yes, we saw some of his flaws like footwork, inability to throw consistent deep passes, unable to extend plays and sometimes making bone headed forced throws susceptible to the Int.

        But we also saw a QB with moxie to stand in the pocket to the last moment the get the pass out. His quick release is very good and important. I liked that he never showed signs of retreat or surrender and how he quickly shook-off mistakes to continue to play effectively.

        The only mystery for me is if he can stay healthy. That might be the FO mindset us well.
        That said, I have seen enough of a healthy JG to know that he can get us to the playoffs and more.

        1. I don’t mean this as a comparison, but it is worth keeping in mind that guys like Joe Flacco, Trent Dilfer and Nick Foles also took their teams to SB’s… and they actually won it. Or that, say, Colin Kaepernick was also a SB QB.

          Getting to the SB is impressive, I don’t mean to diminish it, as is his winning record, but there is absolutely no debating that the team around JG was exceptionally talented and played a big part in the team getting to the SB. And getting to the SB does not a good QB make.

          As for JG’s abilities, he no doubt has some very desirable qualities, and some very frustrating weaknesses/ flaws. He is by no means alone in this regard amongst starting NFL QBs. But the problem is he has a very high cap cost next year and we don’t know if his strengths are enough to overcome his weaknesses and elevate a team that doesn’t provide an elite supporting cast. Complicating matters further, two of JG’s main flaws (not a guy that will threaten teams deep much and some very poor decisions) are in key areas that Shanahan values highly in his QBs, based on what he has said previously.

          1. All good points but how much in Jimmy’s defense is that his head coach never gave him an opportunity to grow?

            The NO game last year he let Jimmy be a QB. In the playoffs they turned him into a game manager.
            Point is sometimes Shanny tries to win the game on his play calling and not let his players be themselves.

            And with all this talk about drafting a QB, I’m not confident, based on history that he can develop a QB.

            1. This is part of what I meant previously when I said we don’t yet really know what JG is, despite now being a 7 year vet. A lot of questions left regarding how good he actually is, for a variety of reasons.

          2. He got the team to the Super Bowl. Check
            Moxie in the pocket. Check.
            He can get you to the playoffs. Check

            What can we expect in trade compensation? A 2nd rounder? No way in hell. More like a 4th. That’s the value of Jimmy Garoppolo….

          3. Dilfer and Flacco had top shelf defenses and Keapernick regressed after his SB appearance.

            We don’t know how well a healthy Garoppolo would have done with healthy key offensive players, but I would feel very confident in saying that they would make the playoffs.
            I don’t know of any team that was hollowed out at the core as were the 49ers this year.

            Of course, it’s neither here or there and your guess is as good as mine. But if last year’s team stayed on the field this year, the Revenge Tour would be in full bloom.

            1. “Dilfer and Flacco had top shelf defenses”.

              As did Foles – the DL they had that year was excellent. And Kaep. But if that is meant as an argument against what I said… JG played on a team that had an elite defense last year, with a particularly strong pass rush. Thus my comparison. The 49ers didn’t need a great QB last year to get to the SB, just a competent one. But putting together such a strong team is very difficult, and then maintaining it nigh impossible.

              “If last year’s team stayed on the field this year, the Revenge Tour would be in full bloom”.

              100% agree. But that’s because last year’s team was excellent across the park, with an elite defense and running game. They had minimal turnover this offseason but injuries have obviously been what has cruelled them.

              Next year though they won’t be able to field close to the same team. Lots of pending FAs, lots of roster turnover about to happen. Lots of pressure going to be on JG to elevate a weaker roster, if he is still the QB.

              1. If the 49ers go with a QB in the first possible 10-12 draft range they will be in a position to bite the bullet for a year or two.
                I don’t see them making it to the playoffs right away in that scenario.

                And if they lose Trent Williams who knows when they get to the playoffs again.
                Yet, if they lose players to FAc. They should still be competitive with a younger group of hopefully core players.

                If the team is going to have an uprising next season it may need to start by resigning T. Williams. Without Williams, a rookie QB will take more time to develop.

              2. If they lose Williams and can’t replace him in FA I honestly believe that would force them to keep JG in order to draft a LT early. But I seriously doubt Williams isn’t re-signed.

                “if they lose players to FA, they should still be competitive with a younger group of hopefully core players”.

                Yeah, I probably haven’t been clear in that regard – I still believe it will be a good team next year regardless of if they keep JG or not, and a competitive one. Just not the top to bottom excellent roster they had in 2019, though if they cut JG then they can keep more of the rest of the roster together. Regardless, while still good and competitive, it is going to be considerably harder to get to and win the SB next year whether it is JG at QB or someone else. Imho 2021 is going to be a bit of a mini-rebuild due to the cap situation (though still a playoff contender), with an eye to 2022. No matter what they do with JG.

              3. They don’t necessarily have to use a first on a Tackle.
                There are some mid tier tackles available that could allow them to kick the can for a year or 2 like Villanueva, Okung, or Moton. Players like Okung and Villanueva should cost around 10 M per season while Moton would be around 15 and Williams will be closer to 20 M.

                Going this route might allow them to go with a combination of someone Like Linsley, or Mack with their LT. It’s really just an argument about how you would prefer to build your line.

                I think Kyle will make sure Trent is back with SF but my preference is for a more balanced Oline than for one with a few great players and some really bad players on it. That said, who knows how they will structure the contract and maybe they can manage to do both.

              4. Yeah, that’s what I meant re if they can’t replace him in FA. If they can find a suitable replacement then no need to draft a LT in round 1.

                But Shanahan clearly wants a very good LT. He’s said as much previously, and their actions confirm it. I doubt they let Williams leave.

    2. There are only a handful of elite QB’s on earth. Every other one is going to be slightly flawed in some way and need a good team around them to compete for a SB. Garoppolo in his only full season as a starter was top 5 in some categories and top ten in most others. He’s not elite but he’s as good as anybody on the next tier based on what he’s done in his time here and most importantly, shown he can win games and go to a SB. The injuries suck but that’s football and no matter who you have at QB, that possibility always exists.

  13. When looking for cap relief many have pointed out some relief with the release of Ford. Well its my understanding that Ford has to pass a physical by April 1 or the Niners have to carry him. They cant release Ford injured unless a settlement is reached, that too is a cap hit. Only relief from Ford will be if healed and released and the healing part is not looking good… disqualifier – I know next to nothing about the cap, I could be spreading rumors.

    1. They’ve got until after June 1st to get him healthy. Releasing him before that date costs more. They just need to be below the cap with their top 51 contracts by March 1st. The only avenue towards attempting that is holding off signing their draft class until June, which is usually around $10 million….

    1. I’m not sure I buy the argument of keeping Jimmy G and drafting a QB in the first round. The example cited of Alex Smith/Patrick Mahomes doesn’t really apply in my opinion. Alex has significantly more experience and his high character and I guess to some degree selflessness means that he was willing to tutor Mahomes (something that Patrick’s father raved about as a big reason why Mahomes was able to make a quick jump in his readiness to play in the NFL). Jimmy isn’t as experienced and at time his decision making leaves one to wonder what he is doing. Further, is there any reason to believe Jimmy would be willing to take a rookie under his wing, knowing that he, JG, would be shipped out the next year?

  14. I don’t care what happens the rest of the year, as long the Seattle Seahawks, Rams or Cardinals don’t win the Super Bowl!

  15. Dang! Mariota is ball’n out tonight.
    Tonight, he looks like the type of QB we’ve been talking about.
    A QB who can extend plays.
    A difference maker.

    1. Both Oregon QB’s playing very well. Mariota has always been a favorite of mine. Herbert born and raised in Eugene, freshman starter at U of O. Of course I am biased but Mariota would do very well with KS.

      1. UC,
        Mariota has a two year contract with the raiders at about 17mil. Not sure he could be swooped up.
        Marcus did look good, but he came in with fresh legs. Makes you wonder if can hold out for an entire season.

        1. AES,
          Does Mariota’s performance mean that Carr is available? I have no idea what his contract situation is but I do believe that KS could turn him into a top 10 QB. If he was available for a 2nd round pick I think the 9ers should jump all over him. I believe with a good draft and Carr’s signing could put the 49ers right back into SB contention. imho

          1. We’re trending towards picking as high as #8 overall, and you want to trade for a used Carr? Not only would we lose our 2nd rounder, but we’d only gain a couple million in cap space. Makes zero sense. The whole idea is to get an elite prospect on a cheap 4 year deal. You say there’s maybe 3 elite prospects, and I say there’s 4. Pick one. Pairing an elite prospect to grow up in this offense to sustain playoff appearances year in and year out is the best way forward for mine….

            1. Razor,
              There have been literally hundreds of QB’s who have been considered “elite” coming out who were busts. After watching Carr play I believe KS will make him elite. If they were able to trade a 2022 2nd round pick they could possibly fill 3 or 4 real needs in this years draft. I certainly would not touch Carr if he wasn’t willing to renegotiate his contract to a more team friendly contract. I am not all in on this idea but it could be another interesting way to go.

              1. There have been literally hundreds of QB’s who have been considered “elite” coming out who were busts.

                What exactly is that supposed to mean? Shy away from taking a bite of the apple when you’re hungry? Wait until everyone else is fed and take a nibble at the scraps on day 2 or 3? It’s this kind of attitude that would make me believe you have no confidence in your scouting department, no confidence in your HC/Staff to set up and develop him into a franchise player, and no confidence in the team you can surround him with given the cap savings at the position….

              2. Razor,
                What it means is I would rather trade for a known quantity (a veteran NFL QB who has played well) than taking a shot in the dark at another Goff, Wentz,J. Russell, J. Locker, J. Rosen, D. Haskins, M. Lienart, C. Ponder, D. Jones, B. Gabbert, David Carr, J. Harrington, R. Leaf, RG3, B. Bortles, V. Young and M. Trubisky. I have seen what Carr is capable of and believe that KS would make him great but its all just conversation because we have no idea whether the Raiders are looking to move on from him.

              3. Man, Shanahan gets no credit for helping develop Schaub and Cousins into good starting QBs. Neither were special talents, but both guys have had very good careers and Kyle was an instrumental part of their early development.

                OC, that’s a philosophy I can’t get on board with. Relying on cast off QBs is how you end up with decent QBs that aren’t special talents. Hard to consistently win with those guys as they really need strong teams around them and are usually on second contracts that pay them a lot of money. Yes, you run the risk of missing in the draft, but you have to trust the scouting department and coaches to find the guy that fits them.

              4. I’m not so confident in Shanny and his ability to develop a QB.
                Even his seasons with RGIII he didn’t do much to develop the skill set required for a sustainable NFL career.
                Sure RGIII threw for over 6000 plus yards in 2 seasons but Shanahan never coached the kid to be anything other than a read option, play action QB. Once he got hurt, he was never any good as he didn’t have the fundamentals to be an every day QB anymore.

                My point is Shanahan is an exceptional play caller. But when it comes to taking a player, developing him,
                grooming him, giving him all the tools to be have a sustainable NFL career, I just haven’t seen it done at the QB position with Shanahan as a head coach or offensive coordinator.

                Cousins again was a byproduct of a great scheme. Schaub, same thing.
                By the time Shanny got to Matt Ryan, he was a seasoned vet.

                Look at Jimmy G. In 3 years, terrible foot work. Poor throwing mechanics as well.

              5. Shanahan was instrumental in developing Cousins and Schaub. Both guys received the foundations for good careers under his tutelage.

              6. Hey, Prime. The example I gave was Shanny making chicken salad out of chicken $hit. The examples, Scooter provided were more conventional quarterbacks that he was used to working with….

              7. OldCoach, that is the status quo and not one that will sustain success in today’s NFL. I wish Andy Reid had had your mindset because against Alex Smith we would have had a 6th trophy in the trophy case. The American spirit of taking risk for greater achievements is one that should be embraced if you’re a franchise that finds itself at the same crossroads as the 49ers find themselves. Be bold, confident and go get yourself an Allen or a Herbert with the belief that you can coach him to lead the best offense you’ve ever fielded!

              8. Even elite QB’S need a strong team around them.
                There aren’t too many elite QBS that are going to win a SB on their own merit.

                If this were the case, Rodgers would have perhaps 3-5 SB rings.
                I’ll go back even further and apply the same principle to Dan Marino.
                Heck, even the great Russell Wilson has only one ring.

                To win a SB you need key players, that’s a given.
                But you also need strength from top to bottom throughout the roster. And that applies to the bench players as well, as was painfully evident in the 4th QTR of the SB.

                I said all that to say that no top 4 rookie QB is going to get this team to the SB in his rookie season. Even Trevor Lawrence would need a couple of years to make the playoffs simply because there are many areas on the team that need help.
                Scooter said it best, this will be a mini rebuild year.

              9. You can field a stronger team around your elite rookie quarterback prospect for 4 years. By then he’s either worth investing in because he can compensate for a teams deficiencies or he’s not like the Alex Smith’s, Jimmy Garoppolo’s and Jared Goff’s of the NFL world and you move on….

          2. Coach,
            Carr has done enough to secure his job in Vegas. The raiders defense and self defeating bone-head mistakes have been the raiders (as always) biggest issues in the second half of the season for them.

            For me, Mariota could become a good change of pace type QB for the raiders similar to Brees and Taysom Hill.
            But, I’m not sure that Mariota is still a full time starter in the league.

              1. I don’t see Mariota as a full-time QB. His success will come in situations such as last night. But as good as he was last night the raiders still lost – to a darn good rookie QB.

              2. Yep, Mariota is an expensive backup who can give you a game like that against a defense in flux. On the other hand, I’ve been watching Herbert since week 1 and I believe he’s the best quarterback from that class….

  16. We just watched an elite quarterback tonight in Justin Herbert. He made no name receivers look like household names. The Chargers are set with a wide open window for 3-4 years with that rookie contract too….

    1. Where is Coffee? He got a big shout out on the round table for his prowess with scouting QB’s.

      A shout out, eh? Remember his scouting report on Kyler Murray? That’s all you need to know about his “prowess”.

    2. I got one better than Murray, ha! His habile scouting hat must have been too snug, restricting the prowess to his cranium when he served us up his Mettenberger with cheese as the next great QB!

  17. KS designated Mullens as the starter. Mullens does not deserve to be the starter, and if was upright and truthful, Mullens would admit he is hurting the team. What happens if/when Mullens turns the ball over? Will he be a team player, and bench himself for the good of the team?
    Maybe KS should make it competitive. Mullens starts, and as long as the team scores, he continues starting. Once the Niners have to punt, CJB gets to start, and he continues to play until he fails to score. This would reward success, and give both QBs an opportunity to help the team.
    CJB does have a stronger arm, and I remember a play where CJB ran for 65 yards and a score, IICRC. Maybe KS could roll him out so they have a mobile pocket, and run away from the best pass rusher.
    Most importantly, it would be a huge motivation for Mullens to have better ball security. If he does not have to get worried about being pulled, he will continue to hold the ball like a loaf of bread, and throw like the DB was the intended receiver.

  18. When asked if Ryans had the capability to take Saleh’s spot as defensive coordinator, Saleh went a step further, praising his attention to detail and the way he yearns for knowledge.

    “DeMeco is well-spoken,” Saleh said. “He’s got a lot of respect from his players. He’s incredibly intelligent. He is a sponge for knowledge. Even though he’s played in this league—he’s been a Pro Bowler, he was Defensive Rookie of the Year—he still learns. I see him taking notes every day. Coach is talking, he’s taking notes. I’m talking, he’s taking notes. DB coach is talking, he’s taking notes. He is an absolute sponge in that regard, which tells you that he’s not just going to take a system and go, he’s going to evolve. So, because of that, I just think he’s got a really good chance to continue to evolve and be a head coach one day.”

    1. Hopefully Saleh will not take Ryans with him as his DC. I suspect he’d probably go with someone with HC experience like Dan Quinn.

      1. A 1st year head coach with a 1st year DC? Your suspicions are warranted. Makes too much sense to buoy someone like that with a proven veteran DC….

  19. One thing that I have been hearing, is the Niners talking about the right mentality.
    That may be the right word used correctly, but there may be a better adjective.
    When they talk about the right mentality, maybe they should use the phrase- right mindset. Mentality describes the thought processes used to come to a conclusion or decision. Mindset is the overall philosophy.
    In other words, mentality is like the computer, and mindset is the program.

    1. “Mentality describes the thought processes used to come to a conclusion or decision.”

      That is only one definition of the word. A second meaning is a person’s/ group’s outlook/ way of thinking.

      Mentality and mindset are synonyms.

      1. The Niners have the right mentality. That could mean they are smart enough to process information to a conclusion. They have cognitive ability, and a capability to achieve their goals.
        The Niners have the right mindset. They have the right attitude and goals, striving for success, a capability to make adjustments and withstanding adversity.
        You are right. Both are synonymous, but I think mindset describes it better.

        1. Of course you do. They are synonyms, but sure, let’s go with believing one describes it better than the other. Smh.

          Reminds me of when you proudly proclaimed you were verbose.

      1. Just idle speculation during this trying football season. At least I am also talking about this upcoming game with the Cowboys, instead of dithering about QBs that the Niners may draft next year.
        On another note, I do not think Saleh will take Demeco Ryans with him, since KS will probably promote him to DC. The coach that Saleh would probably like to take is Mike LaFleur, because he will need help on the offensive side, while Saleh will probably not want Quinn or any other former HC breathing down his neck if things go south.
        Ryans would not want to have Saleh focusing on the defense, and the Niner defense is way better than the lion defense. Ryans would probably not want to toil on a struggling team, and the 49er DC position would be a good stepping stone for advancement.

  20. How can the Niners defeat the Cowboys?
    They just need to run the ball, so Mullens is not forced to make bad decisions.
    KS needs to devise a game plan that will have multi options to keep them guessing, and since the Cowboys will stack the box, they should attack the edges. Use Mostert’s speed outside, and Wilson’s north/south running . Looking at some previous Cowboy games, I think that draw plays may be very effective, because the LBs are weak.
    Above all, they need to put a TE on the right side, so he can chip the pass rusher, giving McGlinchey help. Sounds like McKivitz is out, and Brunskill has a strained shoulder, so they may need to juggle the line up. Maybe put Skule at RT and move McGlinchey inside. Bergstrom or Grasu at Center?
    Another move they should contemplate, is benching Bourne, and giving Richie James his snaps. Bourne hurt the team with all of his drops.

  21. Question, given that every team will see a drop in salary cap, will we see a lot of veteran players dumped due to salary cap issues? A return to plan B free agency era?

    1. I think it is inevitable there will be a spike in veteran players getting dumped this offseason. But I don’t see the NFLPA agreeing to a plan B type restriction on player movement.

      The most likely outcome is that players will be squeezed on contracts (has to happen), money and cap hits will be moved to later years, and I expect a lot of vets will look to do one year deals with an eye to cashing in in 2022.

      1. Yeah, I didn’t think that there would be a plan b. Just that veteran players, even good ones might be squeezed out of jobs.

        Not sure if 2022 will be the bonanza that everyone will think it is either. Revenue is down but viewership is way down. People aren’t tuning in like before. I know that I used to watch every game available but I find myself only watching the 49ers nowadays.

        This is due to the quality of play. I don’t think that dumping all these veterans will improve play either.

        1. Sour,
          Glad to see you around here again. Haven’t seen as many of your posts recently.
          I think that’s an inevitability as well.

          Sadly, I don’t think the cap will hurt all players equally. The best players will likely still command big bucks, while lesser talents that are merely, “good” will have to settle for less. Those players not willing to settle will find themselves waiting and may end up out of the league.
          This in turn will hurt teams depth and ultimately the overall product on the field will be worse.

  22. I get paid more than $160 to $170 per hour for working online. I heard about this job 3 months ago and after joining this i have earned easily $16k from this without having online working skills. This is what I do….

    1. Too bad Fields played poorly today. Could mean he drops and Wilson moves ahead of him making it even more unlikely the 49ers will get Wilson.

      1. Wilson lost against an evenly matched opponent in Central Coastal. He needs to win against another evenly matched team in a bowl game to garner my attention.

      2. If before today you wanted Wilson but thought Fields was better and would get drafted ahead of Wilson… isn’t having Fields drop behind Wilson a good thing?

        Fields has his flaws, as does Wilson. The flaws of Fields all seem to relate to his reading of coverages, which is an area he is behind in his development largely courtesy of the scheme he plays in which is all pretty much one read or run. But he has excellent traits to build on. If you draft Fields you do so knowing he needs time to learn how to read defenses, and that is going to be a risk.

        1. Didn’t really want Fields before the game, so…….

          Brady Quinn echoed your comments regarding Fields’ inability to read coverages. Pretty sure NFL GMs/HCs will see that, so if you still want Fields despite this performance, then yeah that is a good thing. But his performance gives those who wanted him before the game some pause doesn’t it. Therefore, I maintain Wilson’s stock is up across the board whereas Fields’ is not. Still it only takes one NFL team to fall in love with a QB and figure they can fix his flaws.

          Also Meyer made the point that Fields only has 19 or so starts, IIRC, and mentioned the WFT QB from Ohio State in the same breath (who only had 13 games). I’ve been thinking about what Meyer said as I never took the amount of experience a QB has in college that seriously. It’s probably not a good strategy for a college QB to be in a position where he has to get his experience in the NFL when he could be getting it in college.

          But from the point of view of the 49ers, I think we can pretty much agree that KS would prefer Wilson and this performance by Fields only reinforces that. So for these reasons, it has probably become harder for the 49ers to get Wilson.

          1. My point is this game wasn’t really anything new for Fields. It just highlighted the flaws in his game that any NFL scout would have already known or seen when they dived into his film.

            I just think it is a bit funny how a lot of people here now seem to be of the belief they would prefer, say, Wilson, yet were of the belief Fields would definitely be taken before him. If you believed before today that Wilson is the better QB then should probably have believed NFL teams will feel the same way, too.

            Personally I like Fields but am well aware of the areas he needs to improve. I still think he will be the 2nd QB taken unless he completely tanks the pre-draft process, but he does have a pretty big bust potential.

            My personal preference is the 49ers take Trey Lance, but tbh I can also see a scenario where he is the 2nd QB taken. I can also see Wilson being the 2nd QB taken. There isn’t much between those 3 guys and they are going to be highly debated ahead of the draft.

            1. I’ve had Wilson as my #2 all along. I just assume the Jags will take Fields, because that’s what they do.

              I couldn’t agree more regarding the bust potential of Fields. That’s why he’d be my last choice of the four.

        2. Big difference between the two is starting experience. I also like how the balls come off of Wilson’s throws as opposed to Fields’.

          1. I’d say the big difference between the two is that Wilson has more experience reading coverages (though still needs a lot of work in this area) and is the better improvisational passer, while Fields has the better physical traits.

              1. Fields has a cannon when he needs it, he just doesn’t throw it as hard as he can if he doesn’t need to. Which is a good trait.

                Fields is very accurate in the short to medium part of the field. His accuracy can wane down the field – Wilson may have the advantage in accuracy in the long passing game.

              2. I don’t think the ball travels as fast as it does through the air just because Wilson may or may not be throwing it as hard as he can, but rather the way the ball comes out and spins in a tight spiral. It just cuts through the air like a knife through butter.

                Wilson has great touch on his passes when it’s needed. You’re not suggesting he throws like Kaepernick are you, Scooter? 😎

              3. I wasn’t making any reference to Wilson’s passes tbh. Your question was around who throws with more velocity, and based on other comments seemed to be suggesting Fields can’t throw with the same velocity as Wilson can. I don’t believe that to be the case. When Fields needs to fit a ball in a tight gap he powers it in there just fine, as well as Wilson.

              4. I know. I was just giving you a bit of the sav.

                You may be right about the velocity, but I don’t know if it’s the trajectory of their passes or what but to my naked eye, it’s special the way the ball comes out and travels when Wilson throws it, not to mention quicker….

  23. “After tidal wave of NFL coach firings, will there be more openings than good candidates?”

    * Not a fan of NFL columnist Charles Robinson, but his point that as many as 1/3 of the NFL teams could have a new HC, coupled with the teams inability to scout draft prospects, does raise some interesting questions for the 2021 season….
    * Does this guarantee that 9er DC, Robert Saleh will be hired by another NFL team as their new HC? How will it affect the 9ers and assuming it happens, who replaces Saleh as the 9ers DC?
    * HC candidate who could be the 2021 version of the NY Jets HC Adam Gase disaster?
    * Will an NFL owner decide not fire his HC, because there is no qualified candidate to replace him?


  24. After 3 straight weeks off with 20 players unavailable I think any QB would struggle. Would Wilson struggle against NW’s D? I don’t know but I certainly would like to see, but that ain’t gonna happen.
    On another subject take a look at the San Jose St. game at 1:00 and keep your eye on DE Cade Hall he is one hell of a pass rusher and could be available in the late 3rd early 4th round.

    1. You don’t watch Fields throw the ball and Wilson throw the ball and come away with one guy spins it better than the other? I sure as hell do.

      1. I think you misrepresent what I have said about Wilson. I have said I believe he is among the top 3 QB’s but I would love to see him against better competition. Thats all. Anyways take a look at Hall, his Dad Rhett played for the 9ers on the SB team from the 94 season. His Dad got two huge sacks Vs. the Cowboys in the 4th quarter of the NFCCG.

        1. Out of curiosity OC (and anyone else that cares to share their thoughts), what did you think of his game against Coastal Carolina? I know they aren’t in the same class as the very top teams, but that was a really good matchup against BYU as that D is excellent and provided a good example of what Wilson can do against a D that can beat his OL to make him need to move around and get the ball out under pressure and DBs that can cover his receivers.

          While BYU lost, and Wilson’s stat line wasn’t great, I was really encouraged by that performance. He played much better than his stat line. He showed me he can handle pressure and make plays when his OL and receivers aren’t dominating. That was my biggest concern with him. It is still a bit of a concern for me, but nowhere near as much after that game.

      2. Raz,
        Wilson is a better passer than Fields. But Fields has gone up against top ranked teams and done very well.
        I can’t say that about Wilson, especially given the fact that the one good team he played, he lost.
        Competition at the highest level is still a very good barometer.

          1. I’ve never claimed to like Fields. The only QB that I’ve touted is Kyle Trask. Trask will face his biggest test this evening against Alabama and I’ll be watching how he performs with great interest.

            I like Wilson, but I’d be concerned about his lack of competition and the physical nature of the pro game considering his small upper body structure.

            I would be fine with Trey Lance, but he may take 2-3 years to learn all the nuances and speed of the pro game.
            Same might apply to Wilson and any of the top QBs with the exception of Lawrence who I view as the only plug-n-play QB in the group.

          2. One guy has consistently beat top level teams. I’ll give you two guesses as to who’s who.
            Cuts both ways.
            But if I had to choose between Fields and Wilson, I’d go with Wilson because I feel that he has a higher ceiling, if he can avoid the pounding in the pros.

            1. Funny, I would actually argue Fields has the higher ceiling, except in the category of improvisational skills. That is where Wilson shines. Which tbh can be the difference between a good and great QB, so you may be right to say Wilson’s ceiling is higher based on that factor alone.

              1. Is “move the needle” what you mean? Or that he didn’t impress you and you came away with more concerns about him than you had previously?

                I agree today shouldn’t move the needle either way on him. He has shown many times before what natural talent he has, and also the issues with reading coverages.

            2. Ha, Wilson takes care of his business. He doesn’t give two $hits about who he plays because he has no control over who he plays. I’m not comparing “teams”. I’m comparing players and how their individual games translate to the next level….

              1. Wilson has a quicker release and looks like a quicker decision maker than Fields.
                I really like everything about Wilson except for his small upper body frame.

        1. “Wilson is a better passer than Fields.”

          Can you explain what you mean by this? Because personally I would say Fields is at least as good a passer as Wilson – he has a high quality arm talent. But Wilson currently does a better job going through his reads.

          1. I think the ball spins with more velocity than Fields’. I also think he’s more accurate. I also like Wilson’s feet better.

        1. If the other 3 are gone and a team offered me picks, I’d trade out. If not, I’d take him but I’d sit him a year behind a cheap vet.

          1. Yeah, I certainly wouldn’t pass on Fields, but not a guy I would be wanting to trade up for. Too much of a bust factor for my comfort.

            As a prospect he is a bit like Cam Newton. Has all the physical gifts (plutonium grade, as one Jim Harbaugh might say), but he needs to develop his pocket passing skills quite a bit in order to be a top level QB in the NFL.

            1. Exactly and he’s not what we’re looking for. We’re looking for a passer first that happens to have some nice athletic traits.

      3. Razor,

        I’m not sure what you mean by spins it better.
        If you are saying that Wilson has a tighter spiral places the ball better than Fields, I would agree. If you are saying he has stronger arm, I would disagree. Wilson’s arm has dramatically improved, and overall I prefer him to Fields, but I don’t think their arm strength is in the same class.
        I prefer Wilson’s motion to Fields, as Fields has a bit more of a windup it seems (baseball background), but Fields can reach more of the field. He throws the ball 50+ yards in the air with ease and more importantly has made some nice opposite hash throws which is tougher in college given their width.

  25. Another later round QB to watch. Nick Starkel San Jose St. He was phenomenal Vs. Boise St. today and has been outstanding all year. The ball jumps out of his hand, he throws with great accuracy.

  26. Well, the Niners are starting Dakoda Shepley at center and Skule at RG?
    Looks like they are making big changes, so I hope Isaiah Williams plays some RT. If not, maybe Skule can be RT and McGlinchey can play RG.
    Glad they have faith in Mullens, but with this make shift line, maybe CJB would be a superior option, because he is mobile enough to roll out consistently. He is more mobile than Mullens, so he may withstand the blitzing, which Nolan will probably throw at the new O linemen.

  27. I thought that if Trask would have beat Alabama, he would have emerged as my top choice for the 49ers.
    Of course, Lawrence is the best QB, but he will be swooped up as soon as the draft starts.

    Both Trask and Jones looked good, but I liked the moxie from Trask after going down by two scores twice. It amazes me how Trask gets the ball to his receivers even when his passes look like a Marc Wilson (former BYU/Raiders) lob.

    Playing from behind was something I wanted to see from Trask going into this game and I came away impressed even in the loss.

  28. Hope Bourne will have a better game tomorrow. Every time I think he is showing signs of being a decent third receiver, he has a bad game that makes me think he’ll never be better than a fourth receiver in a good team. Against WFT, he dropped 2 passes, did not make another two highly makeable catches, ran routes short of the sticks on two catches on third down that led to Niners punting, and had a false start. Had been hoping this would be the year where he’d be consistent.

    1. MWD
      * THE QUESTION IS: Is $25.5 million a “compelling option” for the 9ers to keep (trade / cut), JG?
      * Should the 49er FO evaluate the 2021 salary of every player on the team, including resigning Trent Williams at his Market value of $18.2 million?
      * Just for fun, I’ll include how Grant Cohn believes the 9er FO to do it. I know you all miss his opinion(s)……
      * ” How a Drastically-Lowered Salary Cap could Affect the 49ers and Jimmy Garoppolo in 2021.”

      1. Money should not be the only factor though. One of the bigger factors is whether Saleh leaves and who will replace him. Depending on that situation, the 49ers may need to focus on certain areas of the defense.
        Another factor that must be taken into consideration is who the 49ers would bring back bring back to help mentor the new guy.
        The third more important factor is where the team ends up in the draft order. If they are outside of the top 10, the chances of them acquiring one of the top four QB prospects will be very slim unless they trade up.
        The final, and potentially most crucial, factor is going to be who is available in free agency. Reports have stated that Stafford, Ryan, and potentially even Wentz could be made available after this season.

        1. MWD:
          * “Money should not be the only factor though.” Agreed, but it may be the most important one.
          * With respect to Saleh: See my 12/19/20 post at 9:30 AM ““After tidal wave of NFL coach firings, will there be more openings than good candidates?” *
          * “Another factor that must be taken into consideration is who the 49ers would bring back to help mentor the new guy,” Assuming you mean QB. You answer your own question with “the final, and potentially most crucial factor is going to be who is available in free agency.”

          * IMO: IF THE DRAFT WERE HELD TODAY: #1) NY Jets draft QB Lawrence. #2) Jax draft QB Wilson. #5) Car draft QB Fields #6) Atl. drafts QB Lance. As we all know, many things will change before the draft, but these four teams will likely draft before the 9ers. So as you’ve posted, WHO should the 9ers trade up for, (assuming they move on from JG). Or should they draft a QB in a later round?

          1. Assuming you mean QB. You answer your own question with “the final, and potentially most crucial factor is going to be who is available in free agency.”

            Not really. The team would need a QB who knows Shanahan’s system to help mentor the rookie, and the options available in free agency are very slim.

            As we all know, many things will change before the draft, but these four teams will likely draft before the 9ers. So as you’ve posted, WHO should the 9ers trade up for, (assuming they move on from JG). Or should they draft a QB in a later round?

            My opinion is to wait until at least the second round and use the first round pick to help or upgrade the pass defense or OL.

            1. MWD
              “Not really. The team would need a QB who knows Shanahan’s system to help mentor the rookie.”

              * Don’t know MWD, it hasn’t helped Mullens or Beathard…And JG has injuries, but he’s regressed.
              I would’t be surprised if all three 9er QB’s were gone in 2021….Would you?

  29. This is how you fix the 49ers.

    Replace Kyle Shanahan with Dave Taub and hire Dave Kafka to be the OC.

    Replace Robert Saleh with Marvin Lewis.

    Draft Kyle Trask.

    Enjoy the next 10 years of dominance.

  30. Two injury-ravaged teams. The team that makes the most mistakes will decide the game. It’s either the usual suspects turning it over (Mullens), or new ones (James), or players horribly out of position (Skule — a guy who has never played guard).

    1. Scooter
      * The last two games of the 2020 season are now auditions for who will be a 9er in 2012…. Not sure if Armstead is worth his salary, but Kinlaw absolutely is.
      Question: Would you give Armstead a choice of salary a cut, or trade? If a salary cut, what is he worth and if a trade, do you think the 9ers could get a first, or second round draft pick for him?

      1. 1. The 49ers can’t afford to cut Armstead, he would cost more to cut. So why would Armstead accept a pay cut?

        2. Armstead is still one of their better players, so I would not want to trade him. No chance of getting a 1st or 2nd rounder for him.

          1. Why? Because his cap hit if they cut him increases SIGNIFICANTLY compared to what it will be if they keep him. Cap hit of $12.5M if they keep him, $28.15M if they cut him. Not going to happen.

            1. Armstead needs to play exclusively on the inside. It’s clear he has been playing out of position all year because of injuries to Ford and Bosa.

              Draft a pass rusher to balance out the line.

  31. Niners should continue with the no-huddle approach. It worked in the last drive.

    Mostert is having a good game. Already over 60 yards in first half.

  32. My son will attest to this fact. He asked me what the Niners should run, and I said they should run the Jerry Rice play. He catches the ball, fakes inside, and heads to the pylon.
    GO NINERS !!!!!!

    1. Feel bad? You’re being charitable, PT. Must be the holiday season. Definitely is, 3 gifts from Santa Mullens. 🎅🏻 🎅🏻🎅🏻

    2. Come on, earlier this year we were hearing from a few people that Mullens is nearly the same player as Jimmy at a fraction of the cost.

        1. Hammer & Cohn.

          It’s called using stats as a crutch, which is sports journalism at it’s laziest! Grant has made a career of it.

          Hay Grant, BTW, remember when you debated me about DK Metcalf, prior to the draft? Remember that brilliant piece of analysis on your part? SMH!

  33. The blame for this backup QB situation has to rest with Kyle. It’s his offense and he decides whether the backup has the minimum physical tools to make the throws that are needed to implement his offense. There is no point in having a QB who has mastered his offense if he can’t make these throws.

    1. The injuries are on him as well. Not just this year but since his tenure, his teams have been injury prone. That’s on his strength/conditioning protocols, his offseason preparations, practice regime. All of it!

      1. All injuries are different. Every study has shown that this “prone to injury” is a myth except for a few chronic problems like back. Of course, small, fast players who play hard can get injured more often. But the injuries for the Niners are across the board. The strength and conditioning staff can’t do much if there is no off-season and the players like Deebo don’t take care of their bodies.
        No, I’m not hanging the injuries blame on Shanalynch.

        1. I totally am. First of all if you select players that are injury prone or have a history of injuries, that’s probably an indicator they might be susceptible to injuries. When you have the option to select a guy who hasn’t had injuries and one that has, based on prior selections you haven’t had success with, that’s on Shanny/Lynch.

          Then you look at their history interms of conditioning offseason and in season, they can’t get it right. They’ve changed conditioning staffs nothing has changed. This means you are not preparing your players well enough and their recovery, nutrition is not good enough. When you consistently have injuries year in year out, this isn’t by accident.

          Sorry Mood, he has to be accountable. He is the guy making the decisions.

            1. Yeah we should not have! What did we win with Gore? Nothing!

              What has Ward done other than stealing money from the Niners? Nothing!

              Bosa TBD but so far not good.

              So take your examples last and shove em you coward!

    1. Yeah. I hope we get to see Beathard play the next two games. The few times he has been in, he looks different than in previous years. Probably the best downfield thrower on the team. Will be interesting to see if Jimmy G plays.

    1. I disagree re Shanalynch. If they have another bad season next year then sure, but in no way do I believe they should be considered on any sort of hot seat heading into next year, warm or otherwise. This season has just been bad luck.

      1. Maybe a bidet seat warmer for the head coach’s personal bathroom that Harbaugh insisted on?? Maybe I’m thinking the one built for Harbaugh at Stanford….

  34. Sigh, some day, the Niners will consider time outs to be precious, and saved for legitimate challenges and the last 2 minutes of each half.
    I swear, I could do a better job on onside kicks, just relying on my soccer skills.

    1. Seb,
      Nobody recovers onside kicks anymore. I think the rules for onside kicks need to go back to the previous rule or at least an adjustment to the current rule needs to happen. The rule change has fundamentally changed the end of close games. I am a strong supporter of player safety but I just don’t see the old way as being a situation that lead to lots of injuries. imho

      1. Old Coach, Koo seems to have a good record for onside kicks. He kicked 3 consecutive successful on side kicks in one game.
        Instead of allowing a possible TD, which is exactly what happened, they should just drill the ball so it bounces at the feet of one of the up men. Nobody knows where it will bounce off to, so if it touches the up man, it is a live ball.
        Another that Wishnowsky might be able to do because of his rugby skills, is taking a full swing at the ball, but only hit a glancing blow , so it spins along the ground in an arc to a designated spot where the whole side can converge upon it, and only a couple opponents can.
        If everyone is up, a pooch kick might get it over the line of opponents, and land before the returner can reach it.
        There are many ways make an onside kick. However, I will agree with you. Whatever the Niners are doing, is not working.

  35. Jack Hammer,
    Hope this finally puts an end to the Mullens, Garoppolo comparisons.

    Perhaps it’s time to write articles on which direction the 49ers may go with on QB next year (if you haven’t already).

    1. Watching Grant is like watching a comedy show. He clearly has no direction to report the facts. It’s like a bunch of guys sitting at a pub talking BS football.

  36. Mullens is the first QB in the history of the game that threw a interception while praticing on the sidelines, well we know who will be starting next game. Niners will be 5 and 11 time to discuss QB’s for next season. I would get rid of Garoppolo and that 25 million dollar salary to free up the cap. Sam Darnold will be available after the Jets pick Trevor Lawrence, that does not make me feel great.

  37. Kshan still suffers from dumb stubbornness to assess his players properly…..

    You mean after 3 yrs kshan can’t tell Mullens is a freaking joke…he should have at least given beathard a chance to start today..

    Yea I recall praising mullens 2 yrs ago….but I hv never seen a qb regress this much….maybe Kap

    Bye bye mullens….and kshan needs to freaking grow up and make solid choices….how many times are we going to go thru this b.s

  38. 1. It is all coming back to me. Last year , the weekend before Christmas, Niners played the Rams on Saturday night. I missed much of the game due to a family event. I ended up watching early Sunday morning. Highbee ate us alive. The game was about to go to overtime. Jimmy drove us the length of the field , converting on 2 separate 3-16s, to set up the game winning FG.

    2. Jimmy stats the second half of 2019 after Goodwin and Pettis were replaced by Deebo and E. Sanders :
    197/287 2487 Yards 18TD 6 INT
    extrapolated for an entire season :
    394/574 4974 Yards 36 TD 12INT
    3. During that stretch the Niners beat 5 playoff teams and were 4-1 versus the NFC West. The only loss was an overtime loss to Seattle – our backup kicker missed a 40 yd fg attempt. Note also that Kittle was out 4 games in the 2nd half of 2019.
    4. Jimmy is a good QB when healthy and playing with competent receivers. Who could of imagined. He has a quick release and knows how to run the Shanahan offense. He does throw the mind boggling pick which is something which frustrates us all. He should work on that – somehow ????
    5. Bring back a healthy Jimmy in 21 . Shut down Kittle , Mostert, Warner and Deebo until next year. I guess add a qb later in the draft but JG has earned 1 more season with the Niners.

    6. Anticipated stat coming via Sports Illustrated (the Troll Factory) : In the 4th quarter of meaningless games with no chance of victory, Mullens has the highest rating of any 49ers quarterback.

    1. One more thing – Jimmy was 5-1 versus the NFC west in 2019 and 4 of the 6 games came down to the final possession. His stats were : 144/210 1763 Yards 11TD 6 Int

      1. You are 100% right Rollo but most of the people on this site have lost any grasp they had on common sense. This season was destroyed by injuries. Period. You can’t overcome the number and level of players this team lost for the season or huge parts of it. Moving on from Garoppolo would be a major mistake, but it’s going to be talked about non stop until there is a clear resolution and even then some of the tin foil hat crowd won’t believe it and continue to speculate on what they think is really going on. Heck we have somebody blaming the Coach for injuries and another wanting him put on the hot seat. One of the best offensive minds in the game. Took the team to the SB. Hasn’t been able to work a miracle and win in spite of missing half his roster at one time or another. Might be time for him to go? Just complete insanity.

        1. Could not agree more. I guess it is emotions that overrule intelligence. The people that make these stupid comments appear to be knowledgeable so I can only assume they let their emotions rule.

        2. Moving on from Garoppolo would be a major mistake,

          Not sure it would be a mistake, but it would certainly be a high risk move. I find it difficult to defend such a high risk move when the healthy team is a top-5 team in talent, and is ready to compete for championships.
          Folks correctly point to the risk of losing a lot of players to FA due to reduced cap, but this problem exists for every team. Niners, OTOH, have a very good talent evaluators in front office which gives them an advantage.

      2. JG also had the 2nd lowest average depth of target of any starting QB last season, the highest YAC per completion, one of the highest play action %s, yet still had one of the highest INT %s. The scheme was a pretty big factor in his stats.

        1. You mean he’s a system QB that does not require him to throw deep often, but when he does, he has the highest efficiency in the league, as he did in 2019? I like those types of QBs!

          1. :-P

            He’s a competent starting QB that has proven he can run a Shanahan offense effectively when they have a viable running game and good defense. But he’s also shown he is a limited QB that Shanahan needs to scheme around and that when asked to push the ball down the field can make too many poor decisions.

            1. Scooter,

              I am not at all convinced that Jimmy cannot make the deep throws. I know he has missed open receivers deep on a few key plays. That does not mean he lacks deep throw accuracy. I think his deep passing accuracy is pretty decent in contrast to Wilson and Rodgers who have elite deep accuracy.

              All passing accuracy has to do with (1) skill set (including reading D) and arm strength(2) familiarity with offensive scheme, and (3) communication and good connections with the receivers.
              When a QB has started as few games as Jimmy G, has had so little continuity with receivers as he has, and plays in a scheme that has probably the lowest % of deep passing opportunities, it takes a while.

              But he’s also shown he is a limited QB that Shanahan needs to scheme around and that when asked to push the ball down the field can make too many poor decisions.

              First, most of Jimmy’s poor decisions appear to me to be on intermediate throws outside numbers, not on deep passes.
              Second, I have seen no evidence that Kyle has needed to scheme around Jimmy. He has run the ball down the throat when he could do it (as in the playoffs) and he has had Jimmy throw it when needed to (as in NO). This story-line has been cooked up by the national writers of fantasy football who don’t understand that Kyle’s offense is run-based and he will run it 40 times and throw it 20 times if he has success doing so.
              Third, while searching for the “unlimited” QB, it’s worth keeping an old adage in mind (one an Aussie may agree with :) — a bird in hand is worth two in the bush…

              1. How many games is enough? Should we wait until Jimmy signs another $130+ million dollar contract? He is being paid like a franchise QB. If he was on a rookie contract that would be one thing, but he is not.

              2. He is being paid like a franchise QB.

                That’s correct, and that’s because Shanalynch have decided that he’s their franchise QB — for the duration of the 5-year contract under normal circumstances, or for shorter span based on the cap hit in being cut.

                How many games is enough?

                A good coach (Bill Parcells? Mike Holmgren? can’t quite recall) used to say that he thought a QB needs 30+ games (about 2 seasons) of starting experience before he would make a judgement on the QB’s future as a starter.

                Jimmy G’s case is different. Except for a small fraction of fans, there is no doubt to NFL world that he’s an above-average starter who can run his team’s offense. The main questions on him seem to be (1) whether he can stay healthy and (2) continue to improve in his decision making.

                I think that another full season will be enough to determine whether he’s made of cardboard and whether he can get better on decision making. For the first time, he will have a competent complement of wide receivers for a full season. He had half season and post season with Sanders and Samuel. His interception rate went down significantly and QB rating went up once Sanders started in October 2019. Aiyuk next season will be a significant upgrade over Sanders last season.

              3. Mood, re JG’s deep ball, he tried a few in 2017 and they were mostly abysmal. Sincenthen he has barely attempted to throw deep. His completion % on those isn’t terrible, but that’s largely because he mostly only throws it when his guy is wide open – his guys have needed to stop and come back to it a number of times. He isn’t accurate deep, he knows it, and so he doesn’t attempt it often.

                As for scheming around JG’s limitations – limited deep ball passer and also doesn’t like throwing to the sideline often either… also questionable decisions over the middle. Shanahan knows this and plans around it. Gives him a lot of easy passes where he feels comfortable.

              4. Mood:

                I’m not necessarily against another year if it makes sense. If it were me I would balance the “desire/need” to keep Jimmy G with the following:

                1) how strong the QB rookie class is for the 2021 draft versus the 2022 class
                2) where the 49ers anticipate drafting in 2021 versus 2022. For a potential franchise QB, you pretty much have to draft in the first round (only Wilson and Prescott have been exceptions over the last 10 years)
                3) determine how the free agency needs in 2021 versus 2022 impact this decision
                4) estimated total salary cap in 2021 and 2022
                5) which veteran QBs are available in FA in 2021 and 2022 (although 2021 is more important) that would not “break the bank”, but could likely be more successful under KS versus their current team (example: Sam Darnold).

                The team has the in-house experience/expertise to evaluate these factors. There are probably others which don’t come to mind at the moment. But 1 and 2 are key. If we can’t get a 1st round QB, the odds go way, way down of drafting a franchise QB.

              5. Scooter,

                He isn’t accurate deep, he knows it, and so he doesn’t attempt it often.

                I’m afraid that your assertions like the one above do not appear to be based on any data. I can easily make a reasonable counter assertion that Jimmy G does not throw deep often because this O line cannot consistently pass block for 5-6 seconds that is needed for deep routes to develop by the Niners receiver corps. They can pass block for 5-6 seconds only in deception situations like play action. And it’s not reasonable to expect deep passes on every play action.

                re JG’s deep ball, he tried a few in 2017 and they were mostly abysmal.

                So Jimmy arrives on October 31 and starts in 4 weeks after practicing with the scout team and he’s expected to have established sufficient rapport with Goodwin (the only deep route runner with any cred) to be judged on his deep passing accuracy? Hmm..

                I’m not a big fan of PFF gradings and ratings but at least they go through snap in making an evaluation. So even with my reservations about PFF, I’d put their opinion ahead of those without any data to back their opinions.
                They rated Jimmy 8th in deep passing performance last season, despite the small sample size.

              6. Mood, it was on very few attempts. Only 8 of his passes went deeper than 30 yards all year. Of which he completed 3. And a lot of those completions were when the receiver was wide open, and the passes weren’t super accurate. Take the 75 yard TD to Sanders vs the Saints – Sanders had to slow, basically stop, to wait for the ball to catch it. It was a common theme for his deep passes last year.

              7. Cubus,

                If it were me I would balance the “desire/need” to keep Jimmy G with the following:

                I am not going to overthink or overanalyze the situation. As you wrote, the Niners FO can do that.
                IMO, Niners should consider a top 4 QB in Round 1 since they will probably draft in the 10-15 range. If they are not in love with the ones that slip to them, then they should probably trade back and get a QB later in the first or early second round but also getting that speed rusher for Kocurek’s Turbo group.

                Having a talented pick in the 15-30 range as a backup QB on rookie contract is worth the money. Either he can replace Jimmy after a season or two or can be traded for a second round pick in the fourth season if he develops well and Jimmy continues to excel. A win-win situation for the Niners, IMO.

                One thing I am pretty confident is that Shanalynch will not dump Jimmy G to a save some money without having acquired a better QB as a replacement. And that replacement is most likely not a rookie.

              8. Lawson put on a show tonight. I don’t think the Bengals picked up his option so he’s a f/a next year. I wonder if Kocurek would like him. Only question mark is one we’re all too familiar with, and that’s the injuries….

    1. That is a very interesting question and I don’t know.
      As good of a qb class as this is, the difference between Lawrence and every other qb in this class is HUGE.

      If I take over the JETS, I likely would trade back. A qb alone doesn’t do anything for them. They need a ton of talent just to become below average, and give any qb there a shot to succeed.

      This makes it more likely that a qb falls imo.

      The question is, if SF ends up picking at 8 and Kyle’s least favorite qb prospect is the only left (lets just say Field’s for arguments sake) is he someone you would want to take in the top 10? Or Would you rather just trade back collect multiple picks maybe a 1 in the 20’s and a 2nd?
      It’s an interesting delema, and I am not opposed to keeping Jimmy, but I think they will need commit one way or another this year and can’t kick the can down the road at the qb spot. I don’t see them drafting a qb in the 2nd in any scenario, maybe in the 3rd or 4th if someone falls, in which case they are drafting them to be a backup, not a franchise qb they are committed to.

    1. Walter Football (they are not the football gospel, but not many are) has Lawrence and Fields going 1 and 2 with Lance and Trask sitting at the bottom half of the 1st rd. Wilson doesn’t even appear in the 2nd rd on Walter’s draft site.

      According to Walter and Charlie, the 49ers pass on Wilson with 1st and 2nd rd picks.
      But again, these guys aren’t the gospel on draft reliability.

      1. AES
        What was the date of the Walter Football article? If it’s the one I seen, it was back in the early fall of 2020…..Which also explains the Wilson rating.

  39. My early okie dokie predictions for 2021

    1. JG is still the QB with a restructured deal
    2. Niners sign T. Williams, K Williams, Verrett, Jus, Hyder, J Reed.
    3. See ya Sherman, Ford, CJ or Mullens, McKinnon, Witherspoon, and others
    4. The Niners will draft a QB but not in the first two rounds.

    I am not at all opposed to drafting a QB in the first round, nor am I opposed to some sort of deal to bring in someone like Stafford. I just don’t think those things will happen.

    1. 1. I agree with this.
      2. K. Williams and Hyder may have too high of a price tag. Juice probably will as well, but the 49ers will not find a better FB.
      3. Yep.
      4. I think the 49ers could draft a QB in the second round, but I agree they with the thinking they will not take one in the first round.

    2. UC,
      I like your “Okie Dokie” predictions. Hope to see more throughout the off season leading up to the draft.

      Aside from Lawrence (who we would need to give up to much for), I don’t see another QB in the draft that can make a big impact next year. I also said last month that we should keep JG if he’s willing to restructure his contract.
      If he and his agent don’t want to go that route then we likely won’t have any other choice, but to let him walk.

      1. One that allows key players like Trent Williams and Ward to stay with the team.
        I don’t view players like Sherman, McKinnon, Coleman, T. Tayler, Bourne and Dee Ford as key players anymore.

        I see JG as a core player for the immediate future. So, to that end, I’ll leave it to the FO office to figure it out.
        Mine and your reasons for how they go about it really don’t matter in the scheme of things.

        I believe that JG will do his due diligence and test the FA waters, but I doubt that there will be many takers. His best chance at continued success is staying in Shanahan’ offense which is why I believe that he and 49ers can work on a middle ground for him to to stay.

        The FO will have their work cut out for them this off season, but I find it hard to believe that gutting out key players like JG, TW and Ward is part of their plan.

        1. Nice cop out. The answer someone gives when they don’t really have an answer.

          C’mon, give it a go.

          Are we talking a pay cut? If so I find it hard to believe JG would agree to that. It’s not like he is overpaid relative to the vet starting QB market.

          Or are we talking moving cap hit to later years? If so, how much? Are you thinking they restructure to bring his cap hit down significantly, or modestly? And if they move cap hit to later years, what does his cap hit in 2022 look like? How much dead cap would they be looking at carrying if they cut/ trade him in 2022?

          It is all well and good to say they can restructure him, but reducing a $26.9M cap hit through restructuring is a lot of cap hit to be pushing around. And if they want to reduce his cap hit significantly then you are basically locking the team into JG for at least two more years. Would seem a strange move after they passed on doing just that this past offseason – an offseason where the team desperately needed to find cap space and directly after a season where people keep telling me JG played really well.

          1. A lot of things are easier said then done – yup. If I new the answer to the question I would be negotiating football contracts. It seems like you think its an impossible thing to do, or its in the way of your thinking that a rookie is the best way to go. I am not at all saying these moves are the best ones made I am saying its what I see happening. Its going to be an interesting off season to watch it all unfold.

            1. “It seems like you think its an impossible thing to do”.

              Not at all. Just cognizant that it will just mean he becomes even more expensive later, and reduces the flexibility the team has with moving on from him.

              Tbh, if the 49ers don’t find themselves in a position to take one of the top QBs in the draft I think they will stick with JG and draft one of the next tier of QBs to be his backup/ groom to be his replacement. But in such a scenario I think the team is better off just keeping JG under his current contract.

              1. I am not in favor of restructures Scooter, I am not even saying that I favor any of what I said, I am just saying this is what I think is going to happen.

          2. You just presented a few scenarios. But according to your points what makes you think that the Org is tied to any of them?

            Copping out? Nah. Just saying that if the 49ers really want to keep Garoppolo, they will find a way that doesn’t necessarily have to meet our expectations.
            I leave the logistics to those who get paid for them.

            1. If they really want to keep JG, yes, they will find a way.

              It’s not like there are hundreds of ways to go about it. Just a few. Keep him on what he is currently on, cut him, trade him (if he agrees to be traded), ask him to take a pay cut (seems unlikely), convert salary to signing/option bonus to push cap hit to future years, or add years to his deal plus convert salary to signing/option bonus to push even more to future years. Those are the options.

              Obviously when it comes to converting salary to bonus, they then have to decide how much.

              So yeah, I think they are locked into one of those options, as those are the options available.

  40. KS should have been bold, and gone for it, instead of settling for a Field Goal. He should have had better time out management, and stopped running into the teeth of the defense.
    McGlinchey was a turnstile, and contributed to the turnovers.
    However, most of the blame has to go to Mullens. He telegraphed throws by staring down the receiver. He crumbled under pressure, and I hope this ends any comparison he has with JG. I still hope the Niners retains his talents, and maybe get a 4th or 5th round pick for him, but right now, CJB is not shell shocked, so he is a superior option. His mobility allowed CJB to elude the pass rush so he bought time to see open receivers.
    They should have done what I advocated, and made it competitive. Once Mullens turned over the ball, he had to let CJB take the snaps, until he fails to score. It would be good incentive, to make Mullens have better ball security.
    In the second half, the game was tied, and the Niners had the ball. They snatched defeat from the jaws of victory.

      1. If the 49ers organization had been heeding my advice since the early 2000s this franchise would have won at least 2 or 3 additional Super Bowls.
        But you are of the crowd that prefers to lose than win.
        ‘Tis a shame..

  41. Why, after all of Mullens gaffs, did it take an injury for CJ Beathard to finally get some snaps? Why did Beathard even make this team then? Why was he taking up a roster spot early in the season? Is it because Kyle can’t admit he made a mistake in drafting him? I really don’t get it!

    I am sorry but the sad state of the Niners QB situation rests on Kyle Shanahan, and for that … I’m starting to wonder if Kyle can ever fix the QB position!

    Garoppolo is injury prone, and the 49ers don’t have a viable option behind him. That’s inexcusable now, moving forward! Whatever they do this offseason, they need a viable, reliable QB under center!

    1. Going into this season the 49ers were rated as having one of the best QB depth charts in the league because they had a top ten starter (based on his numbers from 2019), a good backup who showed he could come in and keep them competitive and a 3rd guy who had played enough that he could also keep them competitive if they had to go that far down the line. This season has been a disaster due to injuries. What is so hard to understand? If Mullens was operating with all the weapons they have been missing you might have a point, but he hasn’t and on top of that they have had to start an OG at C who never played the position before along with a revolving door at RG. Making any kind of judgement on this team based on what has happened this season is moronic.

  42. “I am sorry but the sad state of the Niners QB situation rests on Kyle Shanahan, and for that … I’m starting to wonder if Kyle can ever fix the QB position!”

    Actually, Shanahan fixed it last year to the effect of reaching the SB.
    Garoppolo was not spectacular last year, but he was very efficient.

    We don’t know what we don’t know.
    And no one knows how a healthy Garoppolo with all his key weapons might have done this year.

    All we have is Garoppolo’ history to go on. And last year Jimmy got us to the Big Show – that ain’t bad.

    1. AES,

      Interceptions since 2018:

      49ers QB’s – 50
      Aaron Rodgers – 10

      Jimmy is inconsistent and injury prone, and these numbers prove it.

      1. The 49ers almost won a Super Bowl based almost entirely on the strength of their defense and rushing attack.

        Does anyone really dispute this? The defense carried them through the first half of 2019, and Jimmy barely threw a pass in the postseason. And when he was forced to win a championship through the air …. we all saw the result.

        1. Jimmy ain’t “IT”!

          And that pains me to say because before the knee injury, I thought he could be. He’s a broken mess of a QB, post injury!

          Poor mechanics. Happy feet. No mobility. No confidence. No durability. $25+M

            1. You failed to mention that J G had the 8th highest passer rating last year. He had the 5th highest completion percentage. Anybody can pick and choose stats but it’s pretty easy to see he is the best QB we’ve had in years and he took us to the SB. Yes he missed a pass to maybe win the game but the defense gave up 3 touchdowns so let’s put the blame where it belongs.

          1. We need QBs with extra strong tendons and ligaments to withstand 300 lb offensive linemen rolling on their ankles after getting pushed back….

            1. From what I’ve read on here it’s all because Garoppolo has lost his confidence. If he only had it he could have easily walked away from large men falling on his ankles.

      2. I must be worse at math than I thought. Can you explain how three interceptions in 2018, thirteen interceptions in 2019, and five interceptions this season equals 50 interceptions? Last time I knew, 3 + 13 + 5 = 21.

        1. 49ers QB’s – 50 INT’s since 2018,
          Aaron Rodgers – 10 in the same span.

          Reading is key, bro

          The point is, despite acquiring Jimmy in 2017, the 49ers have thrown 50 INT’s since 2018, in large part because Jimmy CAN’T STAY HEALTHY, and is inconsistent when he is “healthy” (which he really hasn’t been since injuring his knee).

          1. Reading is key, bro

            Yes it is, and how you worded it isn’t good because 50 interceptions thrown by Garoppolo, Beathard, and Mullens is not a great example of Garoppolo being inconsistent or injury prone. However, it does show that the three have not done their job in keeping the rock out of the opponent’s hands which in turn can lead to a conclusion that Shanahan has yet to find the right QB coach.

            1. That’s the problem. When Jimmy is on the field, he’s mostly inconsistent. The occasional stellar game, but mostly inconsistent. But the guy can’t stay on the field, and his backups absolutely suck! Even the Cowboys have a better backup and it’s McCarthy’s first season as Cowboys HC.

              Why has Kyle failed so spectacularly at developing a backup QB, 4 years in? Someone, please explain that to me. It doesn’t take a genius to see that Mullens is not physically capable, does it? I mean, WTF?

      3. And when was the last time Aaron Rodgers went to the SB?
        This is why I often take stats with a grain of salt.
        Hammer tried this two weeks when comparing Mullens’ numbers to Garoppolo’.

        Unlike Garoppolo, Rodgers has won a SB ring, but he has yet to go back.
        This always goes back to my contention that it takes more than an elite QB to win a SB.

        1. AES
          * Would you argue “JG took us to the SB,” or agree it was the D (in the 1st half of the season), and then the running game that got us there?
          * The question is: Is JG the same QB he WAS when the 9ers acquired him from NE, or has he regressed? * NFL = 1) Not for long and 2) what have you done for me lately…..Does 1 + 2 = $25 Million in 2021? That is the question the 9er FO is now facing and forced to decide.
          * In addition to that, the $175 Million 2021 team Salary Cap, will help determine who will be playing for the 49ers in 2021. Do you agree, or disagree?

          1. They don’t get to the SB without Garoppolo. That should be pretty obvious to anyone with an ounce of objectivity based on what we’ve seen from this team when he isn’t in there. If you want to say JG was inconsistent, there is some merit to that, but he played very well overall in 2019 and was a key reason they won all the games they did. He also did all that in his first full season of starting coming off of a major knee injury. It’s amazing how quickly some of you forget how this team looked before Garoppolo and now how they look when he’s not in there. Bottom line is winning games and he does that.

            1. If the options are between JG and the other QBs on the roster last year, completely agree. But I also think there are more than just a handfulmof starting NFL QBs that could have taken the 49ers to the SB last year.

              1. I don’t dispute that at all and have said before that if you are saying we can get Rodgers as our starter next year I’ll drive Garoppolo to the airport, but that’s not happening. We can only base this on what we have on the roster and what we can reasonably acquire and imo Garoppolo is the best option we can realistically go into next season with.

          2. If the 49ers want to begin a quasi rebuild program in 5 years then it makes sense to unload JG.
            But if they feel that Garoppolo still gives them a better chance at winning, it’s expedient for them to explore all possibilities in an effort to keep him.

            The key in all this may come down to how the FO really feels about JG.
            Here’s another possibility that hasn’t been explored. What if they let Trent Williams walk instead of Garoppolo? As good as Williams is, is he a viable long term player we can depend on.

            Who do you take if it came down to keeping Williams or Garoppolo?

  43. I’m not sure, but I’m gonna assume that Jimmy G’s contract has an injury clause. So, if he is available to play, whether or not he plays might tell us something about his future. However, most likely if they don’t want him to have a possible injury, he most likely won’t be cleared to play.

    Also, as I posted earlier, Maiocco can’t see a scenario where Jimmy takes a pay cut. I can’t see the “players” GM, John Lynch, potentially wanting to “insult” Jimmy G by asking him to take a pay cut. A restructure, would probably involve a bonus and cap hits would just be pushed out. But if they do that, why didn’t they do that before the season started when his arrow was pointing up? I’m sure they had an inkling before the season that the salary cap would go down and they certainly knew what the FA situation would be like.

        1. I’m not really a fan of Rosen. He’s been dealt a bad hand, no doubt, but the questions around his personality always made me a bit wary of him.

    1. I don’t see Jimmy taking a pay cut and more importantly I don’t see the Niners asking for one. He’s not overpaid for that position.

    2. But if they do that, why didn’t they do that before the season started when his arrow was pointing up?

      A strong argument can be made that his arrow was not pointing up though.

        1. True, but there many pundits who weren’t impressed with him in 2019 and calling for the 49ers to trade for Cousins or sign Brady during the off season.

          1. Yep. Because while his stat line looked impressive, his play was spotty and helped tremendously by scheme. Probably why the team decided to wait a year before making a decision on whether to restructure/ extend his deal.

    3. You guys keeping going back to last year…last year is history the entire financial situation has dramatically changed since last year, hell do the Niners even have a home any more. What if no one is allowed in the stands next year…no, no, no, its a new game with the check book and its a game where players and owners alike have never had to deal with.

      Its quite certain there is a segment that has had it with JG, which is fine and finding arguments to support something you don’t like is understood. Instead of using all the money being saved nonsense just come out and just say it JG sucks and we want a new rookie QB. At least that’s a more honest approach.

      1. I am being honest when I say the cap situation is the reason I believe the team should move on from JG if they can draft one of the top QBs.

        If they can find the cap space to keep JG (without committing to him beyond 2021) and a very strong roster around him plus get a good rookie QB to groom, that is my number 1 preference, no question.

  44. Can’t afford to pay an inconsistent QB who can’t stay healthy, $25+M/year. Can’t do it! Not with a reduced salary cap!

    He’s as good as gone.

  45. Here’s an assessment by one of the NN writers:

    “As things currently stand, San Francisco will have the 11th pick in the 2021 NFL Draft. There are three teams ahead of the Niners who are likely taking a quarterback. The New York Jets, Jacksonville Jaguars and Carolina Panthers have major question marks at quarterback and are in line all pick in the top four.”


    “Another option for San Francisco is to take a QB in the middle rounds to try and groom behind Garoppolo for the next year or two. Unfortunately, other than Russell Wilson and Dak Prescott, no other QBs selected in the third round or later over the last 10 years has amounted to much.”

    1. If the 49ers lose out, they could be drafting top 7.

      Unfortunately, I am not sure exactly what the answer is at QB right now, but I am pretty darn sure Garoppolo ain’t it at his price.

      And I know damn well Mullens ain’t it …. at ANY price!

    2. If they miss out on one of the top guys I expect they will either trade back or trade up from the 2nd round for one of Trask or Jones.

      I don’t see them waiting until the mid rounds for a QB no matter what they do with JG.

  46. One thing that hasn’t been considered is maybe the Niners plan all along is to keep Jimmy G for the remaining 2 years. They keep building up the roster and after the 2 years of his contract, start imploding the entire roster.

    Maybe they spend the next 2 years retooling the roster, specifically the oline and secondary.

    They have a few high priced guys coming off the books where you could say, that was the plan all along.

    Shanahan and Lynch are too smart to leave this up to chance. They’ve had a plan since coming here and most of it has worked.

    1. They’ve had a plan since coming here and most of it has worked?

      Lol. They have 1 winning season … out of 4.

      Is that the bar? Seriously? I know they took over a dumpster fire, but let’s not pretend it’s all been rosy, because it hasn’t!

      No matter how hard you want to fight it …. the fact of the matter is that Garoppolo was supposed to be the answer, and he has been inconsistent, and injury prone, with no viable option behind him.

      That’s a fact!

      1. Remember the first 2 years was taking a high school roster, blowing it up and rebuilding it.
        Made it the most the SB. Then a year ravaged by everything that could go wrong and did.

        People tend to conveniently forget the past.
        You remember what life was like before Shanahan and Lynch?

      2. Dude, I grew up watching the 49ers during their hay day. I think I know what success on the football field looks like.

        ShanaLynch have one winning season, and the QB room is a mess, IMO.

        Unfortunately, with the salary cap situation, that means they are already trending down, big time. Can they turn things back around? Yes, but it starts at QB. Until they get that fixed ……

        1. I don’t know, no one knows but they will have to get the QB position sorted out one way or the other.
          I’m just saying the plan might be ride with Jimmy till his contract is up.

          I can see them doing exactly what the Rams did. Continue to build around a QB no believes in exact the franchise.

        2. I hear you Prime, but I’ve seen enough of Jimmy to know he’s a big risk moving forward. And I realize that’s extremely unfortunate, but it is what it is, as they say.

          Don’t you think it’s better to know it, and deal with it, than to pretend it isn’t a problem?

          Refusing to fix what is broken at the core, is never the right way to go, especially with the issues of a shrinking salary cap, IMO.

          Are you telling me you don’t question Kyle’s judgement just a little bit, with the way the backup QB position has played out?

          Come on, Mullens is a disaster, and CJ Beathard still couldn’t get a start.

          1. Maybe you are right. I’m not arguing that things are fine with Jimmy. All I’m saying is the front office might have a plan that’s not what the fan base wants.

            I know one thing, 100%. Jimmy is better than Mullen’s.

            1. I know you aren’t Prime, I’m just venting.

              This has been an extremely frustrating season. No joke, I thought this team had a shot at an undefeated season if Jimmy had played well and they remained relatively healthy. That said, I had zero confidence in the backup QB’s. We’ve already seen that they can’t win with a pretty good roster.
              And I thought Jimmy would be improved over last season. Instead, he was even worse, and then he got hurt on a nothing play. Practically non contact ….. again! And then AGAIN! Same ankle, different injury! How can they expect to win consistently with such a huge chunk of salary cap space hung up on IR?

              He dances in the pocket. I don’t think I have ever seen happier feet. How many wide open receivers just flat out missed? And I am sorry, but if you can’t stay healthy, you aren’t holding up your end of the bargain.

          2. And the thing is … both Mullens and Beathard had very underwhelming 2019 & 2020 training camps. That’s according to multiple reliable sources.

          1. The GLORY DAYS!

            Season tickets, 1982-96. Section 40, Upper Reserved. Not the best seats, but wow, just WOW!

            I will say though, even though it didn’t end with a trophy …. 2019 was a special season! Really well coached on both sides of the ball.

            I understand 2020 has been racked with injuries, but this hasn’t been Kyle’s best work, IMO.

            1. Jimmy was woefully inconsistent in 2019, and, save for 1 half of a game, Jimmy was absolutely awful this season, IMO. He is regressing by the season. Almost by the game, lol. He just hasn’t been the same guy, post knee reconstruction. Everything is a miss. His mechanics? Oh geesh. Why the happy feet? Why? Why the brutal INT almost every game? Why the inaccuracy? No ability to escape the pocket and extend a play. None!

              1. I know why Jimmy is innacurate!

                For starters, his mechanics are piss poor, that’s why! It starts with his base. Rarely sets his feet and properly transfers his weight. All arm, all different arm slots.

                No consistency with his mechanics, and he’s lost most of his mobility. Because of this, his confidence is gone. That’s a bad combination!

            2. All of us on here I would say have seen the glory days. But for some of us, we’ve moved on and know the NFL has changed 360 degrees from then.

              I’m the first to say Kyle needs to take complete accountability for this year, the injuries and lack of development at the QB position.

              This offseason is the most critical for the franchise for the next 5 years. Just be ready for the next 2 years to maybe include Garoppolo

              1. Yah, I agree with that Prime, and it starts at QB, IMO. Garoppolo is a risk they cannot afford to take at this stage.

                I want to be on record: Jimmy Garoppolo’s best days are behind him. If they bring Jimmy back, it will be a big mistake, especially at his current salary. And I just don’t think making him take a pay cut is the right move.

                There. I said it! Done!

              2. Tell me this, Prime …..

                Can you see with your own eyes that Mullens’ problem is as much physical as it is mental?

                If you can see it, and I can see it, and the rest of the league can see it, how is it the HC can’t see it, 4 YEARS into his tenure? If a QB isn’t able to anticipate and throw his receivers open, AND he also struggles with arm talent/strength, how is he supposed to succeed in the NFL?

              3. NFL QB’s can’t simply wait till they see the receiver open, to make the throw. It’s usually too late by then, especially with a weak arm. That’s who Nick Mullens is, and always has been! My god, he’s just not capable. Seems like a nice kid, but come on, what is Kyle thinking keeping this kid as the backup for 4 years? And even worse, why is Beathard even on the team if you don’t even think he is capable of starting ahead of a struggling Mullens? I just don’t get it! What is Kyle thinking? I am really starting to question his judgement, for the first time since he came on board.

        1. Thanks Jerry, I’d gladly eat crow. BTW, I was on the Jimmy train until this season, despite his inconsistent play in 2019. But he lost me this season, and I am not coming back around any time soon.

          Thankfully, I don’t think I’ll have to. I expect he’ll be gone after this season. At least I can hope.

          1. But he lost me this season

            Pretty damn small sample to have lost you. Even so, the team had a winning record when he played full games.

            1. This is the same guy who writes stuff like he is part of the teams promotional dept before the games start and then is the first to disappear when things don’t go well. This message board vomiting is par for the course for him.

    1. I am guessing that’s about right. I don’t think they’ll win another game this season, that’s for sure.

      Man, Razor, I am really frustrated tonight. The Dak’less Cowboys? Really? Kyle couldn’t find a way to beat a Cowboys team that couldn’t run the football? Are you kidding me? Maybe he’s tanking? I almost hope he is, because today was too much for me. I HATE the Cowboys worse than the Seahawks and Dodgers! Holy cow! Mullens was sooooo bad again today! I think I could do better, I really do! That’s what Kyle excuses as his prodigy – backup QB? Are you kidding me?

      I am done with Kyle’s Niners for the night. Too frustrating! Catch you guys later. Peace out!

        1. Pollard broke a nice long run late in the game. Other than that he was totally bottled up, basically a non factor as a runner.

          The 49ers beat themselves, which is becoming a running theme. I believe Kyle is one of the top offensive minds in the game, but there are other aspects to head coaching that I am starting to seriously wonder about.

      1. Kyle couldn’t find a way to beat a Cowboys team that couldn’t run the football?

        So was it Kyle, playing QB, that coughed up the ball 3 times, the margin of victory? Kyle that let an onsides KO run back for a TD adding insult to injury? If you blame Kyle for playing Mullens, then yeah I agree with you. But you are the one that claims he has to move on from the only QB that has won games for the team the last 4 years. Get ready for a lot more of Kyle defeats if he were to listen to the fakakta advice coming from the likes of you.

  47. Oh, one more point, and I’ll keep reminding everyone of this again and again, until the position gets fixed, lest we never forget:

    Kyle Shanahan is responsible for fixing the QB position. The same Kyle Shanahan who had every opportunity to draft both Patrick Mahomes and Deshaun Watson (but passed), and spent a 3rd round pick on CJ Beathard, yet stuck with Nick Mullens (and a 2nd roster spot for Beathard) as his backup QB’s for 4 seasons.

    1. At some point, Kyle Shanahan needs to swallow that humble pie and realize he doesn’t have all of the answers, because something is clearly off. Sure, they have injuries, but the Cowboys are almost as injured, and they just won the turnover battle 4-0. That’s UNACCEPTABLE!

  48. Once again, KS just does not seem to have the proper game management skills needed to react to adversity. He does not seem to be able to make the proper timely adjustments.
    KS keeps running into the teeth of the defense, and even I can call plays ahead of time, because he is so predictable. It was obtuse for him to think that putting Skule and McGlinchey on the right side was going to turn out well.
    He needs all the help he can get, so he should promote Mike Lafleur to OC. One added benefit to this move will be- Saleh will not be able to hire Mike Lafleur to be his OC, because it would be a lateral move, instead of a promotion. If Saleh does go to the Lions, he certainly will not want Stafford to go to the Niners.
    Maybe LaFleur will allow KS to be able to manage the clock correctly, so KS does not keep wasting time outs. He may be able to aid in the assessment process, so when Mullens decides to give away the game, LaFleur will yank him before Mullens can turn the ball over again.
    Mullens is being selfish, because he is hurting the team. He should volunteer to let CJB play, because he has pulled a Gabbert, and benched himself with his putrid performance.
    I still hope the Niners can win their last 2 games. They can play spoiler, but they should strive to win because they need to stop the losing. Trent Williams certainly will not return to a loser, and only by winning will they be able to attract decent FAs.

      1. Lol. It really seems like this dude is in a room by himself repeating the same things over and over going on years now. Kind of sad really.

  49. Mike McGlinchey, RT, 83.0, 84 snaps
    Raheem Mostert, RB, 80.9, 25 snaps
    Trent Williams, LT, 80.3, 84 snaps
    Laken Tomlinson, LG, 79.1, 84 snaps
    Daniel Helm, TE, 76.2, 21 snaps

    {PFF Grades}

    Ahkello Witherspoon, CB, 86.9, 57 snaps
    Arik Armstead, DE, 79.5, 48 snaps
    Dion Jordan, DE, 77.9, 12 snaps
    Kerry Hyder, DE, 74.1, 47 snaps
    Dre Greenlaw, LB, 73.5, 57 snaps

    1. McGlinchey hasn’t been great this season, but he’s been OK, IMO. He’s NOT the reason the 49ers can’t beat some of the league’s bottom feeders right now.

      It’s piss poor QB play combined with an apparent lack of focus, IMO, and to me, that’s on Kyle. I’m not saying they should beat the Saints, GB, etc, right now, but WTF and the Dak’less Cowboys? Come on man! Washington doesn’t even have a mascot for crying out loud!

    2. It’s the Glinchey Glitches — play well all game, and then have a couple of major whiffs or screwups at critical moments that feature prominently on the team lowlight reel — especially in a loss.

  50. 2020 NFL season post week 15 draft order for 2021 round #1
    1 Jacksonville Jaguars (1-13)
    2 New York Jets (1-13)
    3 Cincinnati Bengals (2-10-1)
    4 Carolina Panthers (4-10)
    5 Atlanta Falcons (4-10)
    6 Houston Texans [Pick goes to Miami] (4-10)
    7 Philadelphia Eagles (4-9-1)
    8 Dallas Cowboys (5-9)
    9 Los Angeles Chargers (5-9)
    10 New York Giants (5-8)
    11 Detroit Lions (5-9)
    12 San Francisco 49ers (5-9)

  51. Frank Gore ran for his 100th TD yesterday and broke the record for most games played by a RB (240 — beat Lorenzo Neal). Only 25 players in NFL history have scored more than 100 TDs. Had Gore been part of a good team before Harbaugh came along, he’d likely have scored another 25 TDs in his career. he just had one year of competent offensive play calling and design under Norv Turner before Harbaugh.

        1. You stated his trade value is poor. I asked how you knew. Your answer is you don’t. Problem solved.

          This guy at PFF took a stab at it, but his comparable is not the same as where Garoppolo is at now.

          I have said repeatedly that I don’t think the Niners will walk away from Garoppolo which includes a trade but for the sake of your second question, I think they could get a 2nd for him if they did go that route.

    1. If Garoppolo is as good as his supporters would have us believe, why is his trade value so poor?

      So we’re going to get back to the promised land by trading for someone with as much trade value as JG or a first season rook? Brillo plan there, 384

  52. Jack made a good point on his Twitter account re the salary cap. The way John Lynch has talked about it recently seems to correspond with the report earlier this month that the reduction isn’t expected to be as bad as first feared. That would be huge for the 49ers.

    If that’s the case the 49ers should be able to carry JGs contract and sign key FAs. They should still draft a QB high imo, but if they can afford to keep JG while still signing key FAs then that is their best option for 2021.

          1. Yes last year. You can’t judge him based on playing through a high ankle sprain with numerous players around him missing. Well you could and have apparently but those who are objective would disagree.

            1. Anybody that plays in this league understands you’re only as good as your last game, and last I checked, Jimmy has only been available for about 50% of the games since he’s been here….

              1. His last full game was a win over the Pats. Injuries are part of the game and his injuries are not chronic. He’s had the misfortune of tearing a ACL and suffering two High Ankle sprains within a few weeks of each other. In between he started 19 games and went to a SB but let’s focus on the stuff beyond anyone’s control because we are angry at the guy and the team for not fulfilling our expectations.

              2. Somebody breathes on him and he gets hurt. Face it, his body is not made for the NFL.

                He ripped his ACL on a boneheaded decision. Dude’s not very smart.

                You focus on the past you get stuck in it. The future is not Jimmy Garoppolo. The sooner you realize that, the sooner you can unhitch that water buffalo you keeping pulling around for him….

              3. If his body wasn’t made for the NFL he couldn’t have started every game in a 19 game season. Now you are blaming him for a torn ACL when we see that happen to multiple players every year for various reasons. Your narrative doesn’t fit man. He has had one major injury that cost him most of a season. This year he came back before his ankle had time to heal and it got rolled up again. That’s football and I’d be more concerned if he was a guy who didn’t want to play until he felt 100%.

                As far as focusing on the past, it was last season not a decade ago. We’ve seen what he can do in this offense over the course of a full season. You have decided to ignore that and write him off because he didn’t overcome a high ankle sprain and missing players to play at the level you wanted. That’s your right but it seems a little short sighted and based on frustration rather than what is best for the team.

              4. You’re Eucking aye right I’m blaming him for the ACL. Did you see it happen? Were we watching the same play? Any QB with half a brain goes out of bounds instead of planting his foot to get an extra 12 inches of insignificant real estate!

              5. The first clue that Jimmy isn’t the coldest beer in the fridge was when he got TMZ’d with the porn star after signing his big contract, and it was an ugly one to boot!

              6. I’ve seen many players do the exact same thing he did on the play he tore his ACL. Happens multiple times a week. Professional athletes are extremely competitive and will fight for every inch on the field. As far as the Porn star, what he does on his own time is his own business.

              7. You’re missing the point! Boneheaded decisions aren’t less boneheaded just because another bonehead makes the same decision. Are you kidding me right now? I don’t give a rats patoot what he does in his down time, but please, don’t attempt to excuse poor judgement. You lose all credibility when you do that….

              8. I’m not missing the point. I just don’t agree with your logic. Multiple players do the same thing every week because they are competitive and most of the time it doesn’t result in a ACL tear. It was an unlucky freak accident that could have happened any number of ways and has to too many NFL players.

              9. Smart quarterbacks go out of bounds with a defender bearing down on them. Not Jimmy. He changes his mind at the last moment putting his leg in a precarious position for the defender to wreck….

              10. pm
                Anybody that plays in this league understands you’re only as good as your last game,

                Don’t know about you 384, but I see a lot of players, especially QBs, having stunk up their last game, still playing.

              11. Walsh made sure you knew as a player that you were replaceable, and every time you stepped out on that football field you were held to account. That’s how you get 110% from players 100% of the time….

              12. Walsh also coached in an era of no salary cap, with an owner who gave him the personnel he asked for, price no object.

        1. Jimmy plays like a $25+ M QB about once every 5 games, at best. I’m thinking less than $14 M, because that’s kind of no man’s land.

      1. Same reason they paid him that amount this season. Basically one more prove it year, as this year got wiped out. If they can afford it they should do it.

          1. My belief is they didn’t restructure him because they wanted him to prove it this year. If they had buyer’s remorse they’d have moved on from him after the 2019 season. As this season has not been useful for evaluating him, if they can afford him for another year it makes sense to give him another prove it year.

            But they need to do so with a viable backup QB they can rely on keeping the team competitive if he gets hurt again and groom to replace him if he doesn’t prove himself.

            1. His contract was not set up to move on in 2019. Curiously enough, his contract is very favorable to moving on this year and next. My take is they didn’t restructure because of doubt, and I think you know it!

              1. Yes it was. His cap hit was very small if they cut him before this season. It was an extra $1.4M in dead cap compared to what it would be this year.

              2. I know that but when you look at the contract in it’s totality it was clearly set up to take assessments after 2019-2020 and respond accordingly.

              3. The fact that 2018 was a mulligan, they pretty much had no choice but to take another year to evaluate.

              4. And given 2020 was also a mulligan, if they can afford it, they should take another year to evaluate. No harm done if they can afford his contract without giving up much in other areas.

              5. For a game manager? Dunno. When you’re in position to get a franchise quarterback who would allow you to open up facets of your offense that have previously been unavailable to you, and devote $25 million into other assests; it’s a tough sell for mine. If they don’t do it I’ll feel like they’re scared. If they want to stamp their names along with the franchise’s legends, they have to take a swing now!

              6. For a game manager? Dunno. When you’re in position to get a franchise quarterback who would allow you to run your full offense and devote $25 million into other assests…it’s a tough sell for mine. If they don’t do it I’ll feel like they’re scared. If they want to stamp their names along with the franchise’s legends, they have to take a swing now!

                Right now they aren’t in position to get a franchise QB because the only one that exists in this draft is the guy who will go first. Every other candidate has major question marks. I’d be more scared dumping a proven winner at the NFL level to gamble on College QB’s with small resumes.

              7. This is one of the best quarterback draft classes in recent history. Brugler has four quarterbacks being taken in the top eight picks! Never happened before. The bigger question mark is if not now, when? These classes don’t come around every year, and it’ll be that year you decide to sit your Jimmy doll down and it’ll be too late baby now….

              8. We’ll have to agree to disagree because this isn’t one of the best QB classes based on resumes. Not even close actually. I can’t speak for Brugler but the fact there are multiple teams that desperately need a QB is driving the pick slotting more than the talent imo.

              9. Why would you speak for Bruglar when he’s already spoken, and highly respected in the scouting community? I thought your weren’t an expert?

              10. “And devote $25 million into other assets”.

                Razor, you need to keep in mind that even if they draft one of the top QBs (which I hope they do), they would still want a competent vet. The whole $25M of JG won’t go to other areas. At least half of that would likely go to the backup/ bridge QB.

                If the cap ends up being $195M rather than $175M, that $20M will be way more important and larger than the cap saving they get from replacing JG with another vet.

              11. But why would you speak for him? That’s the question. He’s the expert. He gave his opinion. Yours by extension doesn’t mean squat and neither does mine!

              12. Point taken, Scooter. Maybe they do give him one more year to recoup his stock while the rookie sits. Then move on in 2021 in similar fashion to the way Andy did with Alex Smith….

              13. Exactly what I was thinking razor. And if he balls out, then they have a cheap(ish) talented backup for a few years that they can use as a trade chip down the track.

              14. Razor, you need to keep in mind that even if they draft one of the top QBs (which I hope they do), they would still want a competent vet. The whole $25M of JG won’t go to other areas. At least half of that would likely go to the backup/ bridge QB.

                Seems like Sam Darnold would fit the bill.

              15. Cubus, they’d need to trade to get Darnold. So highly doubt that will be an option if they are also drafting a QB high.

              16. If they draft Lawrence, then it seems like Darnold is gone. Don’t you think a 4th or 5th rounder would do it?

              17. I think someone may give up more than a 5th for him, but a 4th may be enough. But if the 49ers need to give up any draft picks to draft their QB then giving up another mid round pick for a different QB may not be the best move.

      2. Jimmy Garoppolo full season ranking 2019:

        Completion percentage 5th
        Yardage 12th
        Avg per attempt 3rd
        TD passes Tied for 5th
        QBR 12th
        QB Rating 8th
        Won loss record 15-4

        That is a bargain for 25 mill.

        1. Those stats are mostly a product of scheme. Jimmy isn’t exactly a scrub, I’ll give him that. Just not a QB who can be remotely depended on.

          1. He’s certainly more talented than Mullens and Beathard, but that’s not saying much.

            Again …. the Niners defense carried the team during the first half of 2019, and the rushing game carried them through the playoffs. Jimmy had a few good games in-between.

            You can throw out all of the 2019 stats you want, the game film says otherwise.

            1. You say a lot of silly things. Go back and watch the Arizona, NO and final Seattle games and come back and tell me they didn’t depend on him. The defense was excellent last year but that doesn’t win you games on it’s own. Garoppolo played well for most of the season statistically and the won/loss column backed it up.

              1. You just never know what your going to get with Jimmy. Some games he looks like a franchise QB, some games he looks like a rookie. His mechanics are bad, which is why he struggles with accuracy on everything downfield.

                And tell me again how many games he has actually even played over the last 3 seasons?

              2. I’d also suggest you check out the second Rams game where he stood in the face of the rush up the middle and delivered on two different 3rd and 16’s to convert. Lots of good stuff to check out that you seem to have forgotten about or ignored.

              3. I never questioned his grit. He does hang tough in the pocket, too bad he also can’t escape it when it breaks down anymore, and extend plays. Not the same guy post ACL.

              4. All good points on both sides fellas.
                I’ll ask the board this. And this is last year but I’ll ask anyways.
                Why did Shanahan go away from the pass completely against Minny and GB?
                Was it because the oppenent couldn’t match up to the run scheme of the 49ers or was it because the HC didn’t trust his QB?
                I’m asking because I’m not sold on Shanny having the ability to develop a QB. Sure his scheme and play calling makes his QB look better than they are but what about the development of the player and the development of the scheme in its evolution?
                If Shanny didn’t trust Garoppolo why didn’t they have a contingency plan for 2020? Like everyone has said, they could have restructured his contract, make a trade or draft his successor. They didn’t do anything.
                Now they are left with a franchise altering decision at the most important position in sports. Makes no sense to me how they handled this situation.

              5. As I pointed out in an earlier post, the stats you aren’t including there are also very important for context.

                – 2nd lowest average depth of target (behind only old man Brees).
                – Highest YAC per completion.
                – One of the highest play action %s per pass attempt.
                – One of the highest INT %s per pass attempt.

                He played in a scheme that was designed around short passes to players in space and intermediate passes behind LBs pulled forward by play action to give easy throws, yet he still threw a lot of INTs. Let’s not pretend the stats you posted are demonstrative of a QB that played well while being asked to make a lot of difficult throws and carry the team. It wasn’t the case. But he did show he was competent at executing a scheme that focuses on getting the ball in the playmakers hands quickly, which is something the backups have not been able to do.

              6. Prime Time,

                The playoff game against Minnesota seems to be where most seemed to get the impression that Shanahan lost trust in Garoppolo. The belief was that after Garoppolo threw the pick that Shanahan immediately lost trust in him and started running the ball non stop. Problem is that isn’t what happened at all. Shanahan didn’t stop calling passes until Cousins threw a pick in his own zone and the Niners ran it in on the following possession. Against the Packers there was no need to do anything other than run the ball. They were getting huge yardage and built a big lead. Why would you throw when you are having huge success on the ground and shortening the game in the process? There wasn’t any restriction on Garoppolo throwing the ball in the SB either which blows up the argument completely.

                I don’t know how good Shanahan is at developing QB’s, but he has gotten very good results out of pretty much every QB he has had. Let’s look at it this way, Garoppolo was here for about a month before he got his first start and went on to win every game he started the rest of that season. He came back after missing most of his second season here and put up the numbers I listed above. Say what you will but Shanahan got a lot out of Garoppolo in that time. With Mullens I think it’s simply limitations on what he can do. He got some pretty good play out of Mullens a couple of years ago, but as he’s had to play more this season the limits on what he can do as an everyday starter have come into play.

                I don’t get the feeling Shanahan really wants to draft somebody and start from scratch. That’s why he didn’t draft anyone until late in the 3rd his first year here with the intention of signing Cousins as a free agent at the end of the season. As much as people are complaining and talking about the limits they believe Garoppolo places on Shanahan’s system, there is no indication that Shanahan feels that way. They were one of the best offenses in the league a year ago and had the opportunity to bring Brady in if they wanted to in the offseason. I could be wrong but I don’t think Shanny or Lynch are seriously considering dumping Garoppolo. It’s a story that has gained legs in fan and some media circles but both of these men have been pretty consistent in their support for JG.

              7. 49 reasons,

                You just never know what your going to get with Jimmy. Some games he looks like a franchise QB, some games he looks like a rookie. His mechanics are bad, which is why he struggles with accuracy on everything downfield.

                And tell me again how many games he has actually even played over the last 3 seasons?

                Another silly statement. He didn’t play many bad games last year. His worst one was probably the first Seattle game when he fumbled a couple of times and threw a pick and yet still had them in position to win the game in OT. He had 9 games with a QB rating well over 100. The simple truth is you have overreacted big time based on this season.

              8. As I pointed out in an earlier post, the stats you aren’t including there are also very important for context.

                – 2nd lowest average depth of target (behind only old man Brees).
                – Highest YAC per completion.
                – One of the highest play action %s per pass attempt.
                – One of the highest INT %s per pass attempt.

                He played in a scheme that was designed around short passes to players in space and intermediate passes behind LBs pulled forward by play action to give easy throws, yet he still threw a lot of INTs. Let’s not pretend the stats you posted are demonstrative of a QB that played well while being asked to make a lot of difficult throws and carry the team. It wasn’t the case. But he did show he was competent at executing a scheme that focuses on getting the ball in the playmakers hands quickly, which is something the backups have not been able to do.

                Um isn’t that the design of the offense? I’d have to go back and research it, but most offenses he’s coordinated have been pretty similar from what I recall. I also disagree with you on carrying the team. He did it against the Saints, Cardinals and final game against Seattle last season when it was needed. I agree he throws too many picks. That is something that needs to improve but it hasn’t kept him from winning most of the time.

              9. Shanahan’s offense in 2019 relied on the short passing game more than he has in the past.

                Yes, JG made some plays when he needed to in some key games last season. Didn’t in some others. He’s not a bad QB. But let’s face it, for the majority of the season last year the team won games based on the strength of the D and running game. That was what they relied on for the most part, not JG.

              10. Shanahan’s offense in 2019 relied on the short passing game more than he has in the past.

                Not so sure about that but if that was the case then the personnel also plays a role doesn’t it? They had 1 playmaker in the passing game (Kittle) until Sanders arrived so wouldn’t that lend itself to a short passing and run dominated scheme? Looking at the types of receivers Shanahan has drafted it sure seems like he’s looking for players that fit that type of offense and I doubt it’s all because of Garoppolo’s perceived limitations.

                Yes, JG made some plays when he needed to in some key games last season. Didn’t in some others. He’s not a bad QB. But let’s face it, for the majority of the season last year the team won games based on the strength of the D and running game. That was what they relied on for the most part, not JG.

                No argument but the fact he didn’t need to be the guy all the time doesn’t mean he was incapable of being the guy. The fact he stepped up to win multiple games when the defense wasn’t dominating underscores that point. It’s similar to the narrative started when the Niners dominated on the ground against the Vikings and Packers. It was all about how the HC didn’t trust Garoppolo instead of the fact they didn’t need him to throw the ball. The fact they threw the ball quite a bit in the SB didn’t seem to resonate with people. That is often the case when you jump on a made up story for dramatic purposes instead of what really happened.

              11. “Not so sure about that but if that was the case then the personnel also plays a role doesn’t it?”

                Sure does. Part of that personnel reason being JG.

                “The fact he stepped up to win multiple games when the defense wasn’t dominating underscores that point.”

                JG was able to make some crucial plays in a few key games last year, no question. However, even in those games, how many did they actually put the game “on his back/ arm”? Versus just the end of the game, when they needed it? Really there was probably only five such games – the two Cardinals games, the Seattle loss, the Saints game and the Atlanta game. They lost two of those because JG didn’t show up, the other three he was instrumental in winning. Then you also had a bunch of games where they won that masked his mistakes – on a lesser team they would have been L’s. He can do it, but he’s pretty hit and miss. Much like a lot of decent starting QBs.

                Tbh I think we are both pretty much on the same page about where he sits talent wise.

              12. I was actually thinking the same thing the more I read our back and forth. Not too far apart overall it appears.

          2. Those stats are mostly a product of scheme

            A scheme, and the QB running it, that was good for a SB appearance. Though not the exact same scheme as last year, but look to this year what happens when you have less capable, question mark QBs running it. Yes, yes injuries across the team of course, but even you said so the team’s record should be better than it is.

            I don’t want to see the likes of Sam f-ing Darnold or a vet that will cost as much as JG (looking at you Matt Ryan and Matthew Stafford) or a rook at the position next year. Resign as many FA as possible (its not like the Niners will be the only team bumping up against a lower cap), bring back the scheme and a healthy team, and see how it plays out. If it results in another losing season, then it’s time to dismantle that wall, brick by brick.

    1. It’s been that way since he got to S.F. But in 2017 he had a panache to him. Probably a lot of it was due to the substantial upgrade in the QB position once he got here and the fact that the fanbase’s expectations for a QB had been lowered over the years. But when the team was down and J.G. took the field, I was 95% confident the team would win. He received a contract based on the “magic” of those last 6 or so games in 2017.. But I would say that the fan base’s confidence in Jimmy has dwindled significantly. I still wonder if it is because KS’ scheme has “corralled” him. I still wonder if it might not be best for all involved (including Jimmy) if he moves on, probably best back to NE. He might do much better under McDaniel.

      OTOH: Based on some recent statements from KS, it sounds like he is accepting the fact that he needs to scheme around his QB’s strengths and weaknesses rather than just what he would personally like to do. Of course, he could do that with a rookie QB as well.

      1. Cubus, he’s never been the same guy post injury. 2017 was either a flash in the pan, or he has simply lost himself, his mechanics, his mobility, and his confidence, post ACL. Not the same guy he was at the end of 2017.

      2. I think Shanahan’s system would coral anyone. Including Matt Stafford. Just imagine what it would do to a rookie QB.

        It took Ryan 2 years to get. Jimmy and Nick Mullen’s three years in still don’t get it.
        It’s time to look at the HC and how he manages the position.

        1. Shanny’s system made Ryan the MVP of the league and made Garoppolo a top ten QB. It also made Matt Schaub a pro bowl caliber QB. There is nothing wrong with the system. The problem this year was too many injuries. Don’t overthink it.

              1. The most important one! Did you even watch the Super Bowl? How many interceptions did Joe Montana throw in every Super Bowl he won? How many? That was the most boneheaded interception by a $25 million dollar quarterback I’ve ever had the displeasure of witnessing!!

              2. The most important one! Did you even watch the Super Bowl? How many interceptions did Joe Montana throw in every Super Bowl he won? How many? That was the most boneheaded interception by a $25 million dollar quarterback I’ve ever had the displeasure of witnessing!!

                Yes I did watch the SB and they didn’t lose it because of Garoppolo’s pick in the first half. He’s not Joe Montana and no one has ever said he was but this team lost the SB because they couldn’t block the KC inside pass rush down the stretch and the defense couldn’t get off the field on 3rd and 15.

                During the regular season the Niners lost 3 games. The number of picks thrown by Garoppolo in those games? 1.

              3. Like I said, Jimmy is not a scrub, it’s just that they aren’t reaching their potential on offense with Jimmy at QB, not just because of the INT’s, but also a general lack of accuracy, as well as mobility. The accuracy issues can be attributed to his poor mechanics, and the lack of mobility to the knee injury and knee brace.

              4. Teams have been searching for decades to find that franchise QB who can take over a game. Right now, there is only one guy I believe who can do it. One out of 32. That tells you something.
                It also tells me you need a guy who can draft and develop. Build an offense around him and keep adding pieces each year to keep it fluid.
                I don’t think Shanahan wants to be that guy. He wants instant.

                Side note. If the Bengals take a QB this upcoming draft, would you trade for Joe Burrows?

              5. Razor you’re going Grant on us.

                Jimmy threw a pick yes, but you’re making it like it was the worst one in Super Bowl history.
                It wasn’t, he was trying to throw a pass and got earholed by the KC DT which effected the pass.
                Could he have had a better feel for the pocket, yes. Was it the worst int ever, No.

                Why is everyone taking such extreme stances? Jimmy is a good but flawed and limited QB. He can be great at times but is inconsistent and highly prone to injury.
                The reality is if it were a normal year, with a normal salary cap, I don’t know that we would even be discussing this. That said, his salary makes it nearly impossible to field a team with as much talent as we had last year and he doesn’t appear to be good enough to overcome those deficiencies.

              6. “The reality is if it were a normal year, with a normal salary cap, I don’t know that we would even be discussing this.”

                Exactly. We’d still be talking about drafting a QB as a potential future successor (I would be anyway), but prior to COVID the team was in a fine salary cap situation where keeping JG another year to prove himself and have a strong team around him wouldn’t be an issue.

              7. How many interceptions did Joe Montana throw in every Super Bowl he won?

                He tossed quite a few in that famous game that got them to their first SB. Yet the team still managed to win.

              8. Ribico,
                This is one of those cases where people tend to overreact and remember history with rose colored glasses.

                No one wants to remember that Joe Montana threw a perfect pass to a Bengals defender, hitting them right in the chest. If caught, that likely would would have not only ended a scoring drive for SF… but gone 90 yards the other way.

              9. That’s precisely why they don’t remember it, because it wasn’t caught!

                The INT Garoppolo made was one of his classics. Under pressure, he throws it up for grabs instead of just throwing it away. That’s why Shanny had to keep the reins tight throughout the playoffs, because of boneheaded throws that were incredibly ill advised….

              10. The reality is if it were a normal year, with a normal salary cap, I don’t know that we would even be discussing this. 

                Fans and pundits were talking about trying to replace Garoppolo well before it was known that the salary cap would take a hit.

              11. That’s precisely why they don’t remember it, because it wasn’t caught!

                I don’t understand the argument? Are you saying it wasn’t a bone headed play, int worthy throw by the qb because the defender dropped it when he hit him in the chest?

                Even the greats are not immune to bad plays, they happen.

                As to t

                “The INT Garoppolo made was one of his classics. Under pressure, he throws it up for grabs instead of just throwing it away.”

                he was trying to throw the ball away and got hit in the middle of his throw, causing the ball to flutter and die. Keep in mind in order to just throw the ball away while in the pocket, he has to get it near a receiver on the sideline otherwise it’s intentional grounding.

                The outcome was terrible, but it doesn’t always mean it was a terrible decision.

                I’m not a huge Jimmy fan and would be fine if SF moves on, but this, “he is terrible” narrative is being overblown and is nonsense. He is a big reason they had homefield advantage in the playoffs (he came up big against N.O., SEA, LA, AZ ) and that matters a lot. Has SF ever even made it to the superbowl without homefield advantage?

              12. I’m saying they don’t remember it because it was a one off out of 4 SB’s.

                With Jimmy, we’re talking about consistently throwing the football to the other team for every 2 TD’s he throws. He’s not terrible but he’s not $24 million dollars worth of good either.

                He was trying to fit the ball in between two defenders that had Samuel bracketed along the sidelines. Take the sack like Brady taught you to do, and live to play another down!

              13. Razor,
                Before it was throw it away now it’s take the sack like Tom Brady would, ( who by the way threw two picks that were far worse when facing pressure, a pick 6, rather than take the sack against ATL, and threw a red zone pick against Seattle rather than taking the sack and at least getting a field goal.) So I think we will just have to agree to disagree in regards to the Breeland pick.

                That play really doesn’t bother me that much… his not seeing Kittle late in the game bothers me far more. He had him, it would have been a huge play, and he didn’t see him.

                Like I said, I have no problem moving on from Jimmy and to be honest I think it might be the best thing for him as I am not certain Kyle is good for him. Kyle may not be good for any qb over the long term to be honest. That is a scary thought, and I hope it’s not true.

              14. Before we move on from anyone, we better address the center, RG, and RT position. It wont matter who is behind center if we cannot protect the guy back there.

  53. Player Age (2021) EPA/Play (Win Prob. 5-95%) Air Yards % Big Time Throws / Turnover Worthy Plays ANY/A
    Jimmy Garoppolo 30 .131 (11th/40) 43.5% (41st/41) 16/22 (.73:1)

    6.98 (12th/41)
    Nick Foles (2018-19) 31 .090 (22nd/42) 49.1% (36th/43) 11/13 (.85:1)

    5.99 (26th/43)

    1. Bingo. Good find Razor.

      Jimmy is good within 5 yards of the LOS, unless he has to scramble, because his scrambling days left him when he had his knee reconstructed.

    2. Just out of curiosity what were his 2020 numbers?
      Trying get a gage of what to expect from a healthy Jimmy post ACL (if that can be expected).

  54. Many in the peanut gallery are dithering about the top 3 or 4 college QBs, but one QB may be a better option, that fills many criteria while not costing too much.
    If he does not play in the Senior Bowl and light it up, Jamie Newman may slip to the second or third day of the draft. he is big, has a strong arm, and can run a 4.6 forty.
    I just watched a QB who ran left and threw right. He back pedaled and threw off his back foot. He threw side arm, so he had terrible form.
    Who was he? Patrick Mahomes. He may not have the best mechanics, but he throws with a flick of the wrist and completes passes. Posters who are critical of JG’s throwing mechanics are just focusing on unimportant factors, since JG is accurate and can thread the needle with his passes. He also can avoid sacks with his quick release, so JG is superior to any alternative, until proven otherwise.
    Mahomes is also blessed with good pass catchers. He can throw the ball to a covered receiver, because Hill and others can high point the ball, making contested catches. JG does not have that luxury, when players like Bourne are dropping passes almost every game.
    Mahomes is also way quicker than having 4.8 speed. He is mobile, and can elude the pass rusher. I am glad that KS is having an epiphany, seeing the importance in having a mobile QB, but he never should have moved on from Kaep.
    KS chose Hoyer, Mullens and CJB, so his QB assessment skills are lacking. Fortunately, JG has fallen into their lap, but now, defeatist thinking wants to get rid of JG, with no superior alternative available. A raw rookie? That just means they are in a 3 year rebuilding mode.
    I do not care where they draft. The higher, the better, because that meant they did well. It does not matter where they pick, as long as their assessment skills are good enough. However, if they keep on whiffing on players like Thomas, Foster, CJB, Joe Williams and Pettis, there really is no hope for glory.

    1. I do like the Jamie Newman mention. He could be a sleeper. He could be a late 2nd to mid 3rd rd pick. He still needs a lot of work, but could be a nice piece on a team willing to invest the time.

      1. Exactly. Let him sit and study behind JG for a couple seasons, and see how he develops.
        If the Niners do get a third round pick for Saleh, Newman may be available. Then, they can draft an OT and Center, to help fix the O line, with their first and second picks.

  55. Is this the best QB class in decades? I think it is very hard to make a quantitative judgement in this pandemic time period. The schedules were torn up, practices were disrupted, the players were infected and the competition was very lopsided, at times.
    However, has there ever been a bigger need for competent QBs? Given the poor play of many backup QBs, Mullens included, some college QBs could be considered huge upgrades. The Jets, Jags, Bengals (with Burrow’s injury), Cowboys (with Dak’s injury), Panthers, Giants, Washington, Eagles, Patriots, Bears and Broncos, may all consider upgrading their QB position. Atlanta, TB, Colts, Saints and Steelers may also be looking for a future QB soon. Half the league may need to draft a QB.

  56. Hey NotAnExpert:

    Shanny on Jimmy’s boneheaded decision to not go out of bounds:

    “Those guys are competitive guys who want to do whatever they can to win the game,” Shanahan said. “You’re not assuming by staying in bounds you’re going to tear your knee up. … But I think that’s something where Jimmy will probably look at differently going forward because I know he’ll remember this for the rest of his life.

    “Nothing against him. This happens witth everyone. You see it every Sunday. I just think it’s a reminder for everyone why that is the obvious coaching point and why you need to stick with it.”

    Of course he used more tact than I did, but you get the point; plus you’re less of being notanexpert! It’s a twoferr.

      1. Poor old stubborn Jimmy had to learn the hard way. You’ll never see him make that boneheaded mistake again. That I can guarantee you!

  57. Warner, Juice, and T. Williams named to the Pro Bowl. And a special shout-out to a kid I wanted the 49ers to draft for making the Pro Bowl in his rookie year. Congratulations WR Justin Jefferson.

    1. Jefferson is good, but it helps to have a healthy QB throwing him the ball throughout the season.

      Aiyuk likely would have had much better stats than he has now if the 49ers would have had a good run game and better pass pro.
      But Jefferson is the real deal.

      There were two WRs that I liked last year, Ruggs and Claypool, but I’m more then happy with BA.

  58. Well, I will admit I am wrong. The Bengals will probably not draft a QB. That is because Ryan Finlay defeated the Steelers, decisively. He may not have done much before, but he shined brightly on center stage. The Bengals also have O line needs, so that is where they should go. Maybe even trade back with a QB needy team to get a boatload of picks.