How do Super Bowl teams’ defenses stack up?

New England Patriots middle linebacker Kyle Van Noy (53) sacks Kansas City Chiefs quarterback Patrick Mahomes (15) during the first half of the AFC Championship NFL football game, Sunday, Jan. 20, 2019, in Kansas City, Mo. (AP Photo/Jeff Roberson)

They say defense wins championships.

That axiom may not apply to the NFL anymore. Both Super Bowl participants had sub-par defenses during the regular season. The LA Rams ranked 19th in total yards allowed. The New England Patriots ranked 21st.

But both teams made the Super Bowl largely because they played excellent defense during the conference championship round two weeks ago. The Patriots held the Kansas City Chiefs’ No. 1-ranked offense to just 290 net yards, and the Rams held the New Orleans Saints’ No. 8-ranked offense to the exact same amount.

The winner of the Super Bowl could be the team that plays better defense Sunday.

To learn more about each defense and what each might plan to do in the Super Bowl, here are insights from someone who has coached defense in the NFL. He requested anonymity.

Click here to read the rest of the article.

This article has 450 Comments

  1. Is this the same anonymous source you used last time?

    Belichick’s got the player flexibility on defense to play 3-4 with outside containment to stop the run, and force Goff to stand in the pocket and go through his progressions. He’ll double team Cooks and put Gilmore on Woods. No full moon required, good Goff becomes bad Goff….

    Phillip’s is going to double team Edelman and take away Brady’s security blanket in the middle of the field. Problem is, Brady can find and exploit his linebackers when they blow their assignment. I agree with this mystery coach. Nothing complicated about this game whatsoever….

    1. If that mystery coach is a fortune teller, I guess I may have a career in that field too. McVay? Return to night school.

    1. Nope. Patriots by 10. Should’ve been more. Did you see Tom’s response when BB told him they were kicking the field goal instead of going for it on 4th and an inch? Priceless….

  2. Patriots 41-Rams -24
    14 of Rams points come late.
    I don’t think it’s close.
    I think Goff will fold under the pressure of SB and a Bill B defense that will force him to go through progressions and stuff the run.
    Brady will shred the man coverage.
    LA is soft.

  3. Nice breakdown.

    Advantage Patriots: Someone once said “good defenses make you beat them left handed.” The defensive coach nailed this one. Goff will need to be near flawless. A tall order.

    Advantage Rams: Brady becomes a mere mortal if he’s consistently pressured with just the 4 down linemen. The Pats Superbowl loss to the Giants and playoff loss to the Broncos (Wade Phillips D coordinator) were vs teams that generated pressure without blitzing.

    I’m thinking Patriots will win. I’m hoping for a Rams victory.

      1. I think McVay will realize that BB’s defense will make his offense play left handed, and turn that weakness into a strength. The Rams O line is better than many think. They totally crushed the Cowboy defense, which was pretty stout.

          1. Yes, McVay out schemed the Cowboys. I think he can match up with Belichick, too. Maybe not out-scheme him, but refrain from being shaped and avoid making errors.

  4. Rams will not get blown out, Phillips has played BB, and has beaten him. Donald and Suh will get pressure up the middle, and the corners will take away the quick throws by playing tight man to man. I am hoping for a Rams pick six to demoralize Brady, and make him tentative.
    .
    McVay will not let BB shape him. Goff will have time to throw. Gurley will play the game of his life, after CJ Anderson softens them up. Grant mentioned that Woods can beat one on one matchups, and I think Josh Reynolds may have a good day. McVay will use misdirection and deception, and let the Pats defense over run the play.
    .
    McVay needs to have his team play flawlessly, and force the Pats to make unforced errors.
    .
    Rams, 24-23.

  5. Had a dream…..Brady gets hurt and Hoyer comes in to play……….I woke up and couldn’t dream the rest of the game…..

    1. Had the same premonition. Hoyer plays lights-out and overcomes a sizable Rams lead to defeat LA by 17 points. Hoyer is named MVP. Sebbie is jumping for joy inside because he called Hoyer’s greatness during a preseason game not too long ago…

      1. No, if Hoyer does get in, he will throw like the DBs are the intended receivers.
        .
        I will not hope for a player to get injured, but if it does, the Pats will be in a world of hurt.

  6. Origin of the phrase “good defenses make you beat them left handed”….? Well, it’s a rather common football cliche.

    Googled the phrase and found a good partial match in a publication by the American Football Coaches Association (2000). Authors of the segment where the quote appears are Bo Schembechler and Gary Moeller.

    Also shows up in a 2017 tweet…
    https://twitter.com/ArmandoSalguero/status/939177876385083392

    And a 2018 Minneapolis video article…
    http://video.startribune.com/zimmer-on-patriots-they-are-the-best-play-action-team-in-the-nfl/501467512/

    And a 2015 Colts vs ATL article…
    https://www.ajc.com/sports/football/colts-coach-chuck-pagano-facing-the-falcons/X610qBtPe5DCDJn4rPGUJN/

    And more….

  7. I hope the game is competitive and the refs do a big league job (as opposed to the recent past). Two things stand out to me in the article. First, as I have said from time to time, managing the cap is essential to success and the 49ers are at the bottom of the league in that category. The coach talks of how the Pats take “inferior” talent and then scheme and coach up players for a successful program. (Trent Brown comes to mind). Second, the 49ers and especially Saleh seem to be the antithesis of the Pats when it comes to cap management. They have an inflexible scheme and want us to wait until they can come up with the talent needed. In college, you can throw darts at a long list and find coaches that can win when they have superior talent. I don’t think that works in the NFL anymore because of the cap. In today’s game you absolutely cannot waste money on non-productive players (we’re among the best there), you have to use your capital very wisely, and then adjust your scheme to what talent you can have at any given time. As Shoup said on another thread, Juice and McKinnon are really bad uses of cap money as far as impact (even if McKinnon is healthy, what is he really going to add besides more yards between the 20 yard lines). Then there’s the draft with CJ, Williams, Thomas, Pettis and ? who may or may not (except Williams) be future impact players. Having a first class inflexible scheme and matching it with the best talent is OK for Nick Saban and his college cohorts. Doesn’t work in the NFL anymore because of the cap. You get the very best players you can with what you have, and then the coaches have to tinker with the scheme and coach up what they have or we’ll end up like the Cardinals – rebuilding since 1947. KS won at Atlanta because of pure luck. His scheme with the talent there equaled success. That’s called beginners luck and only a fool doesn’t understand that. Like the sign on the locker room wall: Don’t be a dinosaur, adapt or become extinct.

  8. Alas, the 9ers are a hot, festering mess. Oh the flies….

    The trail of decay threads though the ranks of pretend coaches and deceitful execs, and leads to ownership–that would be Denise and her hubby John. Ultimately, ownership is responsible, no?

    Wonder how Denise feels about her franchise. Grant, please interview Denise and find out.

  9. Pats in a blowout by halftime. It’s a shame the refs botched the no-call in the NFCCG because I think the Saints would’ve had a better chance against them.

  10. Why do the Pats compete for the SB so much?
    .
    They benefit from being in a weak division. The Niners benefited from having to play the Saints back then, and the Falcons and Rams were struggling, too, but it also cyclical. Now, the Rams are on top, and the Falcons competed in a SB not too long ago.
    .
    Why do the Pats have such an easy time? I believe that they send out a legion of provocateurs, who stir up trouble on the blogs, just like Cassie does here. They create controversy, and dissension, trying to make the team implode from within. It is no wonder why the Bills, Jets and Dolphins have such a hard time finding a QB when posters rip and denigrate their starters. Thankfully, the Niners have found their franchise QB, and I hope he leads the Niners to another ring.
    .
    By weakening their opponents in their division, the Pats have an easy time, counting on 6 easy wins and only having to win 2 games to get to the SB. Sure, BB and TB are a huge factor, But BB seems to do it with smoke and mirrors, the talent is not way superior. When players move from the Pats, they tend to become pedestrian. Then, with players like Trent Brown and Van Noy, they become warriors, so the assessments are correct, and the coaching brings out the best in them.
    .
    Spygate is another reason why they have done so well. I am certain that the Pats still try to steal signals, and I am sure they have a cadre of lip readers, trying to read exactly what is said along the side line. I hope McVay calls a play, then runs something entirely differently, to see how much BB is trying to steal signals.
    .
    Yes, it sure helps having Brady as the QB, and it sure helps having BB, who is smart enough to put him in positions to succeed, but all the cheating has tainted their legacy. Attacking division opponents with spies and provocateurs is just standard practice for any adherent of the Art of War, and BB is a master at implementing those strategies.
    .
    Now we have Kraft praising Trump, so I am sure the word is out for the Pats to get favored treatment. He cheated to win a presidency, why stop at cheating to win a SB? The other owners are cowed by his behavior, but I hope the Rams will put him in his place. Too bad the Rams will have to defeat the Pats, and the officials. So far, the putrid officiating has shown how easy it is to have refs affect the outcome of a game. I am sure the Saints will agree with me.Saints got screwed because they posed a bigger threat to the Pats.

  11. The level of certitude on this blog and elsewhere about a Pats win reminds of the last one when the Pats victory was a certainty — until it was not.

    I wish there was a way to have a great game in which both these teams lose. But that can’t happen so I’d probably like to see the Pats win because I think that their system of roster maintenance and their philosophy of franchise management is the best in the league.

    However, I think that the Rams will surprise everyone. They are loose and confident — like the personality of their coach. The three aspects of the game where a team will win or lose, IMO, are (1) minor in-game tweaks to their gameplans, (2) players “doing their job” and not missing assignments and making mistakes, and (3) elite players making plays. I think it will be a tie on the first aspect, a win for Bellichick’s team on the second, but the game will be decided by (3) where Rams make a couple of plays, including one by Greg the Leg. Rams 38-35.

    1. I agree. The Rams ara e very good team in a tough NFC. The Pats are a very well coached team in a very weak AFC. I think the Rams have a good chance of winning today. 38-35 is a good prediction.

  12. Hey Grant….

    Please allow for dynamic updating or just eliminate the Popular Tags panel on this blog. The talented members of the crack PD IT Division should handle that easily.

  13. The Super Bowl!! Finally! Though I did pick NE to be a participant, my other choice, SF, well, it didn’t quite work out! However, Coach/GM GC picked NO vs JAC so at least I beat him, again! LoL

    Well, this is the final bet(s) of the season so that is kind of sad, but let’s get to it. Successful so far with an 8-2 vs the spread through the playoffs. 5-5 vs the O/U. 13-7 overall. Will finish well in the black no matter what the outcome. Playing with house money today!! I’m loving it!!
    There is so much to analyze in this game, but one word will define the outcome. Brady. He will lead his team to a winning field goal with no time remaining, again, solidifying his standing as the GOAT. It will be a great game. I’d love to see the Patriot’s just smoke ’em. “F” the Rams!! My heart says NE 38 LAR 17. My brain (the one with the money) says:
    I’m taking NE -2 1/2 and the over (56 1/2)

    NE 30 LAR 27

    Enjoy the game and good luck with your bets!!

    1. We’ll see if the Pats O-line and Trent Brown gets the big contract today.

      I have the Rams winning because of their front D-line. This game might be over by halftime if Brady receives heavy pressure.
      Question, does Brady lose some of his shine if he loses today?

      1. The interior of that offensive line is talented and intelligent, specifically at center. Another testament to Coach Scarnecchia.

    1. Cassie ‘Freakin’ Baalke

      Whoa there, Cassie….Did I miss something ..? When you say ‘lost’ HWwaits and Brotha Tuna…just how did you mean it ? I do hope that you meant by choice rather than…you know…please respond…

  14. Too bad Tom Martinez isn’t alive to see his student, Tom Brady, compete in yet another SB. Tom wasn’t only Brady’s off season QB mentor, but he was also a good friend of my family and a coach and mentor to my wife, and was instrumental in helping her get a full ride athletic scholarship to UC Berkeley. He was present at our wedding 37 years ago and actually got stung by a bee outside the church waiting to throw rice at us (it was still ok back then!) after we walked down the aisle and exited the church. Not good as he was allergic to bee stings. He survived that ordeal! One of the great local coaches of all time and a genuine great person. He is missed dearly.

  15. Interesting numbers: in play-offs, Brady is 13-1 when not pressured from the middle. He’s 4-7 when there is substantial interior pressure.
    I thought I heard another one: Pats have scored 3 points in the first quarter of all their Superb Owl games. Wonder if that’s the average or total!

      1. Raz

        I agree… that was one of the BEST defensive SBs I can remember…two and three set motions on every play ! I played LB and Safety, so you know I loved it…Who were those teams ?…

  16. I appreciate defense, but still not a real exciting game. A lot of poor execution by the offenses, rather than great defensive plays.

    1. I expect the Rams defense to wear down in the 2nd half due to the amount of time they’ve been on the field. That’s when you’ll begin to see those 3 yard runs turn into 5 yarders….

  17. some SB observations…
    — is it me or does BB’s scowl face going into locker room @ Half look more pronounced than usual???
    — looks like the team that loses will be the one who’s D is gassed 1st…at this point the Rams D is in danger of gassing out by the 3rd Q if Goff keeps doing the “3-and-out” act…
    — the League F.O. must be ecstatic about a defensive trench war in the 1st half of the “high powered offensive juggernaut matchup of the decade” (NFL trademark) that SB53 was to be…
    — dominant D- line and DB play are on tap today…
    — offensive fireworks showcase: not so much…

  18. Geepers…3-3 late in the 3rd quarter. Is the NFL–or those who ‘really’ run things–arranging a fix?

    1. Yup.
      I was disappointed in the Rams D-line, but their ineffectiveness was caused by the no-name but great Pats O-line.
      And big kudos to Trent Brown who more then held his own.

      1. I don’t recall anyone on this blog saying he isn’t good. There does seem to be those who exaggerate just how good….

        1. I have seen lots of post of how average to below average he is and isn’t really that great a tackle which is why he was picked where he was and traded.

          He is a very good tackle. Period. Glad you are finally acknowledging that the team with poor player talent let go of a very good player.

    1. LOL. There were 2 penalties on the offense and they were in scoring position anyway thanks to that big run off left tackle a few plays earlier.

      1. Brown’s one of the 300 or so other players who came along for the ride on Brady-Bellichick Super Bowl gravy train.
        Good luck to Brown in parlaying that ring for a large contract with some some desperate franchise….

        1. Yeup he should thank Shanahan and Lynch because they could’ve traded him to the Jaguars or Raiders lol.

          Also thank Tom Brady for getting him paid

            1. No I’m saying they traded him to the patriots that just went to there 9th Super Bowl and won number 6 so if they traded him to the cardinals they would be in the Super Bowl??? GTFOH!!!

              1. So he should thank TB and BB. Shanahan had no way of knowing that they would be in the Post Season and would never have traded him in his Division so maybe someone else needs to Get the Flip out of Here!

              2. I was using the cardinals as an example of being traded to a bad team like the Raiders, Bengals, Jets etc. He wouldn’t even be in the playoffs

      2. Agreed.
        But it’s time to move on from a player who longer plays for the 49ers.
        I’m happy for him as I am for Hoyer. I won’t use their success as a hit job on Lynch and Shanahan though, but to each their own.

      3. Grant,
        Ok, I get it. Your propping up Trent for the purpose of slinging it in the face of Lynch and Shanahan.
        Funny how you forget that Brady has been winning Super Bowls since Trent Brown was likely still in high school.
        But go ahead and do your thing along with your bestie Hammer.

        1. I still don’t understand why they traded him for Day-3 value when Staley is declining and probably entering his final season with the 49ers in 2019.

          1. Let it go Grant. If we let Joe Montana, Ronnie and Jerry go, one thing about football is set in concrete: No one’s job is guaranteed.
            Joe Staley is an anomaly.

              1. You’d think his skills would have compelled at least one other team to engage in a bidding war for his services. Similar to McKinnon….

  19. Most of NE’s big runs were to the right, away from Brown.
    Field goal please. My wife has 3 and 3. Had already won 500. Can win 1000 if he hits!

      1. No – the Truth is that offenses win now in the NFL and defense is old hat. While you’re disagreeing with Grant try to remember that he is on the record as saying that the NFL owners’ fixation with young coaches who are offensive “geniuses” is just the latest fad and they will end up going back to the old timers who have seen it all.

        1. Not with the rules today even tho it was a low scoring Super Bowl today doesn’t mean offenses are going to get shut down cuz the rules won’t allow it and there thinking about challenging PI next season which will be even harder for defenses. My point about Grant is Trent Brown is not the reason the patriots won the Super Bowl he contributed no doubt but the patriots are a winning organization like it or not as long as Tom Brady and Billicheck are there it doesn’t matter who’s at LT

    1. We’ve heard all the noise about the youth movement that is re-inventing NFL offenses and is now “trending” on the net and NFL ownerships but it might be worth reflecting on the fact that this Super Bowl was dominated by a 71 year old defensive coordinator who opposed a 66 year old defensive oriented head coach. I’m not disagreeing with you but just saying.

      1. Oh I’m not on the youth movement but I am impressed with the young LA coach and what he has done. I think he’s an outlier.

        I think that BB continues to prove that sound fundamentals and excellent coaching (and a world class QB with a decent cast of characters and a decent defense) can do some pretty amazing things.

    2. SY,
      Nah, if anything, he may have hurt his status with the loss on Sunday.

      There may be only a handful of coaches that have walked into a great situation like McVay did.
      The Rams were a “turn key” playoff team before McVay took the helm. An assistant coach could have taken the team to the playoffs because they are talent stocked from top to bottom.

      McVay got blinded by all the “young genius” talk over the season and couldn’t focus enough during the game to make any adjustments.
      Let’s face it, McVay’ exponential rise to the top hit a major speed bump on the world’s biggest stage.
      Only managing 3 points in the SB can tarnish any genius title.

          1. Yep. Your O has been plowing through opponents all year and wondering when is your D with 4 first rounder DL will show up and when they finally did your O stunk up the joint!

        1. Well we don’t have that Rams defense and Wade Phillips so the Patriots would’ve hung at least 35 on us so no we wouldn’t have one I agree with u

    1. I doubt it but I think Shanahan would’ve called a better game and would’ve scored more points with the Rams offense that is. He did hang 28 points on a Belichick defense not to long ago

  20. I’ll be looking forward to coach on KRON!! Lol! That’s the Z team of sports analysts!! Too funny. I could listen to those guys all day long! What??

  21. Trent brownade out on that trade..He’s gonna get paid,he’s a Superbowl champion and plays for a first class organization..He made out getting traded out of this dumpster fire

      1. If it’s a contract the patriots like yes but if he’s looking for big contract he’s gone patriots almost never overpay for players

            1. I agree. They should sign a DE and OLB. The Niners should even draft multiple pass rushers if they trade back to get more picks.

  22. That was as big a schooling in coaching I’ve ever seen. What a masterclass from Bill. McVay was totally clueless all game long. Anything that did work was quickly snuffed out. Lot’s of people saying how bad the game was, but personally I liked it. I’m a sucker for defence, and it was a nice change from the regular season all playoffs.

      1. Since you are a fierce advocate for establishing the running game, I have to say that from an offensive perspective McVay was not up to the task. He did not seem to trust either Gurley or Anderson and failed to incorporate the run enough into his offense, and that was a huge mistake. Both have the ability and maybe Gurley was still hampered by injuries but McVay was indecisive on who to use and that was fatal IMO. He used the run tentatively and it played right into BB’s strategy to take away the run and play action passing and make Goff beat them from the pocket. I thought Wade Phillips and the Rams played well defensively, but I think that McVay played right into BB’s hands and did not manage the offense as well as he could have. The Rams are a running team. If Gurley is hurt then Anderson is completely capable but make a decision man. The reason that BB and the Patriots win and win and win is that he knows he can make other teams forget how they win games and he takes advantage of it. Seattle, Atlanta and now the Rams.

        1. McVay got out coached, no question! One thing to remember is that BB made several coaches look foolish in the lead up to this game.

          Despite everything, the Rams had a chance to win, and one always felt like if they could just put a good series together, the entire tone of the game would change.

      1. I say McVay made a rookie mistake and couldn’t decide whether to use Gurley or Anderson so he abandoned the run game and played right into BB’s hands. Goff is a good young QB but nowhere near able to carry a team with his arm. Personally, I think Gurley was still injured enough that Anderson should have been handed the reins. If the Rams run like they can (even with Anderson) it’s a completely different game. Pats D didn’t outplay the Rams – BB out coached McVay. Now if Anderson was also injured….well…they should have brought in Kaepernick (just kidding)

        1. I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. Their whole offense ran through Gurley. He says he’s not hurt. Who knows what’s wrong with him….

        1. Niners didn’t play at Candlestick until several years after the merger and after it was converted into a combination football/baseball stadium. The Raiders had already moved to the Coliseum several years before the 49ers moved there.

      1. Don’t forget Frank Youell Field. That held about the same number of fans as Seals Stadium. (I remember one game at Kezar where the paid attendance was not enough to cover the rent)

      2. Yeah and in 2020 they’ll be completely out of the state of California and 49ers will still be in California so who cares

      3. Don’t forget the old Frank Youell field that is now Laney College.
        Raiders played there from 1962-65. Hate to say this, but they have come a long way since those early years playing at a park with only 22.000 capacity.

    1. Firstly, I’d like to remind everyone that I tried to expose Goff as the quintessential “system” QB on this blog a couple days ago, as I pointed to his utter inability to read NFL defenses on his own, without McVay in his earphone. I was validated tonight.

      Secondly, the Raiders get to play at Oracle Park next season, only if the 49ers give them permission, which they haven’t yet. Having to grovel on your knees to a cross-town rival just to be allowed to play 1 season in a stadium built for baseball, is nothing to brag about. The Raiders are now literally the definition of a 2nd class organization, at least for the 2019 season.

      Goodnight!

      1. Sad to say but playing at the Coliseum during baseball season is as low as a team can go. Not much better after baseball season either.

  23. I must admit I was wrong. I thought McVay was clever enough to beat BB.
    .
    However, I thought it would be close and it would be a low scoring game. To hold BB to 3 points until 7 minutes in the 4th quarter, was impressive.
    .
    If they had called that PI the play before Goff threw his pick, that may have changed the outcome of the game. Gilmore definitely had a hold of Cook’s arm.
    .
    This game proved the adage, -defense wins championships.

    1. “This game proved the adage, -defense wins championships.”
      And if you can run and stop the run. I know a lot of people thinks Harbaugh’s offense is boring or outdated but there is a reason he was successful in the play-offs during his time with the Niners.

      1. I liked JH’s scheme. What I did not like was his game management. He wasted time outs like a drunken sailor, and had way too many delay of game penalties. He never should have let Kaep call an audible with less than 5 seconds on the play clock.
        .
        I liked how JH took an under performing squad, and led them to 3 straight NFCC Games. They should have gotten rid of Baalke, and kept JH.

  24. Shanahan scored 28 on the Patriots. McVay scored 3. That statement is very Cohnesque. Rams were holding the Patriot receivers all game long, very Seattlesque, and only got called once.

    1. Correct Juan. Shanahan had BB on his heels through 3 QTRS. It took an epic, Matt Ryan – deer in headlights, 4th QTR meltdown, for the Patriots to edge Shanahan’s offense. McVay on the other hand, was outcoached from the moment the coin toss landed on the field. Perhaps the worst a HC has ever been outcoached in a Super Bowl. Night & Day!

        1. Both forgot about clock management while running their offense. If not for Wade Phillips and the Ram’s D the game would have been a major blowout. You give the ball back to Brady while only running 2 minutes off the clock and he usually makes you pay. Just ask Shanahan.

              1. Wade Phillips defense gave up no pass TD just 13 against Tom Brady he did his job McVay clearly lost the Super Bowl

        2. As if McVay’s Rams are somehow lacking in offensive fire power.

          McVay just coached the worst offensive Super Bowl performance in a generation, despite a healthy offense loaded to the gills with talent, and facing a defense missing it’s most important player (Patrick Chung, the “QB” of the Pats’ defense) for most of the game.

          1. No matter how great McVay the young genius was during the season, he will always be known as the head coach who only managed 3 points on the games biggest stage.
            That is a sad legacy.
            And the fact that a few here continue to compare McVay’ loss to Shanahan, who was not the head coach in Atlanta, only magnifies their obvious dislike of Shanahan.

            Throw out all the numbers you want. The only number that stands out today is 3.

            1. AES, brilliant! Grant/Hammer, do you guys remember how many points Shanny’s offense put up against the Patriots defensive genius?

        3. You’ve got to be kidding me! McVay had the #1 pick quarterback, #10 pick running back, #20 pick Cooks, and could only manage 3 Eucking points? He wore out his all world defense before halftime! The Rams were considered a dream team with a Super Bowl win or bust expectation! McVay choked!!

            1. Please explain how exactly. The elephant in the room is Shanny consistently produced as a coordinator for nearly a decade; McVay not so much….

              1. « Shanny consistently produced as a coordinator for nearly a decade »

                What did he consistently produce?

                His teams had winning records only 3 times. Same story with scoring, etc. His winning percentage as OC/HC in the NFL is consistent with being a loser.

                Yeah McVay inherited a strong roster in LA. Shanahan inherited a strong roster in Atlanta.

                Their records in those 2 seasons,

                Shanahan: 21-14
                McVay: 26-10

              2. Since Kyle was the OC and not the HC at Atlanta, this win-loss record is probably not the best comparison.
                A better comparison is the offensive efficiency ratings of the two teams in their second year of the respective offenses: Falcons in 2016 and Rams in 2018.
                Falcons, 2016: Offensive DVOA = 24.6%. Weighted Offense = 23.3% .
                Rams 2018: Offensive DVOA = 24.6%. Weighted Offense = 19.2% .
                https://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/teamoff

                The numbers show that both were excellent offenses and comparable in effectiveness. I don’t think there is a need to nitpick numbers selectively to make the point that one’s offense is “better” than the other’s.

              3. Hammer with another easy look at teams’ wins and losses records to substantiate his angst against Shanny. Nobody is defending Shanny’s results the last 2 years, but as Officer Hammer is well aware, results in the NFL are often over hyped and hardly ever give you a true representation sample size of any Eucking thing. Shanny took over a bag full of human fecal matter from the San Francisco streets of Baalke’s draft picks and ACL club. Meanwhile, McVay took over a #1 pick quarterback, an elite running back and what some refer to as the best defensive player ever in the NFL. This narrative of yours and Grant’s has become stale and predictable, like the stats you so desperately cling….

              4. DVOA and Weighted Offense is another good measure and once again McVay is above Shanahan when comparing the 2015/2016 Falcons to the 2017/2018 Rams.

                Falcons 2015- (-7.3%), (-15.4%)
                Rams 2017 – 11.1%, 12.7%

                Falcons 2016- 24.6%, 23.3%
                Rams 2018- 24.6%. 19.2%

                While 2016/2018 is close, McVay blows him out in 2015/2017.

              5. Razor,

                Take out Shanahan’s time in SF and he’s still a loser, 69-78. The talent issue is why I compared Shanahan and McVay based on the seasons that I did. The talent excuse doesn’t hold up over those time periods.

                Teams he is associated with don’t win often or score often.

                This isn’t a narrative. It’s just a fact.

                « McVay took over a #1 pick quarterback »

                Yes. A #1 pick quarterback that you called a bust after his rookie season.

              6. Oh it’s a narrative alright, but you go ahead and keep writing. Everybody wants a loser. Must be why Shanny was the #1 candidate every team wanted to hire as their HC in 2016. Or maybe it was because he consistently demonstrated the uncanny ability to scheme players open with those that are seldomly above average….

              7. Shanahan wasn’t the No. 1 HC candidate in 2017. The Broncos and Rams didn’t want him. How many teams even interviewed him?

              8. Grant, first of all the Rams had to cancel an earlier interview with Shanny due to weather.

                The Broncos picked the wrong head coach.

                You aren’t seriously having a selective memory disorder are you? Shanny was clearly the hottest candidate following the Falcons winning season.

              9. That’s fiction. McVay was the hot candidate. Shanahan only got two interviews, I believe. John Elway, who knows Shanny better than anybody, didn’t want him.

              10. « Shanny was clearly the hottest candidate following the Falcons winning season. »

                That’s right, season, singular.

              11. Not in my library it’s not, and Elway sure didn’t know Shanny like he thought he did. Maybe he hired from Shanny’s staff to get to know him better. I guess he knew Joseph better than anyone though. And Paxton, and Osweiler and…oh nevermind.

            2. I heard that the offensive assistant interview for McVay’s barista was canceled. The barista pleaded that his customer was still “a better coach than Kyle Shanahan.”

              Jeff Fisher’s Rams would have probably been able to kick a couple of field goals in this game….

          1. Yup Razor, McVay sucked, his offense is the SB’s worst ever, WORST EVER lololol. Doesn’t the man know how to make adjustments, what happen to the highest paid RB in football history? Goff looked lost, McVay’s offensive line looked like a bunch of do nothings. All that talent gone to waste. Rams couldn’t buy a SB what’s next for them? How many punts did the Rams have, saw more of the punting unit then the offensive unit.

            1. And yet this inept coach beat us 3 of the 4 times we have met head to head. No question BB is the best.

              Only sorry losers continue to claim they are better than the team that just got humiliated in the SB, especially after not qualifying for any part of the events in post season.

              1. No doubt about that East, the only win the Niners had against the Rams was against 2nd and 3rd stringers. Still the fact remains McVay stunk up the SB, and looked very much like a Niner team of the last couple of years. BB is the genius in this group, Shanny and McVay are mere footnotes. Normally I agree with much of what you and Jack say but lately its gone to far to one side much like the Shanny can do no wrong side. Too extreme on both sides much like our political climate.

              2. Too bad we can’t switch the rosters then we would really know don’t confuse Robert Saleh to Wade Phillips

        4. And how is Matt Ryan and Julio Jones been since Shanahan left? I heard somewhere that Julio went without a TD in a long stretch of games

          1. Ryan in 2016: 69.9 completion percentage, 38 TDs, 7 INTs.
            Ryan in 2018: 69.4 completion percentage, 35 TDs, 7 INTs.

            Jones in 2016: 1,409 receiving yards, 6 TDs.
            Jones in 2018: 1,677 receiving yards, 8 TDs.

  25. Sebbie,

    I think McVay will realize that BB’s defense will make his offense play left handed, and turn that weakness into a strength.

    Goff will have time to throw. Gurley will play the game of his life, after CJ Anderson softens them up. Grant mentioned that Woods can beat one on one matchups, and I think Josh Reynolds may have a good day. McVay will use misdirection and deception, and let the Pats defense over run the play.

    These predictions were way off. Some of them are so far off what happened, they are falling outside of our own stratosphere. Will you, as a legend with your elevated status, acknowledge that you were completely wrong on your analysis on this, as you look out across your 2.5 acres of land at the local wildlife blooming in your garden?

    1. Renas, I will fully admit I was way off. I was speaking more from my heart, than from my brain.
      .
      BB shaped McVay. I would have spread them out and attacked the edges, but McVay ran bunched sets.I would have designed more roll out plays, but Goff tried to deliver from the pocket, which collapsed in his face. I would have put Cooks in motion, so he would have been at full speed at the snap of the ball, and maybe avoid the jam at the line of scrimmage. I certainly would not have run into the teeth of the defense.

  26. Some may think that this SB was a super bore, but I liked it. Score tied 3-3 with 7 minutes left, so the Rams had a chance to win.
    .
    BB did out coach McVay, but he certainly did not out coach Phillips. Phillips held BB and TB to a field goal until the last part of the 4th quarter.
    .
    I thought the commercials were a success, although there were some clunkers like the stalker ad, the Audi Heimlich ad, the Robot ads and the Andy Warhol ad. My kids had to google Andy Warhol after I told them who it was, in order to get context, They thought it was boring, anyways.
    .
    My biggest disappointment was the half time show, so I did not watch it, and concentrated on cooking the pizzas and replenishing the snacks while they performed. One friend thought AL sounded out of breath, and everyone agreed that mixing pop and rap was incongruous.

    1. Sebbie as Renaissance Man–always teaching, always guiding; yet just critical enough to let one know they aren’t quite up to his standards. And 2.5 acres to boot.

    2. My biggest disappointment was the half time show, so I did not watch it,

      I used halftime to play my favorite concert sequences from our “Bohemian Rhapsody” DVD.

      But we all learned that Budweiser is wind brewed now?

      1. I learned that light beer is so watered down, they use corn syrup. Glad the Bud Light Knight GOT his comeuppance, then GOT toasted.

        1. I don’t care how greenwashed Budweiser is trying to come off as. It was a sad day hearing Dylan’s masterpiece in a friggin beer commercial . I hope he got paid a boatload.

    1. Grant – I have to ask, did your anonymous coach break into the Pats’ locker room and steal BB’s defensive game plan? Obviously, if he didn’t, he really knows his stuff. Fair to say it was exactly what the Pats’ did to stop the Rams offensively. Too bad McVay doesn’t have that coach on his contact list because he nailed it.

    1. McVay isn’t even in the same league as Shanny. I told Grant months ago when he was up McVay’s butt that you take away Gurley, and see what his offense looks like. Welp, I think it was clear to see for all those that aren’t wearing Nancy Pelosi glasses….

    2. That’s right Cassie. McVay got out coached. The Rams made no adjustments on offense. The Patriots used a similar defensive game plan as the Bears when they beat the Rams in the regular season (4-3 front, with movement and stunts, mostly zone). If McVay is a genius – he certainly didn’t look like it on Sunday.

  27. There was some whining on this blog that Kyle wasn’t praising Mullens enough after the latter won some games.
    Apparently PFF has published a detailed analysis of Mullens’ plays which were reported in NN:
    https://www.ninersnation.com/2019/2/4/18201520/pff-qb-annual-nick-mullens-takeaways-49ers-quarterback
    Some takeaways:
    “Mullens plays it safer than Alex Smith……
    In intermediate throws, the money throws in Kyle Shanahan’s offense, Mullens accuracy was 8.5 percentage points below NFL average……
    Mullens played his best football within the cozy structure of Kyle Shanahan’s offense. ….But when things started to fall apart, so did Mullens. On throws that extended past 2.6 seconds Mullens’ passer rating drops to 76.5. But perhaps more telling, his expected points added (EPA) per play plummets to -.11. That’s right — Mullens effectively takes points off the board when he takes longer than 2.6 seconds to throw the ball….
    And if Mullens is forced to scramble due to pressure things get even worse. He only completes one of every five passes, a rate well below average. And his expected points “added” plummets to -.48. The NFL average EPA on scramble drill plays is .03…..
    Nick Mullens is by no means ready to take over the starting role for an NFL team. Sub-optimal accuracy and an inability to execute difficult throws limits his effectiveness. If anything, the key takeaway from his chapter should be “Kyle Shanahan is amazing.” But Mullens has proven that, at times, he can be a moderately effective shepherd for Shanahan’s offense, and he’s good at avoiding disaster.

      1. If the Eagles are looking for a 3rd round pick for Foles, I guess we could get maybe a 7th rounder and a bag of beef jerky for Mullens….

            1. I still keep chuckling because Grant and Hammer used to use PFF to support their positions all the time until they took some night classes apparently….

              1. They, and the Person who Shall Not be Named, bring the daily doses of irony & chuckles to this blog I suppose…..

              2. Or, as I already wrote, did a little digging into the process and realized that it’s not worth using.

                As for the teams that use their services, it’s not the grades. There’s a great deal of information that they gather which they do not make available to the public. That is what the teams are getting, and it’s the situational data.

              3. Hammer, so you’re a digger? My son was a picker. Left ’em all over his bedroom walls. Glad he grew out of that!

          1. As for the teams that use their services, it’s not the grades.

            The PFF analysis of Mullens discussed in the NN arrticle did not grade him but compiled some numbers under various game situations. Not sure why the discussion was diverted to “grades”.

        1. They made no reference of the intense pass-rush pressure Mullens faced and how he handled it better than Garoppolo in 2018. They had a narrative and looked for evidence to confirm it. That’s what PFF does.

          1. That’s quite a charge Grant. Exactly what evidence do you have to support your assertion that PFF starts with a narrative and then looks for evidence to support and confirm this bias? Are you saying they don’t take pressure into account when grading QB’s? Do you even know what kind of data and context PFF uses to grade QB’s?

            Is it simply enough to assert their bias without giving us any evidence to back this claim up? And if PFF is such a joke, why are PFF’s grades referenced by every major sports website and/or publication, more often than any other grading system? Here’s a partial list of websites and publications who reference, not only PFF’s advanced stats, but also PFF’s Grades, more often than any other:

            – NFL Network ✔
            – Sports Illustrated ✔
            – ESPN ✔
            – Bleacher Report ✔
            – Pro Football Weekly ✔
            – Sporting News ✔
            – Yahoo Sports ✔
            – NBC Sports ✔
            – CBS Sports ✔

            PFF believes they have the most effective quarterback evaluation method out there. Here is a link to PFF’s QB grading system on their website:

            https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/pro-pff-qb-grading-most-effective-tool-there-is

            Here is their brief overview of the topic:

            “Quarterback is one position where there is an overabundance of statistics, not to mention wins and losses, to quantify how a passer is playing. But statistics are results-based numbers and often owe as much or more to players other than the quarterback. That influence from other players can warp or distort the perception of the quarterback’s play, effectively giving him credit or punishing him for things he had nothing to do with”.

            “The basic tenet of PFF’s grading has always been to try and isolate the play of individuals from the rest of the team, giving you a true reflection of what they did, regardless of whether that was rewarded by teammates picking up the baton.”

            PFF even gives us some of the easiest and most obvious examples …. “like quarterbacks throwing bubble screens that go 80 yards for a touchdown based on the receiver breaking a couple of tackles and outrunning the defense. That hypothetical pass nets a quarterback a perfect passer rating of 158.3, but if the same pass is dropped by the receiver instead of taken the distance, that passer rating becomes 39.6, without changing anything the quarterback did on the play. It doesn’t take many of those in a season to completely twist a player’s numbers and drive an incorrect perception of how he played.”

            Now … on the surface, it’s hard to argue against what PFF is using as a basis for their grading system. However, I think we’re all open to “a better mousetrap” so to speak. I know I certainly am. So please Grant, enlighten us. Go ahead, enlighten the football world with all of your superior wisdom. Tell us why we should believe your QB evaluation and assessment over that of PFF’s. I’ve just posted a pretty good overview of PFF’s process. Seeing that you seem to believe your system is superior to that of PFF’s, you should certainly be able to back this up with an overview of your own process, along with the data you use to support your process, as well as the necessary context in which you draw your conclusions?

            I won’t hold my breath!

            1. And with all of your inside access Grant, do us all a favor and find just one current 49er, GM, or someone involved in scouting and personnel, who is willing to go on the record saying Nick Mullens gives the 49ers as good, or better chance of winning than Jimmy Garoppolo does. Just one!

              We’ll know what executives around the league think about Mullens later in this offseason, based on what teams are willing to give up for him, right? We know from reporting that at least one team was willing to give the Patriots a 1st round pick for Garoppolo, we know that, and probably more.

              Tell me Grant …. how many teams are willing to give the 49ers a 1st or 2nd round pick for Mullens this offseason? Nick has started more games than Jimmy had prior to the trade, so experience shouldn’t be an issue.

              1. How in the hell is Mullens worth a 2nd rounder if Foles is worth a 3rd rounder? Inflation or adoration?

              2. Bravo! Inflation of adoration!

                As they say, love is blind…

                When a writer loves a QB
                Can’t keep his mind on nothin’ else
                He’d change the world for the good thing he’s found

                If he is untried, he can’t see it
                He can do no wrong
                Turn his back on his best friend if he put him down

              3. Fair enough Grant, I appreciate you going out on a limb and placing a value on Mullens.

                We’ll know soon enough just how closely your valuation of Mullens compares to the people who are paid to make these decisions.

                In relation to Garoppollo, the bar has been set at a high 2nd round pick. I highly doubt there is any team willing to give up more than a mid to late 3rd round pick for Mullens.

                We’ll find out soon enough. Stay tuned.

              1. Grant…

                See my post below regarding PFF and the Pro Coach.Network. Extracted from the PFF website. Yeah, it’s PFF material. So, is this all BS?

              2. They ridicule the PFF grades.

                What those who keep pointing to how all 32 teams use PFF are missing is that it’s not the grades they’re after, yet they cling it.

              3. Well then Grant, here’s another chance to up your game. Take time this off season and do some investigative reporting. Expose PFF for the sham it is–get out on the national stage. You may risk being vilified, but your’e used to that. Truth is on your side.

              4. “With all due respect to those websites, I don’t really know how some of that information is determined or evaluated,” Belichick said on WEEI Tuesday, via CSN New England. “I know that in the past, we’ve looked at those websites — not any one in particular — but just in general we’ve looked at those websites and said, ‘OK, here’s their top rated guy. Where are we?’ just to kind of gauge where we feel like the value of the websites are. If they’re rating them the same as we are, maybe that’s something we need to keep a close eye on so we can start to track a lot of guys. If there’s some big discrepancy, is there really any value to that? I’d say a lot of that stuff is not real accurate, so take it with a grain of salt.”

      1. From the PFF website (yeah, it is what it is)…

        “Over the past nine years, Pro Football Focus’ unique signature stats, player focus grades, and player rankings have revolutionized the way fans and media have looked at player performance in the NFL.

        But behind the scenes an even more profound revolution is taking place. Currently, all NFL teams, along with more than three dozen college football programs, are using our data and services to gain significant advantages in game preparation, opponent scouting, and personnel evaluation.

        And now, we are making our data and grades even more accurate, with the help of the outstanding team at Pro Coach.Network.

        Pro Coach.Network is a group of current and former NFL coaches with hundreds of years of NFL experience.

        They have chosen to partner with Pro Football Focus and bring their years of experience and expertise to improve an already excellent product. Now, every player grade produced by Pro Football Focus is reviewed and either confirmed or edited by a former NFL head coach.”

        They should add Grant to their pool of expert consultants…

          1. Grant is a principled journalist…that we know. Having said that, if PFF offered a $300K per season retainer deal, would he take it?

              1. “Sean McVay is the youngest offense genius head coach to lead his team to 3 points in the Super Bowl in just his second season.”

              2. And I thought we were talking about here on the blog. Silly me.

                Yes, some people on earth have called McVay a genius. They have done the same for Shanahan. Both are way premature.

              1. C’mon Grant! What’s your favorite love anthem?

                ‘You’ve Got A Friend in Me’ from Toy Story doesn’t qualify…

              2. I think my comment of Elway hiring from Shanny’s staff in response to Grant’s comment about how well Elway knew Shanny sent him to the loo for further introspection….🚽

            1. “Probably want to talk to Staley, Kittle, etc. to get a better understanding of the love for their HC.”

              This coming from a Marine. The measure of a leader is based on how much the men love him. As one famous Marine used to say, Well Gol-ly.

    1. Hey Mood – Got any takeaways about CJ. Or maybe I should say giveaways. Don’t recall anyone whining about KS being unfair to Mullens. If we had a good QB the subject of Mullens would probably not come up. The commenters I saw universally compared two alternatives and took issue with KS’ choice. Virtually all of the comments had to do with how in the world KS could not even have attempted sooner to find out what the had in light of Mullens being elevated to number two. Also, some here are still upset and not willing to jump to Kyle’s defense for trading up for a CONSENSUS (like in multiple talent evaluators instead of just pff) fifth to sixth round pick. Make your point without interjecting your own editorial comments. Discussing substantive issues and raising reasonable questions is by no means whining.

      1. Whining is subjective I suppose.

        Grant broached the matter of Shanahan being less-than-respectful to Mullens late in the season.

      2. Hey Whine,
        The whining about the lack of effervescent enthusiasm for Mullens from Kyle was almost entirely by the owner of this blog, not so much by the other denizens…
        My personal opinion, for all it’s worth, is that neither CJ nor Mullens are starting caliber QBs, but Mullens is a better backup than CJ at this point.

        1. Re CJ and Mullens, I can’t disagree with you there. I try to make a point about using the cap properly and maybe it’s the bean counter in me that it is more important to me than with others. Like my wife would say to me, You know what I could have bought with that money you blew? BTW whine is spelled with a small “w”. Feel free to refer to me as Mr. country if whining touches a nerve with you though. It’s all good man.

    1. Thanks UC – looks to me that KS was Harbaugh v.1a in Atlanta. He arrived there when they were loaded with talent and his scheme plus their talent equaled success. He then parlayed that one off success into his latest gig with the 49ers. In the cap era you have got to learn to play the hand you’re dealt instead of wishing and hoping for the players that will make your scheme work. When and if he learns that, there may be some progress made. If they had a Wade Phillips type defense I’d say cut the guy some slack. But when your DC is on OJT, it’s like the Rams lineman said, in the long run we’re all dead. Until then….it’s Dusty Springfield – wishing and hoping and thinking and praying, planning and dreaming each night….. of success, and that is not a plan. McVay got a huge wake up call yesterday and all I can say is: Kyle, there’s phone call for you on line 1.

        1. Just re-watched it as a party of the Mood Black Dystopian Film Festival to make the end of the Niners season. Next up: the original Planet of the Apes, to be followed by Blade Runner 2049

        1. Rudy. Remember the Titans. Al Pacino’s speech in “Any Given Sunday.” Friday Night Lights. We are Marshall.

          Draft Day is entertaining, if completely unbelievable.

  28. I have a hankering for a little Logan’s Run followed by a heaping helping of Zardoz. Listening to the KRON sports analysts put the word “Brutal” in my head I guess. :)

    1. Any Given Sunday, with an Old School coach, wunderkind OC and a black QB who took the league by storm. It talked about the sleazy medical staff which put winning and profits over the health of the players. The QB got benched and the owner in the movie reminded me of a typical NFL owner, with believable controversies.
      .
      The Longest Yard with Burt Reynolds was an original favorite, but Remember the Titans was superb dealing with racial tensions, and the evolution of the sport. The most recent favorite is The Blind Side.
      .
      Those are the football movies I like. 3 other sports movies that I liked were- The Natural, A league of Their Own and Field of Dreams.

      1. Sebbie… If the Press Democrat ever produced a movie based on Grant’s blog, which actor would play you?

        For starters, Lowell C. would be played by Tom Hanks. Grant by Shia LaBeouf.

          1. You’ll have to speak with the casting director….chosen by the Press Democrat of course. Don’t know if the PD is sensitive to cultural appropriation or not.

            Any suggestions?

      2. Seb,
        Good selections.
        The saddest sports movie has to be Brian’s Song, depicting Chicago Bears RB Brian Piccolo’ battle with cancer.

        The happiest (for me) was The Sandlot. No other sports movie reminds me of my old childhood friends and Summers of endless baseball than that movie.

        1. I forgot about Brian’s Song. Inspirational true story, yet so sad. Gale Sayers and Brian Piccolo had such a good friendship that crossed the racial divide. Another one of my favorites.
          .
          The Sandlot sounds like a perfect childhood baseball story. I relate to Field of Dreams, because My father was the baseball coach for my team. I must admit I was not very skilled, so I could probably relate with Smalls. My father had an eye for talent, and one year, we won the little league championship, because our pitcher was unhittable. Some of my best memories of my father was when he and I would throw the baseball to each other.

        2. Brian’s Song is easily my favorite football movie. Interestingly enough, I was able to acquire an autobiography by Brian Piccolo and his wife that detailed Piccolo’s battle with the cancer that eventually took his life.

  29. Grant…

    How about a Shanahan longevity poll? “Will Kyle Shanahan be the 49ers head coach in 2020?” Assuming of course that Kyle will at least start the 2019 season at the helm.

    Could even offer an over/under option for ’19.

  30. Your right Cas! I watched Zardoz for the first time in the early ‘70’s on shrooms!! Couldn’t stop laughing! Trippy flic!!

      1. Might be the best football themed commercial of all time. Even the commish got some air time.
        I actually forgot what the commercial was selling.

  31. Interesting. KS does not have an OC. Sean McVay also does not have an OC. Previously, I did not think that McVay needed one, because he got to the SB without one. However, looking at the offensive ineptitude on Sunday, Maybe McVay could have benefited from having an OC. Sure am glad McVay admitted he was out coached. Sounds like he could have used some help.
    .
    Bill Belichick, who just proved he is the smartest HC in the league, has an OC. He is not filled with hubris and says he does not need an OC. His OC helped win a Super Bowl.
    .
    No one has yet given me an adequate reason why having an OC would hurt the team.

    1. Ha ha ha! Really Seb. “No one has yet given me an adequate reason why having an OC would hurt the team.”

      Do we owe you something? We know what you want–what you have wanted for many, many, many months. And we know why. Some agree, some don’t, some don’t care. Own your opinion and be done with it. Are you seeking affirmation? Are you seeking an argument along the way? Stop pouting. Please.

      1. See, you cannot give an adequate explanation why an OC would hurt the team, so you obfuscate. Giving a reason should not be hard, but you are incapable of doing it. Maybe it is because you would be trying to defend the indefensible.
        .
        You ask me all the time to do something for you. Surmising about casting in a movie is your latest.

              1. McVay scored 3 points. An OC might have helped. Even MC Vay admitted he was out coached.
                .
                Prove to me that an OC would hurt the team.

              2. Again, which proves what exactly Seb? You are using a coach who made it to the Super Bowl without having an OC as your reason why Shanahan needs to hire an OC. Instead of helping your belief, you are killing it and covering the body of evidence with manure.

              3. Sean McVay and KS are young inexperienced HCs. They blithely state they do not need an OC.
                .
                Bill Belichick just won his sixth Lombardi, He thought it was necessary to have an OC. Sounds like both KS and McVay think they are smarter than Belichick.
                .
                KS is 4-12, and admitted he should have won 3 more games. McVay just got eviscerated by Belichick, and admitted he was out coached. How to stop being out coached? By getting coaching help. How do they get coaching help? By hiring an OC. Being full of hubris and refusing help, is a good way to lose.

              4. As a professional in the field, Sebbie would know quite a bit about organic fertilizers…

              5. Indeed I do, through interaction with you. Please stand downwind. Now, find that binkie!

        1. Dear Sebbie…

          I owe you nothing. Mixing 6th grade schoolyard behavior with overwrought indignation is kinda silly. Find affirmation somewhere else.

          Yours always….

          1. Do not troll me with calls for boatloads of picks, then.
            .
            In fact, stop haunting my posts if you want to stop me from asking you to describe how having an OC might help the Niners.

    2. Bill Belichick, who just proved he is the smartest HC in the league, has an OC.

      But he doesn’t have a DC… guess he’s stupid too.

      1. He had Matt Patricia helping coach since 2004. In 2012, Patricia was promoted to Defensive coordinator.
        As DC, he helped win 3 SBs.
        .
        Last season Patricia was promoted to HC of the Lions. As his replacement, Belichick entrusted Brian Flores with the defensive play calling duties, so he was working as the DC without the title. Now that Brian Flores is gone, Belichick will be looking for another replacement to be making the defensive calls. I bet DCs are lining up to jump at the chance to work behind the master.I wonder if he may ask Don Brown to join the Patriots.
        .
        Belichick is smart enough to have some one calling the offensive and defensive plays, so he could concentrate on being HC. Obviously, he was not comfortable enough to name Flores as DC, but that did not matter, because he won a SB anyways.Flores helped win 4 SBs. Flores proved his worth with his promotion to HC of the Dolphins.
        .
        You may call Belichick stupid if you want.
        .
        I will not, because I think Belichick is as smart as Walsh.

          1. By refusing to provide any reason why an OC would hurt the team, you have lost the argument.
            .
            I will keep bringing it up until you do, so at least try.

            1. Seb, I don’t need provide a reason why Shanahan is fine without ann OC because you did it for me. By using McVay as your reasoning for why Shanahan needs an OC, you have literally Freddy Kruegered your own argument. All I had to do was let it happen the same way you have done to many of your other arguments. You are the only one on here I am aware of that is capable of stating an argument, having it blow up in your face either through your own words the full truth coming out, and proceed to double down on said blown up argument.

              1. Seb makes a poor argument Mid and even though I think an OC with experience might help Kyle Shanahan it is incumbent on the person making the assertion to prove the point. Instead he makes the assertion and ask others to make the argument. This is a loser in any argument of any value. But, what can one expect from Sebbie.

              2. I enumerated many reasons why an OC might help. You, and others cannot think of a single thing why an OC would hurt.
                .
                Yes it is argumentative, but I feel like I am in a battle of wits against an unarmed foe.

              3. Shanny is a superb play caller is one reason you don’t want an OC.
                A revolving door is another. We don’t need to be in the business of training OC’s to be HC’s in the NFL. This ain’t Kansas City….

            2. No, McVay himself said he was out coached. How does one lose the most important game in his life? By not having the right help.
              .
              Rams should not have been in the SB anyways. They needed the refs to help them get in.
              .
              This last SB was a textbook case for why a HC should have an OC.

              1. Try to remember where you last left your binkie…. Somewhere on your 2.5 acre estate?

      2. Belichick, after winning his 6th SB, has earned the right to decide if he needs a coordinator or not. He decided he did not need to promote Flores, and won a SB.
        .
        KS imploded during the second half of his SB, and Sean McVay imploded for his entire SB. They did not earn any right to declare they do not need help. In fact, they need all the help they can get.

          1. By refusing to answer my question, you keep losing the argument. Why can’t you even try to think of why having an OC would hurt the team? Because it is an indefensible argument.
            .
            Will it hurt KS’s feelings? My feelings are hurt by watching a 4-12 coach say he should have won 3 more games, then blithely state he does not need an OC. As HC, KS has a responsibility to do everything n his power to win. By not having an OC, he is not trying hard enough.

            1. Sebbie…

              Suggestion. Attach your binkie to a tether, and attach the tether to your jammies.

              Now turn that frown upside down!

            2. You are the one who used faulty reasoning to justify your stance. Only a foolish person would use McVay in his argument for Shanahan “needing” an OC. I will not give any kind of counterargument until you make a valid argument. HINT: Using a coach that made it to the Super Bowl without an OC is not an example of such an argument.

  32. Here is my first attempt at what the off-season plans for the 49ers could be in free agency and the draft.

    Release WR Garcón
    Release LB Smith
    Resign DE Blair to a 3 yr./$3 million deal
    Sign FS Thomas to a 4 yr./$42.6 million deal
    Sign LB Patrick Onwuasor to a 2 yr./$9.75 million deal
    Sign DE Ansah to a 1 yr./$7.8 million deal
    Sign LB Barrett to a 5 year/$29.75 million deal
    Sign WR Conley to a 2 yr./ 11.25 million deal
    Sign K Myers to a $3 yr./$6 million deal

    DRAFT

    ROUND ONE
    DE Nick Bosa

    ROUND TWO
    OG/OT Dalton Risner

    ROUND THREE
    WR Terry McLaurin

    ROUND FOUR
    CB Lonnie Johnson Jr.

    ROUND SIX
    C/OT Sean Rawlings

    UDFA SIGNINGS

    WR Preston Williams
    WR John Ursua
    S Jalen Young
    P Zach Sinor
    RB/KR Kerrith Whyte Jr.

    1. They should re-sign Buckner as a top priority.
      .
      Ansah was listed as a 17 mil FA. Some playoff team might get him for less.
      .
      I like Chris Lindstrom or Connor McGovern over Risner.
      .
      Deebo Samuel is ranked at 65, do he may be available in the third round. Of course, Keelan Doss is superior to all. ;p
      .
      Other than those quibbles, good overall plan.

  33. I talked to a former coach last night. I asked him if the Rams would have won the SB if McVay had an OC. He laughed and said he did. Sean McVay. I asked him if Shanahan needed an OC. He laughed and said he did. Kyle Shanahan. I asked if they needed another OC besides themselves. He said sometimes too many chefs spoil the soup. I asked if that was a good enough reason not to have multiple OC’s. He said yes. This coach asked to remain anonymous. :)

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