The 49ers signed free safety Craig Dahl yesterday, but he’s not the Niners’ free safety of the future. He may not be their free safety of the present, either. He’s probably a backup, and a mentor for whichever free safety the 49ers draft in a few weeks.
Will the Niners draft a safety who is similar to Dashon Goldson – tall and hard-hitting, like LSU’s Eric Reid – or will the Niners draft a different type of free safety? Will they look for a faster guy who can play single-high and occasionally cover slot receivers man-to-man?
If the Niners are looking for the second type, a ball hawk, an obvious fit would be Fresno State free safety, Phillip Thomas. He led the NCAA with eight interceptions last year. But he ran a 4.65 40-yard dash at the Scouting Combine. He may not be fast enough to play single-high coverage.
There aren’t a lot of fast safeties in this draft. If the 49ers want one, they may have to draft a cornerback and move him to free safety. Here are two cornerbacks who could make the position switch:
David Amerson. 6-1, 205 pounds. Ran an unofficial 4.38 40-yard dash at the Combine. Intercepted 13 passes in 2011 and 5 in 2012.
Dwayne Gratz. 5-11, 201 pounds. Ran an unofficial 4.35 40-yard dash at the Combine. Intercepted eight passes in four seasons at the University of Connecticut.
There is also Chris Culliver, who’s already a 49er, played free safety in college and ran a 4.36 40-yard dash at the 2011 Combine.
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He may already be on the roster, just like Alex Boone was our RG of the future last year. Perhaps the staff thinks Robinson or Spillman is ready to step into a starting role.
Crayons i sure liked Robinson coming out of college. In fact i picked him as the sleeper pick of the draft. I just did’nt think he would be asleep all season
No offense, but Dahl and a draft pick probably knock Trenton Robinson off the 53 man roster. I question if your “sleeper” ever awakes in the NFL. Baalke has now made a bigger commitment to a guy booed by fans in St. Louis than he has made to Robinson.
TRENT ROBINSON IS OUR FUTURE!!!!
As an older person I realize my future is short. I don’t need it rubbed in my face though.
On the basis of one play in 2011, where he dropped a ball carrier for a loss in the playoff win against the Saints, plus his dynamic coverage skills, I’m a Spillman fan. Of course I have no idea as to his coverage skills or safety decision making, but he’s a heck of an athlete, and I hope he gets the chance to show what he can do at safety in the preseason.
About 6 weeks ago i started pushing for C. Culliver to be our next safety. I had no idea whether the team had thought about it, it just seemed like a good idea to me. Well since they let every top safety get out of town i’m begining to think it might just happen. We will get a better idea after the draft. I believe if we do’nt draft a safety with one of our top 3 picks in rd 1 or 2 we might see Culliver at safety next yr and alot less of Bowman and Willis covering TE’s 1 on 1.
Coach,
It is hard for me to imagine Culliver being moved to safety. He is one of our better corners in spite of being victimized in the superbowl. We already have weak Corners and I fail to see how weakening that position further to shore up the safety spot helps the defense overall.
I could be wrong but I just dont see this happening.
shoupbj, i agree with what your saying, but, if cully is so good, then why not use his cover skills as a last line of defense. the big play is our biggest weakness! if this team could stop giving up 50 yard touchdown passes then we would be superbowl champs right now damn it!!! sorry, i got carried away for a second. i think it comes down to the old ” best player” deal. we need to draft a bunch of Db’s for sure. i want us to draft the BEST PLAYER each time its our turn and not REACH for guys based on a specific position. we need a complete overhaul in the secondary in the next couple years with cully being the only holdover. the question is at what position. the answer will lie in the players we draft. get the best four Db’s on the field and let it play out as to who plays where.
I’ve been wondering about Cully as well…that was my first thought as soon as I heard we were looking at other corners on the market. It doesn’t make sense to cut Carlos R. this year…the cap savings would not be that much until next year. Neither does it make sense to cut Brown or Cully. So bringing in another corner only made sense for competition or if we had other plans with one of our current corners. Cully has the size and speed…but how about the mental side?
Culliver definitely has the skills to be our next fs….his speed and burst would be perfect for deep and in the middle of the field coverage…
This is probably the biggest off-season question for the 49ers right now. You’ve mentioned before you think they would like to have a FS that can play more single-high and man-to-man (thus a position move for Culliver), and I can definitely see the 49ers going that direction. Facing Earl Thomas twice a season will make anyone envious.
There really isn’t a safety in this draft well suited to that. But good call with Amerson – he played safety in high school and is just the type of blue collar hard worker the 49ers love. I think Culliver will stay at CB if they can get someone like Amerson to play FS. I personally think they will also go for a guy to play SS in 2014 onwards – and Phillip Thomas I think would be a perfect fit. He’s the new breed of SS that can hit but also cover.
Why not take them both? Amerson could be had late second round, while Thomas with your early third. While your at it, why not add Mathieu with the 3rd left in the chamber.
Yeah… that’s what I said Razor. They could take them both (in fact I think they should draft a FS and SS this year). As well as a CB.
I don’t care if Matt Elam is a strong safety, he is the best safety in the draft…hands down.
David Amerson played CB in college. There’s interest in converting him to safety. I think he’s better suited to be CB. If the Niners get a shot at him in the 3rd round, that would be a great pickup.
Amerson was converted to CB in college from High School were he played Safety. He has good size, but lacks speed which was evident in him getting scorched when playing top competition…However with his ball skills and size I think Safety is his best bet…
I think Robinson will be legit he was legit for Michigan St and comes from a solid defensive system. Hopefully we will sign Woodson no matter what ..
you’re too focused on speed. a good safety can anticipate a play and make a move in his zone and be ahead of the play despite sub 4.5 speed.
at the NFL level, so much of the Safety position is knowledge of the defense, what everyone’s responsibility are and how the offense will attack you. the Safety is the field general in today’s NFL. in the old days the middle linebacker was usually the defensive the field general. but in today’s passing league with multiple personnel packages, formations and even multiple types of offenses by one team…the Safety is usually the field general. this includes knowing how an offense will react to a disguised coverage (something I think the Niners need to do more of) and what site adjusted routes will be run by the opposing offense…what the tendencies of that offenses are in terms of throwing to the underneath receiver or the deeper receiver when the zones are flooded.
this is why starting a rookie at safety is rare. and as you say, Dahl may be a mentor, experienced back up and/or stop gap measure.
I do not understand why people think Culliver could be transitioned to Safety. So he played some safety in college. Playing Safety in college is no where near as complex of a job as being an NFL Safety. Culliver is horrible in deep coverage. He looks lost covering deep. He often gets assigned to cover deep when the Niners run Cover 3 or Quarters coverage in sort of a soft quasi-prevent defense that they go to in obvious long passing downs. Culliver’s strength is playing press man with help over top.
What do you think his natural position is with SF?
Right Cornerback. Lined up right up on the X/Split End where Culliver can get his hands on him and press at the line of scrimmage. (Left Corner usually lines up against the Z/Flanker, who lines up off of the line of scrimmage and has an advantage at gaining a free release).
I think the point is that there is no true coverage FS in this years draft class. Lots of good 2nd/ 3rd round options that can play halves, support the run and come down and take the TE. Thus the reason Amerson is an interesting prospect.
I agree Culliver is no guarantee to be a good FS. He currently lacks the recognition/ diagnose skills. It may be that he just isn’t smart enough or have the right instincts to play the position.
if it were up to me, playing a half would be the primary skill necessary. I’m not a fan of bringing Safeties up in the box because I figure it’s the front 7′s job to stop the run. I also don’t really care if a Safety is a hard hitter if it’s a detriment to his ability to protect the back end (I think Goldson and Whitner would often look at the underneath receiver expecting the opportunity for a big play or big hit and lose track of another receiver running right by them. ) a hard hitting safety for me is a luxury…nice to have but not a requirement.
The 49ers tend to play eight in the box on base downs. http://t.co/S59TBKBYEp
yeah i know (i even mentioned it in a response to someone asking about Whitner playing with the green dot). i just think that the Niners are too predictable and put themselves at a disadvantage on base downs. if i was an opposing OC, first thing i’d do is plan to pass on 1st down.
I guess that would be the benefit of having a guy like Thomas playing SS. He’s capable in coverage so Fangio would be able to disguise his coverage better.
Allfor-spot on analysis of Culliver.
I think that it will be Phillip Thomas as well Grant. The secondary needs a FS that can make offenses think twice about going to the air.
Doesn’t Whitner have the green dot? I assume he also adjusts the coverage when needed. So the Niners could bring in a rookie free safety if needed.
no, i believe Goldson had it. Whitner could probably be the green dot guy. but the Niners have a tendency to play Whitner closer to the line of scrimmage as a classic Strong Safety on run downs so he doesn’t always have the chance to survey the field and get the secondary and linebackers all lined up and coordinated.
i first heard the idea of culliver moving to safety from grant right here a few weeks ago. it makes so much sense! dashon had about 5 “big time hits ” last year. he also was beaten deep about 8-10 times!!! usually for or leading to, touchdowns!!! this is why he is not worth 8 or even 5-6 mill$ a year!!!!!!! big hitting safetys are going the way of the dinosaur. a textbook shoulder to shoulder hit is now a 15 yard penalty! let alone a helmet to helmet or defenseless wr etc. thats why caroll wanted no part of his own college guy, the clumsy taylor Mays. instead going after earl thomas. the slightly smaller , but faster, better at coverage guys with good hands are the next generation of safety. earl thomas/ eric berry. i think CC would make a great FS
I think I’ve only seen that idea discussed here. Am I mistaken? Anyone see it from Sando or Barrows or MM or EB? I’m not excited by the idea and I wonder if the team is. They’ve interviewed one CB and signed a safety and interviewed 2 others (maybe 3 if Reed stops here). Would they play all that out if they were thinking of a switch?
Just asking.
i’ve seen the horrible idea of Culliver to Safety discussed on Ninernation.
I have a feeling that if one of the bigger names signed, it could mean the end for Carlos Rogers with either Ashoumga taking his place or Culliver moving up to his spot and Reed or Woodson at Safety.
i think its possible that even baalke and haurbaugh dont know what the starting secondary will look like next year. if these guys are as good as we think they are…then they will keep many options available. culliver would be a cheaper option than goldson, thats why dashon is gone. of the top 5-6 safetys in the draft ( and or corners who could make the switch) maybe they like a few who they think would be as good or better than cully. if we land such person in april then cully stays at corner. maybe they feel that the best player on thier board is a corner. we land this player , then cully goes to safety?
tuna, barrows did mention the possibility of a culliver switch. just briefly. i live in sacramento and follow the bee. i dont follow those other reporters
Thanks for that, I thought we’d brewed that up on our own. Collectively we have been known to go off on tangents!
It’s not at all implausible that he could be spotted there, I just haven’t sensed anything from the team. But then they don’t want anybody knowing, do they? We don’t know how they feel about CJ in coverage, or Trenton, or the guy from Stanford who they brought back.
BrothaTuna,
I was called a moron, among other things, a year ago when I suggested that Goldson would be a better strong safety. What a difference a year makes.
why would they be looking at corners in free agency if they had not considered moving cully???? he is young so is brown( contract up after this year?) carlos is not. seems they would draft a guy and sit him or slowly bring him along , and prepare him for a bigger role in 2014
maybe they are looking at a possible replacement for carlos that could save them $$$$????? isn’t he due to get almost 8 mill$ this year?
Ok fellas n fellettes if culliver plays safety who goes to cb.. lord knows not rodgers
of course not, rodgers plays Qb for the packers !lol.
Lol.. good one
Culliver moving to safety makes some sense. I feel that he is better when the play is in front of him, he seems to struggle when trying to stay with defenders down the sideline and having to turn and find the ball.
If Culliver doesn’t move to FS, I personally like Eric Reid out of LSU. He has the requisite size and speed to play the deep safety role.
The team values speed, as evidenced by the last two drafts. If you look at players like Jenkins, James, Hunter, Culliver, Robinson, they all had strong 40 times when drafted. You could even include Aldon Smith and Kaepernick to that list.
Ok, don’t be getting my hopes up cause I have wanted Chris Culliver to move to the safety position since we drafted him. He is so explosive and aggressive and has great instincts, if the 49ers moved him to safety and draft a corner back cut Carlos and sign namdi, pshh good luck scoring on us. But I trust the 49er front office but I doubt they will move him to safety since he has spent these years as a cornerback they want to keep him developing
moving cully, singing nhamdi, drafting multiple safetys and corners and cutting carlos is my ideal scenario! i dont like whitner and having competition for cully at FS instead of giving him the job is why i say “drafting multiple S’s”. if we hit a home run in a FS in the draft then cully can stay/move back to corner. weather its carlos or nhamdi…there both old and brown will be a free agent so we must draft some corners. the only non-Db that i like early in the draft is that alabama d-linemen jessie willams. strong,fast ,big and athletic! reminds me of a bigger justin smith!
kidding aside, it would be a rookie, nhamdi, rogers ( grant smacked us with stats saying carlos rogers was a much better cb than nhamdi last year) or…..revis????? 2-3 weeks ago i was all in as far as going after revis. then i backed off on the idea. after loosing dashon and the consideration of moving cully over to FS… im very interested on seeing how the revis saga plays out. one thing i read when we were first linked to trading for him, was that we wanted him without doing an extension. one year, at a decent price. this would allow us to gauge his personality. see if he fits the locker room but more importantly, see if he is fully recovered from the injury. the compensation to the jets would be far less if he has only one year under contract as opposed to an extension. it looked like a deal to the bucs was coming but has not. profootball talk pointed out that the jets just paid him a 1mill$ roster bonus and asked the question as to why they would do so if they had a great deal on the table from tampa bay? it seems as if he will not be traded to tampa. unless the jets just ate a million dollars in a game of chicken to get the bucs to sweeten the deal. if he ends up getting a new deal from a new team however, im not sure if the jets are on the hook for the cash or not so this point could be moot.
I believe we could draft a pure (position in college) Safety with our picks rather than switching a rookie DB to learn a different position at this level (NFL).
Players like Cyprien, Reid, and possibly Elam might be available at #31 – 34. Anyone of these players could eventually lock-up the Safety position for the next 5-6 years.
agreed. however a good g.m would prefer to draft “the best player” and not reach on a guy due to position need. if these true safetys were that great, they wouldn’t be around at 31 or 34. im just saying. none of us have a clue as to what baalke is thinking/ will do. i also am clueless as to who the better n.f.l player will be down the road out of these Db’s. some of the safety prospects seem a little short (under 6 feet) maybe we trade up for a corner like rhodeds? if baalke is convinced rhodes will be a pro-bowler and that elam or ried will be average starting safetys in this league…then its a no-brainer
Correct, we don’t know what Baalke will do.
Just trying to get into the intrigue/fun of all the window shopping I guess.
I’ve never had much success in choosing the first 10 picks in the draft since, well decades. But I must admit its still kinda fun.
Vaccaro, Reid, Rambo and Jefferson are the best FS options available in the draft IMO, of those that played the position in college, and I don’t think any of those guys have the range to play single-high well. As allforfunnplay says, that’s not necessarily a bad thing – nothing wrong with playing halves. Of that bunch, I like Reid the most.
I like Thomas, Cyprien and Elam, but they are SS in my opinion, so would take over from Whitner in 2014 (though I think Thomas could play some at FS).
Out of all of the remaining options at safety, the one that gives me the most confidence is Culliver. He has the athleticism and experience in this defense to be successful.
btw. Goldson was a Corner/Safety tweener coming out of college. Remember how long he sat behind Mark Roman? Roman drove most of us nuts because he constantly gave up plays in front of him, he’d also get burned deep (though not because he was out of place but because he was just simply out run deep…as opposed to Goldson who was beaten because he was out of place). But Nolan kept him as the starter because he needed a guy who knew how to line up everyone and direct the defense.
Reggie Smith was also a tweener Corner/Safety coming out of college. I had high hopes for him. I was surprised when they put him in at Strong Safety as, I thought his natural position was Free Safety…and thought it made sense to move Goldson to Strong Safety. But I guess they liked Goldson at Free to coordinate the defense. Reggie busted at Strong Safety…too bad…again I had high hopes for him.
Woodson: “I still get a contract right?”
Baalke: “BEAT IT!”
No way MWN. I think Baalke would treat his elders with more respect than that.
Ok, how about this:
Baalke: “I’m sorry Mister Woodson, but we have already in another direction. Now I’ll wheel you out of the facility while you drink your prune juice.”
I hate posting by phone.
my take is niners may still go for woodson…and may even go for abraham to platoon with the haralson providing pass rush from both sides….with the 31 or 34 pick could go for elam at strong safety thereby releasing whitner…..and maybe even pick up a free safety with 34 or later pick……
i still not enamored enough with revis… based on chemistry issues
goldson’s rookie year, first home pre-season game, my first game as a season ticket holder, i looked at my buddy next to me and said “that guy looks like the second coming of ed reed” big, fast. in on every play. i think he would have been a good SS. 20 years ago he would have been a great FS. you can’t just level guys going over the middle anymore in this league! 15 yard penalty! the FS is more of a corner these days. you have to be able to cover and get the interceptions. and maybe force a fumble here and there. dashon routinely got beat deep and only had one year with above average turnovers. thank goodness ronnie lott doesen’t play in this era !!!!! instead of being a hall of famer he would be getting called for penalties all day, fined and suspended!!
screw it, bring ed reed in. line him up next to woodson in santa clara. tell the 2 men they have to run a race against one another “there and back”. then there will be no question of who has “lost the most steps”. winner gets a one year deal and the looser gets “the hell outta here”
Jshaw – Hilarious! That’s how it should be man, greedy sports agents get in the way now!
Welcome to the blog….we need more bloggers like you in here. I hope you stick around.
You guys keep mentioning the same safties, crypien, Reid, etc.. do u guys not realize if these guys are that good, theres no way they will make it to 31.. Our safety of the future might not even be in this draft. One thing is for sure, when we come up @31 it will be a suprise pick. All of our top picks in the balkee era have been suprises. Aldon, Kap, Aj…… But ill put my money on 1 thing, not one blogger here has mentioned who will be our pick at 31 or 34…
thats because the picks get traded.?
we could move up a little..a lot or move back. or we could trade one of those picks to someone for a first rounder next year. i think we made a similar trade a few years back? panthers maybe? isn’t that how we ended up with upati and davis? grant?anyone?
@Steel
It’s not unreasonable to expect Reid, Elam, or Cyprien at 31 or 34 IMO. Vacarro might even slip that far, maybe not.
Also, I had Aldon although I probably didn’t call my shot. I usually don’t call specific choices, but I was looking at Aldon or the DE the Rams took high 2nd, (Quinn?).
PS I’m no oracle, I read a couple of places that Baalke was really high on him.
Agree with BT. Reid will definitely be there and I’d could see them taking him at 34.
Not necessarily, Dashon Goldson was drafted in the 4th rd as the #126 overall pick in the draft. He became an all-pro.
All you can do with a college player is look at his production on the field during his career. You want to see how/if they improved on their play during their years in college.
Players like Cyprien, Reid, Elam, Phillips are the top-shelf of their position. That may not make them top 10 draft picks, but they will be valued picks for those teams needing to fill these particular positions.
Sorry, this was a reply to Steelematic.
Good points guys.. in my opinion though the draft has become more exciting since balkee took over because of the unknown. Cant wait til draft day
*Phillip Thomas
If Kaepernick was that good he would have been drafted in the first round. Rusell Wilson was good, Richard Sherman too, when were they drafted. All good players don’t get drafted in the first round only. There is a reason there are 7 rounds in a draft.
I dont get it, your saying kap isnt any good because he wasnt drafted in rd1 but the Seahawks guys are good because they werent drafted in rd1????
You got Seahawks written all over your post. Welcome to niner land
Yea I agree Culliver our free Safety, just like Walsh did when he drafted wright and Lot, I say we draft 2 good safeties the depth in this class is ridiculous. I see no difference in some small school D lineman that will go I drafted and some of the top picks in the first round. 2012 draft Trent did an amazing job but supposidly harbuagh made more picks of his own in this last draft Trent wanted Bruce Irvin so to harbuagh before the draft I say let Trent do his work draft two awesome safeties bye bye Whitner horrible pass coverage when there’s no pass rush. Safety And a small and big cornerback man coverage baby, my personal opinion Ian Williams and Demarcus Dobbs are our future I’ve had my eye on them since they joined the red and gold Dobbs is a beast when he’s healthy and not high ha
@ Grant
In your mention above that ‘Niners tend to play 8 in the box on base downs’; saw the photo, but is that a quantitative statement? I’m not challenging or disputing, just curious. Had you seen some kind of breakout of how often, as perhaps by PFF or one of those number crunchers?
Tyrann Mathieu is by far the most instinctively gifted defensive back in the draft. He is extremely quick and fluid, possessing superior ball skills and change of direction. Point? Draft him as a slot CB, but also see what he can do as a FS. If he is a pure a football player as I think he is, he’ll be the next Earl Thomas.
Outside of 420 advocates I don’t get the Honey Badger love. If he was really that good Les Miles would have figured out a way to keep him on the field instead of sending him off to rehab.
This isn’t Jay and Silent Bob, it’s the NFL. The stoned hero won’t save the day on the gridiron.
I agree with Mr. Everything.
Clem
It was blow, not dank. Huge difference.
But if he’s over it, he’s the steal of the draft. Have you seen him play? I’m not a college football fan, but some players dominate and leap off the screen. He does it in the return game, in the defensive backfield, and on blitzes. And his body control is Revis-esque.
It was both: http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/03/14/tyrann-mathieu-picking-marijuana-over-football-isnt-fun-anymore/
im confused, the Pft article refers to pot only, not one mention of the word cocaine….thats what “blow” is fellas. lets not slander a guy. there is a big difference! thats what most college kids do. smoke pot and drink booze. (sorry clueless parents) doing coke on the other hand is a big deal. but i only saw the pot reference . if we cant find a specific reference the the coke then my only concern with the honey badger is that he’s like, 5 foot 8…..too short to cover the big boys on the outside but may be one helluva slot guy. you know, covering other midgets.
He’s been to rehab. Can/do you go to rehab for pot, sure but there was little doubt at the time and plenty of rumors circulating that he was in rehab for cocaine.
Hmmmmm, makes you wonder about Sanchez eating that hot dog on the sideline. Case of the Mad Munchies?
I agree with you regarding Mathieu. But at what point (in the draft) would you draft him?
TM almost reminds me of Denard Robinson in that they are good players, but the burning question is, where do you draft them, in the 3rd – 5th rds?
I would personally draft either of them between the 4th – 5th rds.
wow, rehab huh? i had no idea. risky move for sure if we pick the kid up.
Don’t understand the risk card being played on this kid. Contracts for bad boys now come with specific clauses that protect the buyer.
@ Razoreater:
It’s not so much about the money as it is about the risk of spending a fairly high draft pick on a player who may not prioritize football and/or may make himself unavailable to the team.
I have no idea how one quantifies that risk or how you balance it against his skillset to determine the appropriate round in which to draft him. But I don’t think the team can pretend like the risk doesn’t exist.
Plenty of draft picks. I can’t agree with the reasoning that a late 3rd Round pick is too risky with the aforementioned consideration. Might be a mute point anyways. I think he is gone late 2 EARLY 3.
Regardless of how you balance the risk against his talent, you do recognize that there is a risk, right?
It will be interesting to see if it’s a moot point, or not. I definitely won’t be hitting the mute button when the analysts are talking about Mathieu, though, that for sure.
That’s for sure, not that for sure.
Minimal risk I would grant you.
He’s got a history of drug addiction to the point he got kicked off the LSU team, went to rehab, than got caught again. That is a chronic (pun intented) problem.
He’s very talented, but with that kind of history you have to weigh the risks of using a top 3 pick and I personally wouldn’t. If he’s around in the 4th I might do it but not in the top 3.
Draft picks in the first 3-4 rounds should be highly valued. You get cheap talent in those rounds and expect them contribute as starters or key backups at some point during their rookie contracts. Taking Mathieu in the first 3-4 rounds is ‘taking a flier’ on him. It’s investing good draft capital on a guy with significant drug issues.
one thing for sure if the niners want to end up ahead of st. louis or seattle the defense will need to push up the middle more than they did last year. If you notice our defeats (i.e. seattle, st, louis,and baltimore) these teams all had push up the middle that allowed the teams defensive backs to play tighter defense. If you think not look at our lack of scoring inside the 10 yard all season but especially in the super bowl. The niners lack of push in the middle resulted in the team not stopping other teams after they reached the 10 yard line.
2nd ranked scoring defense?
Of course, you’re right about push up the middle, but it’s something our offense needs to improve against too.
Tyraan will be a great pick up. Just like jenkins for the rams. He played well as a rook
I have no dought that our defense has great talent and enough to finish 2nd. But I don’t want the niners to finish second next year. It escapes me that our offensive and defensive leaders can’t watch others success against the team and use it against others.
C.J. Spillman will be our free safety of the future. He has the talent just needs a chance to start. Hopefully we draft Matt Elam and he is our strong safety of the future. Trenton Robinson is too short and Craig Dahl is too slow.
You are awfully definitive in your assertions, Brian, while having absolutely no idea how those guys are going to do. Dahl is faster than Goldson, I’m pretty sure. I hope Spillman is the guy but we have no reason to assume that he’ll have the decision making skills a safety needs. I prefer to see how they look in preseason before drawing any conclusions.
“Dahl is faster than Goldson, I am pretty sure.” You are awfully definitive in your assertion, Wilson. I don’t care if Dahl could catch a cold faster than Goldson, is isn’t half the safety Dashon is. He was booed by Rams fans! Jaff Fisher didn’t even attempt to resign him. Rotoworld says he is NOT a good tackler, his coverage skills are below average and has limited ball skills. What more do you need to know about him?
Having trouble agreeing with you. Matt Elam is a good football player but he’s short like T.Robinson, probably a step faster, and despite his deficiencies, Dahl might be as good or better in coverage than CJ
Jake Long to St Louis
Prove it ;)
Just saw it on PFT.
Guess we can rule out them taking an OT in the first round.
It’s obvious Niners are saving room on roster for the affordable extra draft picks. Baalke tried get Nnamdi, Woodson & Ed Reed to take a “Super Bowl favorite” discount but most famous NFL veterans don’t work cheap. I salute Baalke for trying! There’s plenty of studs in this deep draft, front office patience will payoff.
agreed. all 3 players you named are STILL free agents, so they are weighing their options. we could still end up singing one of them. i wouldnt complain if they came cheap. veteran leadership for the young guys that we WILL draft regardless. see: randy moss
Crab,
I believe you may be on to something there. I happen to believe that the 49ers made the same sell pitch to Payton Manning last spring.
The only issue is that except for Nnambi, these other players have their SB rings. Now, they are just looking for their last big paycheck.
I don’t think there are many options for Nnamdi and there virtually none for Woodson, so they could still be in play. The Niners will simply wait for the smoke to clear and see what’s left in the bargain bin.
Rocket,
Agreed, obviously there are questions about what either player has left in the tank, so it looks like the 49ers are only interested if there’s not much risk.
Of the two, I would rather they sign Asomugha. It seems like he carries more upside.
Shaw – those 3 are playing hard to get, do you want to sign with some s#*t team for an extra million or win a Super Bowl?
i would want the ring. with that said, 2 of the 3 already have one. and the other ones passion for the game is in question. its gonna be an interesting week or so
Charles Haley won 5 rings, I’m still sick over him goin to Dallas!
remember when guys would take less money to stay with the home team/win championships?
jshaw,
You mean back in the good old days when the players were getting the wool pulled over their eyes regarding the amount of money the NFL generates?
Players have very short careers, and most players can be cut at any time and not paid another dime. I don’t begrudge the players for trying to max out the money the can get, not one bit. The NFL is very cold to players who aren’t productive, and a player can be come unproductive [injured] at any point.
From a fan’s perspective, I get what you’re saying, but these guys sacrifice their body and, in many cases, their brains for the game. It’s their choice play, of course, but they have a very small window in which to make money. I may not like it sometimes, but they should do what they need to for themselves and their family. Remember the saying, “Nobody will take better care of you, than you?” It’s not truer anywhere than in the NFL.
exgolfer, i agree with ya. i was mostly just being a smart @ss. what sickens me, is the old timers that never made much money, dont have any money. these guys are dying young and not getting the medical or retirement benefits they deserve. icons of the n.f.l. all those steelers from the 70′s come to mind. freaken joke! 4 championships! built that franchise into one of the greatest in all of sports(i really didnt just say that did i?) can you even imagine joe montana being broke and homeless and dying? and with no one to help him? on the other hand , i will never feel sorry for someone who plays a game for a living, where the league minimum salary for one year is about 10 times what i make( the guys in 70′s did NOT make big money, they do have my sympathy)
Grant:
first time to respond to one of your post and have a question!! You discuss several candidates for the 9ers free safety position, what is your take on Zaviar Gooden, an OLB from Missouri!! He come to Missouri as a safety, then switched to OLB!! He posted numbers at the combine that got a lot of attention!! My question is, can he flip his hips, back peddle, etc and cover as a safety, have you seen game tape on him? Is he just an athlete, or is he a football player too!! He has the size at 6’2″ and 230+!! He has reportedly run a 4.33 40, but ran a 4.47 at the combine!!
in terms of size and speed, the Niners drafted a guy like that a couple years ago; Taylor Mays. Mays wasn’t too experienced at deep zone coverage coming out of college. His job at USC was basically to run up and tackle what was in front of him…sort of like a really deep linebacker. So I don’t know about Zavier’s college Safety experience..
A 230 lb guy would have to be beyond an elite level athlete (even for an NFL player) to be able to have the agility and body flexibility to play coverage as a Safety. I’m not saying it’s impossible, just improbable. Most 220 lb Safeties are usually run stuffing thumper type Strong Safeties that aren’t the best in deep coverage.
Like Mays, I think this type of player would be the perfect conversion to play in a Tampa 2 system as a Middle Linebacker in the mold of a Brian Urlacher (who was a safety in college). In the Tampa 2 system, the Middle Linebacker drops into a medium zone in the middle and then read and reacts to run plays and flows to the ball carrier and tackles what’s in front of him.
Actually sounds like the USC safety predecessor to Taylor Mays, Darnell Bing who was drafted by the Raiders and whom they tried to convert from Safety to OLB. Unfortunately it didn’t. However like you said, it worked with Urlacher.
The late great Pat Tillman I believe was a high school and college linebacker and later converted to SS in the NFL.
This safety question is small potatoes. Once DG left we had a hole. In fact I think we all knew we was going to be out. I wish we could sign him but too much money.
The biggest issue we have is DL and pass rush. Remember a few years ago we had Manny Lawson and Parys and whoever in DB back field (DG was hurt his first 2 years)….anyway we always said this Def is on the verge of being something. Just need a pass rush. Well, Brooks and Aldon changed that… We need a good rotation with these DL and OLB. We need more disruption in the pocket. We need athletes that can tackle Flacco and Wilson and not let them run around and make plays.
The DBs will all benefit whoever is back there….well not whoever, but you know…
those big plays for TDs in the playoffs weren’t given up due to lack of pass rush. they were given up because of lack off communication in the secondary (mistakes by Goldson, Whitner and Brown) and in Culliver’s case a lack of comfort or ability playing his man deep and alone (with no help over top).
giving up 10 – 15 yard passes consistently is the fault of a lack of production from the pass rush. giving up 20+ yard passes for Touchdowns is a problem in the secondary. Bottom line the Safeties shouldn’t let anything get behind them.
If that wr is Julio Jones its easier said than done to not let him get behind you. Whitner been using that lame excuse that it was a miscommunication. Why is Whitner always involved in miscommunication break downs. I believe Culliver it was Whitner who should of been over the top on Jacoby Jones td. Goldson and Culliver would of benefited if we had a better coverage safety than Whitner. As for the lack of pass rush…. I blame the defensive playcalling. Way too vanilla and not enough blitzes. He should of seen that the entire defensive line was not getting pressure and should of mixed it up by bringing in fresh guys and zone blitzes.
Goldson and Brown had miscommunications too.
something was up with the secondary from a coaching standpoint from the Patriots game on. I know that Aldon and Justin Smith had injuries that effected the pass rush. But there seemed to be far more frequent misscommunications in the secondary than before the Pats game.
and yes, Whitner always seemed lost as a WR went by him or ran a route behind him in the endzone.
There were definitely some breakdowns in coverage, but there were quite a few times against Atlanta and Baltimore where Ryan and Flacco seemed like they were back there flipping pancakes. They would just drop back and my internal “time to get rid of the ball” clock would go off and they would still be standing there, calmly surveying the field for a target. Our two best defensive linemen had bad wings and the secondary played it’s crappiest football at the wrong time.
Now, we must take into consideration that both Aldon and Justin Smith were not 100% healthy.
It was a rare sight watching Ryan and Flacco standing in the pocket as if waiting at a bus stop.
I give Aldon and Justin a great deal of credit for even being on the field during the playoffs.
There health issues may have had a a lot to do with our DB’ being picked on.
Somehow I feel that the Org has considered this as well.
completed mid and deep passes are the fault of the pass rush.
completed passes for touchdowns is the fault of the secondary.
if a receiver makes a catch for 20 yards, that sucks, but tackle him for no further gain.
deep zone coverage…bottom line you don’t let receivers get by you
To an extent, but if the QB has all day to sit in the pocket, somebody is going to get open. I agree about the TD thing, but they were generating very little pass rush, which allowed the big plays in the first place. The coaching staff deserves some blame for not implementing the necessary adjustments to compensate for the injured players on the defensive line.
I wonder what the Dolphins would want for Davone Bess? 2013 is Bess’ contract year and with the Dolphins re-signing Hartline as well as signing Wallace and Gibson, Bess is expendabe.
I’ve always been a big fan of Bess – I wanted the 49ers to draft him in 2008. He’s a great slot WR – one of the best in the NFL in my opinion. He can also return punts. He’s a little slow in a straight line, but has exceptional quickness and reliable hands.
This would go against my desire to give Jenkins a chance, but Bess could replace Kyle Williams on the roster with Jenkins #4, subbing in for Boldin as needed. With concern over how Williams will return following knee surgery, replacing him with a WR with proven production in the slot and can also return punts makes some sense, if it comes at a minimal compensation.
after last years miserable draft and fa ( Brandon jackobs, aj jenkins, looney et al) i really would liek to see Baalke walk on water like everyoen is spousing. Funny how almost the same team won games after Harbaugh became HC , NOT because Baalke did magic. We need pass defense badly and the safety issue was a problem last year and this year remains unaddressed. We seriously are not contending with Seattle with our pass defense the way it is ( see miserable play after first half of NE game) Rogers at cb, Dahl and whitner at safteys? Give me abreak, NY Giants didnt beat Brady twice in SB with their run defense. Maybe they need to watch the film on Bill Walsh between 1980 and 1981. ( Lott williamson wright and dean)
Great article and wide range of comments. Simple observation is that Cully has intriguing skills, even at safety, but he must get his head right. Probably been holding him back all along. I’m not talking about the bashing, except as a distraction, it’s more about his being clueless on reads. This is disturbing for a proposed safety. He needs to mature or his skills count for naught.
Secondly I suspect the 9er draft board is fluid as hell, especially at DB. Asomugha is the kicker. If he comes there is a ripple down including Rogers. If he doesn’t then the draft gets more focus on DBs and less on DT where it belongs.
Culliver had a bad superbowl, but the kid is one of the best CB’s in football – he’s not moving. He’ll have a huge season next year. Corners make more money, Culliver will fight the change.
At #34, the 49ers take S Jonathan Cyprien — while he’s listed as a SS, the scouts say he was interchangeable at FS. (I won’t pretend to claim I was watching Florida International games). Total playmaker … big-hitter … the all time leading tackler at FI. He’s essentially a younger and cheaper Goldson, with better collegiate numbers.
John Boyett, Oregon Ducks.
http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?feature=youtu.be&v=vUGGfyAXTzo&desktop_uri=%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DvUGGfyAXTzo%26feature%3Dyoutu.be
As far as Culliver, his play in the Superbowl has soured me on him. That play where Jacoby Jones caught the ball over him and he neither had the where with all to touch him down or even lay a hand on him as he danced around him into the endzone, still gives me an ongoing stomach flu. I really like Tyran Mathieu, he’s a baller. He’d be a great guy in the slot. There needs to be a change up in the defensive backfield otherwise everyone will be bombing the niners. Replace Whitner too. I want pass rushers too. Put Bowman and Willis on blitz alot more. I want CLOSERS not weiners!
There’s been a lot of talk of moving Culliver to FS to replace Goldson because he played safety in college for two seasons before being converted to CB his senior year. And though that transition supposedly took place because he was considered a liability against the run and struggled diagnosing plays as a FS, that seems something only a few have mentioned.
Is this a knock on Culliver? Not necessarily – at least not as a CB, which I think is his best position as an NFL player. Though a lot of fans have knocked his abilities as a CB, especially after a terrible SB, what he did during the season does not bear that out. I’m going to post a link to PFF that may surprise many of you. Look who is ranked #1 under the topic, “The Shutdown Crew.”
https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2013/01/28/signature-stats-first-downs-allowed-cornerbacks/
Now take a look at his YPCS (yards per coverage snap) where he is ranked #12 in the Top 15:
https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2013/01/31/signature-stats-ypcs-cornerbacks/
Yea, all this talk of him being moved to FS is gobble gobble jive. If I had to place a wage on the starting FS as of right now, I’d place a bet on Spillman.
I’m sure Spillman is going to get a chance to compete for the FS spot this season with Dahl even if they draft another.
*wager*
Safety of the future: Eric Reid, Matt Elam, Cyprien, Vaccaro- It all depend on Baalke and Harbaugh.
If they grade them equal then perhaps they trade down in with the #34 pick in the draft, or they trade up with number #31, if they start flying off the board.
I do think they may also take a shot at a safety with a mid rounder to late round pick. A big athletic safety like TJ McDonald. A faster ball hawking safety like Duke Williams or an undersized athletic freak like Shamarko Thomas.
Personally, I like:
Cyprien- just based on the reviews, his size and the fact that he played in the South East where the 49ers tend to look for players and…
TJ McDonald due to his bloodlines (father Tim was on the 49ers), size and the 3rd time should be a charm for USC safeties, the last two Talor Mays and Darnell Bing were busts.
Based on the number of safety’s that the Niner’s interviewed, I’d say the safety of the future hasn’t been drafted yet.
I did some research today on S…and came up with four who have both SS & FS experience in college. They are: Matt Elam, Eric Reid, DJ Swearinger & Phillip Thomas. After reviewing Walter’s Football draft rankings and NFL.com’s draft profiles, I think either Elam or P. Thomas would be good candidates to compete for the FS job. Elam’s an excellent all-around playmaker…a little short for FS (I’ve read anywhere from 5-8 to 5-10). Thomas is @ 6 ft…the thing I like about him is his warrior mentality…he suffered a broken leg and dislocated ankle his jr season, but came back exceptionally strong and led the nation w/8 picks as a senior. Raw speed can be deceiving…for a FS it’s as much about the angles you take as flat out speed. It’s also about keeping receivers from getting behind you. I think either guy would be excellent draft picks.