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  1. Grant, I just don’t see Lynch going top six. The only way I see that happening is if the Eagles are spooked into trading up to 5 or 6 because they think the 49ers love Lynch.

    If Goff and Wentz go top 6 it would mean one of the Fab Five (Tunsil, Jack, Ramsey, Buckner, Bosa) would be at 7. I’d take that!

    In the unlikely event Goff+Wentz+Lynch go top six it would mean two of the fab five would drop to 7. I’d love it, but I don’t see it happening.

      1. If Balke was worth his weight, Harbaugh would be going to the Super Bowl this year! He supported Kapernicks, atheletic ability, however truth be told he had to cut the play book in half. Harbaugh never threw Kap under the bus even though he knew he was an idiot.

        1. Niners are hard to watch however best proof of inept professional coaches (similar to congress, on the take) is the a special teams coach and offensive scheme coach proved to staff that (Jamarcus Russell, Oakland Raider) was a non committed player. This is after a year of coaching him and seeing his ethics. As mentioned an offensive coach asked Jamarcus to review a CD with some new offensive schemes for the next season. When asked two weeks later, he commented, ” It looks great”!
          The CD was blank. Not hard to to tell who will work hard with pride and attitude, but loyally to guys around you is a must.

          1. Kap has already dissed the players around him. He has a rep. and is not smart enough to shake it!. Let him go elsewhere.

      1. Baalke is great at his job!!!!!!!!!!
        You see, his job is to insulate jedork from the angry fans. If we weren’t crying about Baalke’s horrible picks……we’d all be crying for dork’s head!

  2. I agree the Rams have in all likelihood made themselves weaker long term by making this trade. Not yet sure whether its good news on the 2016 draft front for the 49ers. I keep seeing mock drafts linking the 49ers to Goff (and after last years mocks accurately predicting Armstead I’m not willing to bet against them), but I also keep reading the 49ers aren’t enamoured with this QB class (which I want to believe, because I wholeheartedly agree).

    If they really want a QB, which given what they have on the roster they should, missing out on Goff or Wentz can definitely be considered a bad thing… or not if you believe what some experts say about the ‘gap’ between Goff/Wentz and Connor Cook.

    My opinion is, and has been for a long time, that Goff isn’t worth a top 10 pick, Wentz should be a mid 1st to early 2nd round pick, and Cook should be a late 1st to 2nd round pick. After that, no QBs should be drafted before the 3rd round (and personally I would take Hogan and Prescott before Lynch). So if this move means the 49ers have to wait to draft a QB, and can focus on other positions of greater value, then that is a good thing. However, it also means they are getting a lesser talent at QB, which is a bad thing.

    Long term, I am leaning towards looking to 2017 for the answer at QB. This is a rebuilding team anyway. They aren’t about to turn it all around in one season. Get some of the other pieces in place this year, and try and get some extra draft picks in trades as ammunition for drafting the QB of the future next year.

    1. Just a reminder: Yoralke had the last 5 years to rebuild this team, drafting for the future when they were good. The same people are making the decisions.

      1. Actually, Scott McCloughan assembled a lot of that talent when he was the GM. Now that he’s with the Redskins, watch them rise.

      2. “Yoralke had the last 5 years to rebuild this team, drafting for the future when they were good”

        I have no idea what that means.

        The only draft class which could have been labeled for the “future” was the horrific 2012 draft, and I am sure Trent Baalke would love to have his 2012 draft over again. However, the 49ers 2012 roster was absolutely bulletproof, and loaded with talent. It’s not a leap of faith to believe Baalke probably out-smarted himself during that draft, trying to find players who could stick on such a deep roster. It’s fair to assume Trent made some “unconventional” picks based on the depth already on the roster, and would likely have drafted differently under different circumstances.

        There is no question that the 2012 draft class was a straight up BUST, from top to bottom! And that draft class certainly had a negative impact, but it wasn’t nearly the type of setback it could have been if the team didn’t already have one of the most talented rosters in the league going into the draft.

        And let’s face the facts ……. it’s tougher to build a roster through the draft when you are picking near the bottom of every single round.

        Grading draft classes is not an easy process, and it can also be a bit subjective. However, based on the following criteria, Trent Baalke has actually been one of the best drafters in the NFL during his tenure:

        – How many games the picks played
        – Pro Bowl appearances
        – First-team All-Pro selections and awards won
        – As well as factoring in how much the team has won during this period, since players tend to play quicker for worse teams.

        Here are the rankings from the best to the worst from 2010-2014 (I haven’t included the 2015 draft class because it’s simply too soon to evaluate)

        1. Seahawks

        GM: John Schneider
        Average position of 1st pick: 30.6
        Total picks: 48
        Pro Bowlers: 7
        Best Pick: CB Richard Sherman — 2011 5th round
        Worst Pick: G John Moffitt — 2011 3rd round

        Seattle is the gold standard for drafting in the NFL right now. The 2010 draft netted Earl Thomas, Kam Chancellor, Russell Okung and Golden Tate, laying the foundation for their 2013 Super Bowl team. Chancellor and Sherman were 5th-round picks, and they landed QB Russell Wilson in the 3rd round.

        2. 49ers

        GM: Trent Baalke
        Average position of 1st pick: 19.2
        Total picks: 48
        Pro Bowlers: 4
        Best Pick: LB NaVorro Bowman — 2010 3rd round
        Worst Pick: WR A.J. Jenkins — 2012 1st round (what an absolute B.U.S.T.)

        There may have been dysfunction inside the 49ers in recent years, but it did not stop them from finding some good players. The 2010 draft was their best, with Mike Iupati and Anthony Davis in the 1st round and NaVorro Bowman in the 3rd. Although Trent Baalke wasn’t the GM in 2010 (he was Vice-President of Player Personnel), he was in charge of the 2010 draft because McClaughan had already left for the Seahawks.

        3. Texans
        4. Patriots
        5. Rams
        6. Broncos
        7. Steelers
        8. Eagles
        9. Bills
        10. Vikings
        11. Cardinals
        12. Chiefs
        13. Browns
        14. Packers
        15. Bengals
        16. Dolphins
        17. Panthers
        18. Cowboys
        19. Bucs
        20. Titans
        21. Falcons
        22. Redskins
        23. Giants
        24. Chargers
        25. Ravens
        26. Lions
        27. Colts
        28. Jets
        29. Saints
        30. Bears
        31. Redskins
        32. Jags

        I could go through each and every pick that was drafted during 2010-2015 period, and show everyone why Trent grades out above average. With that said, it’s 2016, and Trent Baalke is sitting on a bonanza of draft picks. And based on the fact that Chip Kelly is now the 49ers HC, this 2016 draft is likely going to be the draft that defines Trent Baalke moving forward. He was always going to have to reshape this roster to some extent anyways, in order to fit Chip’s systems.

        And, if you are willing to toss out the 2012 draft (and I am) based on some of the factors I have covered, you ought to be excited about this years draft, coming up in a couple weeks. The NFL draft is not an exact science, and you can always find reasons to criticise. However, it’s easy to find reasons to defend Trent Baalke’s record as well. And no matter what you think about Trent’s ability to identify and draft talented players, it’s impossible to argue against his ability to acquire extra picks.

        Bottom line: If you are a true 49ers fan, you should have no problem looking forward, and stop looking back. With Chip Kelly as Head Coach, exciting times are ahead of us. And I for one, feel real good about this upcoming draft.

        1. I honestly don’t understand the level of criticism for the former Executive Of The Year, Trent Baalke.

          It’s difficult to sustain a championship caliber roster, the way the league is structured, when you spend 3 straight years at the top of your conference. Take a look at Baltimore. I don’t hear near the level of criticism for Ozzie Newsome, and Trent Baalke has done a far better job than Ozzie has during this period, including robbing him blind on the Anquan Boldin trade.

          How about those Rams? They received an absolute motherload of picks that fell into their lap with the RG3 trade. Not only have they failed to even build a .500 roster with all those picks, now they just gave all those picks away to Tennessee for a #1 pick and apparently a QB whom they (allegedly) haven’t even decided on.

        2. Bowman doesn’t count as a Baalke pick because he went into the 2010 draft with Scot McCloughan’s draft blueprint.

        3. I don’t buy it. Problem #1: 2010 was a weird scenario were you had SM, TB and Sing all influencing picks. Its impossible to say who gets credit for Bowman vs who gets the blame for Taylor Mays.
          Even if you give TB the credit for Bowman……the AJJ pick is so bad…..the 2 cancel each other out!
          My biggest problem with the 2010 draft…… We took Iupati and AD, nirhter of wich is currently on our roster…….over Dez Bryant and Earl Thomas! I know, its almost not fair to use “hindsight” but we are! And many of you will say ” we neededthose O-linemen”! but you just cannot whiff like that with 2 picks in the top half of the 1st round!!! It dosent help that neither are on the team , but even if they were, 2 good players vs 2 GREAT players!
          2011………Aldon Smith!! Instead of some guy named JJ Watt!!!!!!! point, match!

          Another issue I have with TB is that hed rather let his own free agents walk, and the have to “re-draft” the position! It reminds me of the Chargers GM.
          The Chargers were the best team to NOT go to a SB inn the early 2000’s.
          I remember they would go the cheap route, not resign their own guys…..and have to use draft picks to replace them. In turn they never ADDED talent. They REPLACED it. This formula dosent work and should only be used by teams with $$$ issues.

          1. jrs,

            That’s so silly. Were you complaining about A Smith when he was averaging a sack per game? If not, then what are you talking about?

            Also, if you want to play the “Gotcha” game, by picking the best player after every pick a given GM makes, and use that as the standard for judging if a GM is any good, 31 out of 32 GM’s will look bad in any given round.

        4. The 2010 draft board was still McCloughan’s. Even though Baalke was newly appointed he had no time to scout. The niners used McCloughan’s cheatsheet to make those picks where they did.

            1. It’s true. Baalke didn’t have enough time to put together a draft board of his own due to the timing of McCloughan’s ouster.

        5. The 2011 draft was great:
          Aldon Smith 7; Kaepernick 36; Culliver 80; Kendall Hunter 116; Kilgore 133; and Bruce Miller 211 .

          But the last three years’ number one choices are not great: Eric Reid, #18 (2013); Jimmy Ward, #30 (2014); and Arik Armstead, #17 (2015).

          Ward and Armstead will be better in 2016, and Reid has something to prove. But its time.

          Jaquiski Tartt pick #46, Eli Harold 79 , Blake Bell 117, Mike Davis 126, Anthony Smelter 132, and Trent Brown 244 …may wind up being a really good 2015 draft class.

          Last year was a S*** Show, on the field; but Armstead, Tartt, and Harold are poised to make some noise in 2016, and Tartt is a lock to be really good. Brown can start at guard, and Davis may be smashing the right side. Smelter we haven’t seen yet.

        6. If the 2010 draft of Davis and Iupati was his best, it should be noted that neither player played for the 49ers in 2015…and those were two of his three earliest picks. Nor did Aldon Smith. It may come to pass that Kaepernick is soon gone. Baalke can barely tolerate his own picks…and it cannot be argued its because of the salary cap. His first five 2nd round picks were Taylor Mays, LaMichael James, Vance McDonald, Tank Carradine and Colin Kaepernick. Tartt and Hyde are all that keeps the second round from being his bane. His third round pick include Navarro Bowman, and that great, but after that: Chris Culliver, Corey Lemonier, Marcus Martin, Brandon Thomas, Chris Borland and Eli Harold. His second day picks are barely a 50/50 proposition to contribute, let alone be part of the future.

        7. Looking forward to what jed ripping off fans on everyting possable including a respectfull organization. Not one of our players should good about the management and ownership of this team. Jed York is a Seahwawks fan that took my 9ers out of Frisco and turned them into the Santa Clara 4 and 9 ers

    2. Scooter

      I’m 100% with your post…..(maybe 99)…especially your last paragraph…too many on here are concerning themselves with SB this next year…ridiculous ! Use this years draft and free agency to fill in the holes that we know that we have, and back them up with depth. Talk about QB’s in the late rounds and for next season

      Good Post

      1. Bz

        Right…we can’t win without a QB…but I believe that with Blaine Gabbert, we DO have one….and Dylan Thompson gives us a quality backup with a year of ‘bench-time’ behind Blaine and Kap…Open to discussion, but there aren’t many Brady’s around, and IMHO we are SOOOO much better off than so many other teams.

    3. I think you nailed it scooter. Talking with my buddy at work today and we agreed that we could be picking 1 or 2 next year after looking at the schedule.
      He brought it up to counter my disappointment of being “out” of the Wentz/Goff sweepstakes this year.
      He loves the idea of swapping 1st rounders with the jets for Mo Wilerson

  3. Grant – Excellent assessment because Baalke now may be forced to take a top talent based upon the empirical draft grade rather than a personal favorite that is biased by need or pure infatuation. Niners should get a “pro bowl” player at #7 w/o a doubt. If they don’t, it’s another indictment of Baalke’s failures to engineer a successful draft.

  4. Can anyone remember one of these blockbuster trades that worked out for the team who gave up the picks? The trades that come to mind are Hershel Walker, Rickey Williams and RG III and Minn the saints and Wash certainly didnt benefit from those trades.

    1. It worked for Denver when they traded up to take Elway. I’d have to look at some other examples to see if there is anything else but the Herschel and Ricky trades aren’t comparable as those trades were for RB’s. A few of us were discussing the RGIII trade yesterday, but that is the only similar one I could think of recently.

      What it comes down to is whether the guy you draft becomes a great QB. If he does, then it mitigates what you gave up. If he doesn’t, then not only have you made the error in the player you took but you also gave up a Kings ransom to do so.

      It’s a gamble no doubt about it, but if you really feel strongly that the player is going to be the missing piece for you, then roll the dice.

      1. I can’t remember what the Broncos gave up for Elway but I imagine it was less than those other trades because Elway held the Colts hostage he threatened that he would play baseball and not sign with the colts.

    2. The giants traded up for eli manning and that worked out well. And in 97, the rams traded up for Orlando pace.

      1. Didn’t the Giants only have to give up their second round pick to move from 5 to 1, so they didn’t pay that much to move up.

        Also, if I remember, the Chargers ended up with Ladainian Tomlinson and Drew Brees. I’d much rather have the Chargers end of that draft. Eli Manning isn’t elite, and the Giants won Super Bowls in spite of his QBing skills, as much as because of them.

        1. Ex,

          The Giants traded Rivers and a third, along with a first and fifth the following season. You are mixing up different draft years in regards to Brees/Tomlinson. That happend a few years prior to the Manning deal and was a trade with Atlanta.

          Say what you will about Manning but he’s won two SB’s and he had a lot to do with them winning especially in the second win over the Pats.

          1. The second super bowl win required “Elite Eli” to complete a pass that is perhaps the luckiest of all time (especially if you look at the play as a whole).

            He’s a solid starting NFL, who sometimes shows clutch play, and that’s it. If not for playing in New York, there’s a good chance he wouldn’t even get into the HOF.

            Look at his numbers in the NFCCG against the niners. They were putrid. That’s with two balls thrown directly to 49er defenders that weren’t intercepted and a TD pass that was open only because Goldson knocked Brock out of the game, requiring Brown to enter the game a few plays before.

            Finally, look at his career numbers. They’re simply underwhelming.

            1. My point in the second paragraph was, even with two super bowl wins, Eli Manning might not get into the HOF, because of his pedestrian stats, if he had played somewhere other than NY.

    3. Elway but I imagine it was less than those other trades because Elway held the Colts hostage he threatened that he would play baseball and not sign with the colts.

    4. The LA Rams kind of set the NFL standard when they traded 9 players for Ollie Matson in 1959. Matson was very good but the Rams went from being a contender to a loser until 1967. The Rams record during the period was 33-71. So now that they’re back in LA, why not start off with something equally stupid.

  5. Truly flawed article in so many ways, not the least of which is you saying Lynch is a second round pick literally a week or so after raving about the guy and mocking him to the Niners at #7.

    The Rams likely took away the player the Niners wanted to take. There were rumors that the Niners were one of the teams looking to trade up and that was likely to take a QB. Now they likely won’t get that opportunity, at least where the top two are concerned.

    The Rams were actually in pretty good position to make a trade like this due to all of the extra picks they got from Washington and a second they got from Philly. They are giving up a lot, but they’ve made a lot of picks the past few years and likely feel the only thing they are missing is a QB.

    It didn’t work out for Washington, that is true, but it wasn’t because of what they gave up. It was because the guy they traded up for didn’t work out. In year one it looked like Washington made a brilliant trade as RGIII was fantastic and led them to the playoffs. Once he shredded his knee it was downhill. However, the Redskins made the playoffs last year, even after giving up all those picks because the other QB they took in that draft, did work out. That is how valuable the QB position is and why teams are willing to give up a ransom if they think they can get a great one.

    The Rams have a good defense, they’ve got some weapons to throw too and a dominant running game. What they lack is a QB. If they hit this right, they likely have set themselves up to be a playoff contender very quickly.

    1. I said I thought the Niners would take Lynch at 7, not that they should. Sorry your Goff fantasy won’t come true.

      1. You compared him to Cam Newton and agreed with other comparisons to Roethlisberger and Flacco. You were talking the guy up throughout that topic thread.

        1. I called him Cam Newton without the speed, and then compared him to Derek Carr, who was a second-rounder.

            1. He would be, but he was no sure thing coming out of college. Lynch is the same way. Both guys played in spread offenses. You just don’t know how they’ll adjust to the NFL.

              1. If you’re comparing a potential draftee to a current NFL player, aren’t you comparing the college player to the the NFL player as we know that player to be now, not as they were in college?

                If I compare a college QB to Tom Brady, I’m comparing that QB to Tom Brady the All Pro, future HOF NFL QB, not the after thought, sometime college starter, almost UDFA college QB who was a sixth round pick.

              2. Why would you ever compare a college quarterback to someone who is 38? You have to compare prospects to quarterbacks when they were the same age.

              3. I should’ve used the word “project” rather than “compare”. It seems to me that if you say Lynch, is this draft’s D Carr, you’re projecting Lynch to have similar skill as D Carr after similar amount of experience / training.

              4. Neither was a sure thing coming out of college. Both are mobile, strong-armed spread quarterbacks who played poorly in their final bowl games.

              5. And if that’s what you believe Lynch to be, then he should be drafted fairly early in the first round, right?

              6. I get what you’re saying, Grant, but you’re drawing a relationship between Lynch and Carr with the knowledge of what Carr has done in the NFL.

              7. Carr’s stock sunk after his bowl game just like Lynch’s stock sunk after his bowl game. Lynch will be a high second-round pick like Carr was. Both had similar strengths and knocks coming out of school. It’s not the worst comparison. And I’m not saying Lynch will be as good as Carr. Just saying they’re similar prospects. Neither was a sure thing.

              8. It would be great if Dallas leapfrogged Denver to take a quarterback. Anything to deplete the supply and increase demand for Kaepernick.

              9. I’m not questioning the comparison, just saying if you think Lynch = Carr, then Lynch = 1st round pick.

          1. Rocket,

            If the Rams had hit on the picks they got from Washington, then maybe you could make that argument. The truth is, they didn’t do much with those picks.

            1. Ex,

              They wound up with some cornerstone players from that trade with the Skins:

              Michael Brockers
              Janoris Jenkins
              Greg Robinson
              Alec Ogletree

              All these guys were acquired with Washington picks.

              The Rams rightly or wrongly feel they have a team that can be a playoff contender if they can land a QB. The fact they have consistently been a 7-8 win team with a myriad of average to below average QB’s, I think they might be right.

              1. Rocket,

                I guess beauty is in the eye of the beholder. IMO, the Rams chunked the opportunity to set themselves up, as you claim they actually did.

                None of the players the Rams drafted with the picks received from Washington are what I would call cornerstone players. IMO, for a player to be called a cornerstone player, he needs to be at least a potential All Pro candidate.

                Ogletree is a solid LB, and may ultimately play at a cornerstone level, but he has yet to get there.

                PFF called Jenkins the fourth best FA CB this year (of course, JJ ultimately resigned with the Rams), behind Adam Jones!! I’m not saying JJ is terrible, but he’s not my idea of a cornerstone player, either.

                Brockers ended up on a “most overrated list” after 2014. Again, I’m not saying he’s terrible, just that he’s not what I would term a cornerstone player.

                On top of that, they completely blew the 2014 number two pick of the draft with the Greg Robinson pick. PFF quote: “another season like 2015 and Robinson will be well on his way to bust status”. On the 28th ranked O line (one spot behind the 49ers, btw), he was tagged as one of the “duds”. That’s not good, so maybe he doesn’t belong on your cornerstone list.

                So, Rocket, I don’t really understand how you arrived at the conclusion that the Rams set themselves up with the picks from Washington.

              2. Additionally, as long as Jeff Fisher is the HC of the Rams, they will never realize their full potential. If you look up the word “mediocre” in Webster’s, you’ll see Fisher’s picture. He’s so incredibly average, it makes me nuts that he’s so revered.

              3. I don’t see it. The Rams still have too many holes IMO, and both of these 2 QB’s will need time to develop.

                The Rams OL is below average. They don’t have a #1 WR. Their DB’s are average as well.

                Do the Rams make the playoffs in the next couple years? Maybe, but I don’t think they will be a threat to go deep into the postseason.

            2. Ex,

              You said if the Rams had hit on the picks then there was an argument to be made. Those 4 players were starters for them. You may not think much of them, but that remains to be seen. What it likely boils down to is that the Rams believe they have drafted enough players and built up a good enough team that a QB will take them to the next level. I guess we are going to find out.

              1. Rocket,

                If the 49ers ever had that raft of picks and came up with such a meager group of players, I don’t think you would be happy, at all.

                If you want to call drafting a collection of middling NFL starters, “hitting on their picks”, then fair enough. That doesn’t work for me.

                I just don’t call the “haul” of players the Rams came up with “hitting” on those picks. The Rams had a bounty of high picks (including the number two overall pick in 2014) and none of the players have shown themselves to be premium NFL talent.

                BTW, you were the one who called them “cornerstone players”, if I’m not mistaken. Since you didn’t address that, can I assume you would like to walk that claim back?

                If not, can you please provide your definition of a “cornerstone player”? All the better to understand what you’re trying to say about these players.

              2. Ex,

                If the 49ers ever had that raft of picks and came up with such a meager group of players, I don’t think you would be happy, at all.

                Brockers is part of one of the best Dlines in football. Ogletree is their starting MLB and an ascending player. Robinson has struggled, but he is still very young and was played out of position to start his career. Jenkins was good enough to warrant a huge deal in FA from the Giants. I’d be happy if the Niners wound up with 4 starters with extra picks acquired in trade. This is just the extra picks they received from Washington don’t forget. They also had their own and made some good picks with those too. Their 2014 draft especially is looking very good.

                If you want to call drafting a collection of middling NFL starters, “hitting on their picks”, then fair enough. That doesn’t work for me.

                If you get starting caliber players you are doing well. To expect impact players is overlooking the realities of the draft.

                I just don’t call the “haul” of players the Rams came up with “hitting” on those picks. The Rams had a bounty of high picks (including the number two overall pick in 2014) and none of the players have shown themselves to be premium NFL talent.

                I disagree. Brockers is very talented and so is Ogletree. Robinson was dominant in College but has started slow. We’ll see what happens, but he is a big time talent.

                BTW, you were the one who called them “cornerstone players”, if I’m not mistaken. Since you didn’t address that, can I assume you would like to walk that claim back?

                Not at all. These players are starters that are part of the core foundation of talent the Rams have put together. They are a pretty young team overall. They obviously need Robinson to step up more than he has, but their other first rounders and even second rounders in the two years they had the extra picks have all paid off pretty well.

                Aaron Donald
                Tavon Austin
                Alec Ogletree
                LeMarcus Joyner
                Tre Mason

                I understand you are underwhelmed by the players they got, but I’m not. If you get this many starters from the extra picks, I think you’ve done pretty well.

              3. Rocket,

                “Brockers is part of one of the best Dlines in football.”

                Again, I never said Brockers isn’t a good player, just that he’s not a “cornerstone player”. Donald and Quinn are cornerstones, not Brockers.

                “Ogletree is their starting MLB and an ascending player.”

                How many starting MLB’s are there in the NFL? What kind of threshold is that? I agree, he’s an improving player, but since he’s been in the league three years, I’m wondering how much upside he really has. My guess is, not much. It seems to me that MLB’s realize most of their potential fairly quickly. Even if he does ultimately become a cornerstone type player, my point is, he’s not there yet (which you claimed he is, btw).

                “Robinson has struggled, but he is still very young and was played out of position to start his career.”

                Right, but this doesn’t sound like the description of a player that is a “cornerstone” of a team. It sounds more like a stop on the way to admitting the guy is a disappointment.

                “Jenkins was good enough to warrant a huge deal in FA from the Giants.”

                Another low threshold for a “cornerstone player”. Lots of teams waste lots of money on players that turn out to not be that good, when taken out of the context of their current team. Maybe much of JJ’s value as a CB is linked to playing behind that great DL you mentioned above.

                JJ has made a number of plays, but he has given up a significant number of big plays, as well. He’s best suited as a really good number two CB, and he’s also not a cornerstone player, IMO.

                “I’d be happy if the Niners wound up with 4 starters with extra picks acquired in trade.”

                Let’s not gloss over which picks we’re talking about, here. This was an incredible wealth of premium picks, including the overall number two pick in the 2014 draft. To not get a single stud out of that group is simply a disappointment.

                “If you get starting caliber players you are doing well. To expect impact players is overlooking the realities of the draft.”

                Come on, Rocket, I was one of the first to bring the idea that the draft is something of a crap shoot to this blog.

                I never said the Rams should’ve landed a cornerstone player with each of those picks, but they didn’t come up with a single one.

                What I love about what the Rams did with those picks is that there’s not a single true impact player among them.

                “I understand you are underwhelmed by the players they got, but I’m not. If you get this many starters from the extra picks, I think you’ve done pretty well.”

                This idea of “extra picks” is a strange one to me. The Rams gave up something for those picks. You seem to feel that the expectation for the return on those “extra picks” is less than non-extra picks. I’m getting that from your mentioning that you’d be happy with “that many starters from the extra picks”.

                I’m not saying the Rams completely spit the bit on these picks, but, IMO, they didn’t “set themselves up for the future” either.

          2. You compared Lynch to multiple QB’s:

            I’m starting to see people mock Lynch to the Eagles at No. 8.

            Roethlisberger seems like a good comparison.

            In terms of build and arm talent, Lynch reminds me of Cam Newton.

            Flacco is a decent comparison, but Lynch is more athletic and more experienced running the ball.

            Lynch has terrific touch and ball placement on deep throws. Kaepernick doesn’t.

            He always was a top-10 pick. Media draft experts overreacted to the bowl game.

            He is the most physically-gifted quarterback in the draft. Won’t be the top QB on a lot of teams’ boards because he played in a shotgun spread offense and needs to learn how to operate from undercenter and see the whole field, but that’s less of an issue on a team like the Niners.

            These all came from one topic thread. On the next one you compared him to Bortles. Then you listed him at #5 on your Niner Big Board. You contradict yourself so often it’s got to be hard to keep track, but this was a little more than a week ago.

            This is why it is an exercise in futility to have a discussion with you sometimes. You are wishy washy and change your mind almost daily.

            1. Lynch is the most talented quarterback in the draft, but he isn’t a sure thing. None of these quarterbacks should be first-round picks, but as long as they’re going in the top 10, Lynch should be the first one taken. That’s why I settled on Derek Carr as the best comparison for Lynch. Second-round pick who ended up being the best QB in his class. You conveniently missed those comments from me.

              1. I didn’t miss them. I was showing all the quotes you made in regards to Lynch being the best QB in this class and saying he was a top ten prospect all along. The Derek Carr comparison was just another log on the fire. You wound up comparing the guy to a half dozen QB’s including JaMarcus Russell of all people.

              2. Physically, Lynch and Russell have a lot in common. If you don’t like my comments, don’t read them. I sure don’t read yours’.

  6. it benefits the 49ers becasue Baalke would have chosen a qb and the 49ers would have Alex smith /kap him into a worthless career. this will force them to trade down and get a lb ( he’s a tuna man and at least knows how to draft lbs… maybe smith because he’s broken?) ol and some safeties with cook or some other low level qb to act like they know something. won’t work and we will draft high next year which is potentially a much better qb year. baalke by trading down will make Jed happy as he won’t have to spend as much on the first rounder and trade Kap off so that Jed won’t miss out on the 13 million dollars of bottled water he would lose with Kap on the bench. as usual its a win win for the Yorks, not so much for winning , the fans for nfl football.

    1. The thing that infuriates me about Baalke is that, while he is a tuna man, he is neither A.) as good at it as Parcells, and B.) Parcells had a HOF quarterback!!!!!!!!!
      That, and the fact that he does whatever he can do to keep from hiring within the Walsh coaching tree.
      This reminds me of the Joe Thomas years………..

  7. This one seems like it was a chore for you to write, and you never really decided where to put your focus.

    The 49ers aren’t considering any QBs currently on other NFL teams, so the Foles commentary is nothing but a distraction. You never really say that you believe this trade catapults Lynch into the Top-6, but you warn that if they take him at 7 it would be a problem.

    Also, if the Rams take Wentz, the 49ers might face him for a couple of years before his star fades and he’s out of the league, which will be long before the decade you mentioned.

  8. I think the Browns like Goff. If the Rams take Goff, I think the Browns (try) to trade down.

    I wanted Goff. A silver lining to the Rams trade… it takes the air out of the (vindictive) Eagles threat to move up to 8 for a QB. If they do (and Wentz+Goff’s go top 2), all the better for the 49ers.

    And if the Eagles take Lynch at 6 or 8, that’s one less QB Denver can target.

    Dream scenario…
    – Goff, Wentz, Lynch go top 6.
    – Niners pick the 4th best non QB on their board.
    – Dallas trades back into the first for Cook, or NYJs take Cook.
    – With Cook and Lynch gone, Denver suddenly finds cap space for CK.

    1. To be clear… the Eagles traded up to 8 because they are targeting a player. “Vindictive” merely describes their mindset and suggests added motivation.

      1. Cook will be drafted early. Likely round 1, possibly at the top of round 2.

        He’s got a lot of talent, and he’ll prove to be a possitive influence in the locker room.

  9. Grant,

    The NFL is a passing league. Rule changes guaranteed that. I agree with your assessment, though, and believe Baalke is smart enough to work on his front seven.
    However, what you haven’t factored in is the $56 mil, Kap, Bethea, and OT–Davis, meaning the 49ers have amassed an arsenal of bargaining chips before the draft…Is it, possible, maybe even probable that Baalke uses some of the $56 mil. on the Jets, Wilkeerson, trade out of the 7th spot for Lawson to gain more picks, drafts Stanfords OT, Pete, and a QB mid round. The other picks could be spent on OL, and a middle linebacker.

    1. Good post.. I think the Rams take Goff and 50/50 the Browns will draft Wentz. If they get a deal like Tennessee I think they will trade their #2 grab the picks and go with a developmental QB, someone like Cardale Jones who many film junkies have rated second in this draft but getting no love due to his 2015 benching. The trade threw a wrench into the Kaepernick trade which as I understand it was contingent upon the Niners getting their QB in the draft, likely Goff or Wentz. With the feeding frenzy for Goff and Wentz I doubt Wentz will be there at #7 so I look for the Niners to go with the best player available at #7. And draft a couple of QB’s mid to late. Vernon Adams will be selected by Baalke, IMO.

  10. I’ve NEVER in my life see ANYONE, A TEAM, or damn ORGANIZATION so freaking SCARED to pull the trigger and pick up some damn decent Free Agents!!!…and who on EARTH….HAS over 60M and won’t utilize it to help assure yourself of a DECENT ROSTER!!!! Baalke, grow a sack and pick some damn players!!!

    1. That costs money. Baalke has his marching orders. Win, Lose or draw, York makes money. So why should he spend money? Old man York tought him well.

      1. The cap works both ways – it is the max teams can spend (as we all know) but also, it is REQUIRED that teams spend most of the cap figure — I think its something like 85% of it that they *must* spend (slightly complicated rules – something about averaging 85% over 5 years). Anyway, the point is that all the goof-ball loser “fans” that complain that the 49ers are ‘cheap’ and won’t spend the money are fools that don’t know the rules. All teams must spend. So, use your criticism on *how* they spend it, and stop wasting our time with posts about how they are cheap and won’t spend money!

        1. Correct.

          Jed York is a lot of things, but cheapskate isn’t one of them.

          I wish people would quit following like sheep, and actually open their eyes.

    2. They might have cap space but don’t forget they are paying a QB $12 mil. to hold a clip board and they are paying an ex head coach another $10 mil. to hang out in bowling alleys. Fans are thinking about the cap hit and Genius Jed is thinking about the bottom line hit.

      1. Why overpay for players, when you’re not ready to make a title run? If they judge Wilkerson to be a foundation piece (Justin Smith), then it might be a good idea to get involved.

        The only FA I really wish the 49ers had snagged is Osemele (but at the price the Raiders paid, I get why the 49ers passed).

        1. I agree with your comment Ex but it just seems that the 49ers attempt at signing any FAs was so underwhelming that there is something else going on. I think that’s keeps everyone returning to the topic.

              1. Fair enough, but just because they didn’t sign anyone doesn’t mean the 49ers weren’t involved.

            1. Whine

              remember….FA goes on after the draft…the reason that some good FA’s didn’t get picked up was that their price is too high…those prices usually come down after the draft….a lot of those FA’s are used up also….

              1. Excuse the double post, but I forgot to mention that after the draft, a lot of older polayers will be cut from their teams and so added to the FA pool….

  11. Baalke should send the Rams a thank you note. Most likely both Goff and Wentz will be gone by 7. This takes the pressure off Baalke to draft an offensive player. He now has an built-in excuse. He’ll draft a defensive player – hopefully Jack from UCLA.

    On another note, New England released Dominique Easley . Baalke might be intrigued. Easley, after all, has had past knee injuries.

  12. Lol…Nick you have a GREAT point there…Niners gravitate towards injuries, it must be a prerequisite!!!

  13. Future HOF players have made 32 starts during the last 25 Super Bowls. That is 78%. Hostetler subbed for the injured Phill Simms, another HOF, and played well. Mark Rypien played lights out during his one SB. Hasselbeck, McNabb, Gannon, Johnson, Bledsoe and Chandler all played at a very high level during those SB seasons and had multiple Pro Bowls between them. Grossman and Dilfer were the only QB’s that were truly terrible. Kaepernick was within one play of winning a SB.

    The bottom line: The league is designed for parity, unless you have a franchise QB. I’ve never understood the mindset of people who ignore these overwhelming stats. The Niners had the best talent for a 4-5 year period but failed to win a SB because they had Smith and Kaepernick. That is exactly why Harbaugh wanted Manning years ago. He knew he had a small window to WIN a SB.

    1. Excellent comment, BigP. I’m puzzled how much energy is spent in discussing which backup QBs Niners should draft when their needs begin with a franchise QB.

      Assuming Kap will be traded, if I was in a position of influence, I’d trade up to get either Goff or Wentz and then draft another QB like Hogan or Adams in the later rounds. By now Niners should know as much as they need to know about their #3 QB and he should be waived in the TC cuts since he’s not the answer.

      Niners can draft Buckner or Jack or some other decent player but it will not mean much until they find that franchise QB. Rams are in that position and they are taking a big risk. They may lose — but they are not winning by standing put.

      In today’s NFL, one can draft wisely for a decade without being able to set up at base camp (to paraphrase Bill Walsh) without a franchise QB. That’s why I support drafting at least one QB every draft until a team settles on a franchise QB. Also the team should hire a separate coach to work with the backup QBs on a regular basis so that the rookies grow into a NFL role.

      1. Mood,
        It’s nice that somebody else sees the value of investing in the most important position in professional sports. The Niners were a dynasty because of Montana and Young. I like the Rams’ decision to move up, it signals that they are trying to get to the next level. At least they are trying, as opposed to the delusional ‘you don’t need a franchise QB to win’ argument. A legit QB is the ultimate Band Aid. If there is a competition between QB’s in camp, you don’t have a legit QB.

          1. Young didn’t ride anybody’s coat tails. His career was phenomenal and self driven. Walsh and Montana benefitted from not having a salary cap or having to deal with true free agency. The cap was instituted because of the 49ers free spending habits. The one year the front office put together a dominant, pre-salary cap style roster was the year that Young won the Super Bowl, SB MVP and the MVP. He also passed for a record 6 TD passes in the SB, breaking Montana’s record.

            “Measure twice, cut once.”

            1. Big P,
              Nice to have you back along with your keen perspective bud.
              Btw, Steve Young was a star in college and even in the defunct old USFL. It was in Tampa Bay where he had to run for his life and lost his groove.

              Thank God for Bill Walsh. He knew that SY had talent but needed to be in the right system and environment to reclaim his flash.

              I didn’t like to see my hero Joe Montana move on to KC, but Steve Young was more then ready to take the helm.
              Steve Young was the league’s MVP, Superbowl MVP (6 TD passes are still the record), and won his share of league QB titles.

              Not bad for a player the rode Montana’ and Walsh’ coat tails (as Jonny Christo said).

        1. With the divergence of the pro and college offenses, it’s gotten even more difficult, if not impossible, to evaluate QBs in the draft with acceptable accuracy. Hence, the need for compensating with more draft picks at this make-or-break position (and then coaching them up) has only increased.

          1. I think that’s why the Niners went with Kelly to decrease that divergence. It actually could become a brilliant move IF it works.

    2. The Niners had the best talent for a 4-5 year period but failed to win a SB because they had Smith and Kaepernick.

      That is 100% inaccurate. The 49ers lost against the Giants because they had a subpar receiving corps, Williams screwed up on a PR at the worst possible time, and the refs blew a RB play dead despite the fact forward progress had not been stopped.
      The 49ers lost against the Ravens because of the hole they dug for themselves before the blackout. Kaepernick did flop in the minutes, but a championship caliber team should not need a blackout in order to win.
      Finally, the 2nd half of the matchup against the Seahawks is on Kaepernick, but it’s also a fact that we were still in that game because of him. Unfortunately, the team let the Seahawks win that game.

      1. Neither of them is a Champion QB. I believe that they would have won a championship with Manning at the helm. They had the most talented roster in the league for awhile. They had the perfect formula for winning without a great QB and they still fell short. Kaep was instrumental in their unsuccessful SB run, but he has also been instrumental in their decline. Smith was traded because he isn’t a Championship caliber QB. He hasn’t dispelled that notion since going to K.C. and the pitchforks are already out for him there. No team was even willing to trade for Kaepernick unless he accepted low end money because he isn’t viewed as a good QB, only a few years after taking the league by S7orm! I feel like you listed a bunch of paper cut excuses for not winning a SB. I feel like a legit QB is the ultimate Band Aid for those paper cuts. I provided stats in my earlier post that overwhelmingly support my stance. 78% of the SB QB’s from the last 25 Super Bowls are HOF players, with another 2 likely to eventually become HOF players. 100% inaccurate? Lmao! I love me some 49ers, but I’m real about the situation and I’m not going to make excuses for the teams failure/reluctance to draft and develop high end QB’s.

        1. I feel like you listed a bunch of paper cut excuses for not winning a SB.

          No, a paper cut excuse is blaming the lack of an elite QB as the reason we didn’t win the Super Bowl from 2011-2014. Difler was never an elite QB, yet he has a Super Bowl ring. Why? Because the entire team did their part to win one. Manning was one of the worst QBs in 2015, yet he went out on top because the the whole team did their part in order to win the Super Bowl. Blaming the QB is nothing but a cope out. Yes the QB is important, but this past Super Bowl and others have shown that it isn’t the deciding factor. If that were even close to true, then Dan Marino would have won at least one Super Bowl title.

          1. “Yes the QB is important, but this past Super Bowl and others have shown that it isn’t the deciding factor.”

            The overwhelming majority of SB’s have been started by high end or HOF QB’s. I provided 25 years of proof and the only example you really provided was Dilfer, who is an aberration because he was always a horrible QB. Manning was in Denver for four years, went to two SB’s, broke records and won a SB. Mission accomplished.

            Having a franchise QB provides stability, it provides a foundation and it gives the franchise a chance to be competitive year in and year out. The stats overwhelmingly show that.

            1. But it does not guarantee that the team will win the Super Bowl. The stats show that as well.

              1. Big P,

                I mostly agree with what you’re saying, but you also need to look at where the QB’s in question are in their career arcs when they won Super Bowls.

                Elway was at the end of his HOF career and wasn’t the prime mover if Denver’s offense, at that point.

                Peyton Manning was barely a shadow of his former self, last year.

                Roethlisburger, Brady and Wilson each won a Super Bowl before reaching their full potential. These were more team victories than QB victories.

                Eli Manning is on the fringe of being elite and, if you look at his performances, you can make an argument that the NYG’s won those two Super Bowls in spite of his QB play, rather than because of it.

                Having said that, I’ll take an elite QB, every day of the week and twice in Sundays. It’s just so much easier to win.

              2. Mid,

                Nothing guarantees a SB. What a franchise QB gives you is a chance greater than teams without one. The evidence BipP put up is overwhelmingly in favor of needing a QB. There will always be outliers, but having a top QB puts you in position to compete more than any other area of the team.

              3. Again, that’s my point Rocket. BigP was putting the blame on Smith and Kaepernick as to why the 49ers didn’t we a Super Bowl from 2011-2014, but the reality is there were stronger and more valid reasons.
                I’d glady take a franchise QB because it would give us a better chance of winning the Super Bowl, but there have been plenty of examples of a team winning a Super Bowl title without a franchise QB, so I’d be okay if we had a QB that could help and not hinder the team as long as the rest of the unit was solid.

              4. …didn’t win…

                Posting with a 3G network is for the birds.

              5. Mid,
                Of course there is no guarantee, but there is a significantly better chance at winning a SB and being competitive for a sustained period of time. That’s what the goal is and that’s what great QB’s can provide. The evidence clearly shows that.

              6. That still doesn’t prove you comment on Smith and Kaepernick as true BigP.
                I don’t think any QB could have done anything with our WRs in the game against the Giants. Crabtree did his usual disappearing act and there was absolutely nothing behind him. I mean the #2 WR for that game was Brett Swain. Brett Swain! Who besides Manning and Brady in the current era could make that work?
                The 49ers lost against the Ravens because they fell into a deep hole mainly due to dumb penalties and blown assignements. Having Cowboy with his strength sapped due to an injury which in turn exposed Aldon Smith’s as a product of that functional strength didn’t help matters either, and the same applies to Harbaugh keeping Gore on the sidelines when he was currently running through the Ravens defense.
                Finally, the caliber of the QB didn’t matter against the Seahawks because they laid waste to all of them.
                My point is that Smith and Kaepernick weren’t the reason the 49ers didn’t win the Super Bowl from 2011-2014. Instead, there were many factors.

              7. Exgolfer,
                Elway won late in his career, but he also nearly singlehandedly got them to three other SB’s. He played in five SB’s total. That’s an amazing, HOF career. Big Ben has played in three SB’s. Peyton Manning has played in four SB’s. Brady has played in six SB’s. Wilson has played in two SB’s. Eli has played in two SB’s. That’s 22 Super Bowl appearances with 14 SB championships. This is exactly the type of overwhelming evidence I presented earlier. There will always be teams that get hot at the right time, but the statistics from the last quarter century prove that great QB’s give your team a chance at sustained Championship Windows and SB titles.

                At the end of the day, we agree that great QB’s are a good thing.

              8. Mid,
                A better QB probably wins a SB during that period. Smith only started playing competently after Harbaugh arrived and it was because of the low risk, power running offense. That team was a defensive powerhouse with an insane turnover ratio. There was a reason that Harbaugh went after/evaluated Manning. He saw the window with the teams defense. There is a reason he went with Kaepernick. He figured he could ride the hot hand to a championship and he came agonizingly close to achieving that. Harbaugh is gone, Smith is still Smith in K.C. and Kaepernick has regressed. Kaepernick and Smith both peaked success wise under Harbaugh during his first two years. The Niners did not win a Championship during that window, despite having the perfect formula for winning a championship without a great QB. Even under perfect circumstances for their level of QB proficiency, these QB’s couldn’t win SB’s. Those were SB championship caliber teams without SB caliber QB’s. Those QB’s are the reason that they didn’t win a Championship during that brief period of Harbaugh inspired competency.

              9. A better QB probably wins a SB during that period.

                You have no way of proving that at all. Meanwhile, I can successfully argue that Williams’ screw-ups, Roger’s blown assignments, the injury to Cowboy, and Harbaugh’s decision to keep Gore on the sideline all kept the team from winning a Super Bowl title during that period.
                It’s a team sport. If the absence of a franchise QB was the only problem, then the dynasty of the 80s would have won every single year.

              10. Big P,

                Right, but if you want to count up SB wins and appearances, don’t you think it matters how the QB in question was playing in the year the SB appearance / win occurred? It seems this info is central to the discussion.

                As I said, I mostly agree with you, but, IMO, you’re lumping all SB appearances made by HOF QB’s during their entire career into one bag, irrespective of the subject QB’s level of play in the year of each individual SB appearance.

                For example, don’t you think that Roethlisburger had the least to do with the first of Pittsburgh’s SB wins with him at QB and that it was more of a team win, than something engineered by BR, himself?

                Contrast that with Montana against the Broncos or Young against the Chargers. Montana / Young were the prime movers of those offenses.

                To me, there’s a huge difference between the contributions of the QB’s in these examples.

                BTW, did I say something to make you think I don’t know that John Elway had an amazing career? If I did, it wasn’t intentional. I always wondered what Elway might’ve done if he hadn’t been saddled with Dan Reeves as his HC. Say, if he had played for Bill Walsh and the 49ers (please, nobody take that as a slight against JM/SY).

              11. Big P,

                I definitely agree with you that the 49ers haven’t done enough to have a stream of QB options. A QB should be drafted every other year, at a minimum.

              12. Ex,
                I agree with your point and I understand your train of thought. I’m looking at 25 years of data and seeing the overwhelming correlation between great QB’s and SB’s. The teams with good/franchise/HOF QB’s participate in and win more Super Bowls. I’m not saying you can’t win a SB without one, but the odds are stacked against you. I don’t like stacking the odds against myself.

              13. A better QB during that period almost assurdely means the rest of the team isn’t as strong as it was.

              14. Smith was paid mid tier money and didn’t even produce mid tier passing results. Mid tier passing results might have been enough to win a SB. Kaep got them back to the NFCCG the year after the SB loss while still on his rookie contract, producing similar passing results as Smith previously did. They just weren’t good enough. Not then, not now.

              15. Smith did put up mid tier passing results given the offense he was in. Harbaugh was a run firsr HC. The offense didn’t pad the QBs stats.

              16. A better QB during that period almost assurdely means the rest of the team isn’t as strong as it was.

                You’re right Scooter. A better QB potentially would have meant that the 49ers would have had to let guys like Bowman and Cowboy walk while making the team even more dependent on the draft to fix the team’s weak areas.

              17. Big P,

                I get your point, as well and it’s a good one. Any team with a HOF QB has a huge leg up. It’s proven.

              18. I haven’t checked this out, so I may be wrong, but I would imagine the majority of SB era players in the HOF would have won a SB, regardless of position.

              19. Do you want to know what would’ve won the 49ers a SB? I’ll tell you.

                God love him, but if JH hadn’t been so f&#@%ng hard headed about the process of calling plays, he wouldn’t have had to call a time out on second and goal, when CK would’ve walked into the end zone on the brilliant QB sweep call. Every Raven was already blocked and CK still had Gore available as a lead blocker. But, no, JH couldn’t adjust his precious byzantine play calling system. Yes, lets have super complicated play calls and multiple people responsible for those calls. That’s a great idea. And even though this method is proven to lead to tons of wasted timeouts and delay of game penalties, let’s doggedly stick with it, even though it’s a huge disadvantage for the team.

                For all the great things that JH did for the 49ers, his intractability cost the 49ers a SB win.

              20. Scooter,

                You’re probably right, but a simple majority (51%) is a pretty weak threshold, isn’t it?

              21. Scooter,

                I didn’t phrase my question very well. I was really asking you what percentage of HOF players are SB winners.

              22. Dear God, look what happens when your wife is asleep, you’re afraid to start watching the new season of “House of Cards” and you’re wired and can’t get to sleep yourself:

                I just did a quick survey of all HOF inductees (definitely room for error, although, probably not gross error). I would’ve thought it to be slightly more than 50%, but it turned out to be slightly less than 50% of HOF players were SB winners (all players active during the SB era included).

              23. Another thing to remember: winning SB’s results in players on those winning teams getting into the HOF unjustifiably.

                Troy Aikman doesn’t sniff the HOF without being on the Cowboys. Likewise with Tom Griese. There are a number of other examples of this effect.

              24. Interesting. Don’t suppose you happened to calculate the % of QBs in the HOF with a SB win vs without?

              25. Scooter,

                A quick (and maybe only semi accurate) survey reveals that 11 of 18 HOF QB’s who played in the SB era are SB winners. Of the non-winners only Jurgensen and Moon didn’t play in a super bowl. I believe that Jurgensen was Kilmer’s backup in the Super Bowl against the Dolphins.

              26. Thanks ex. I guess the simple point I’m trying to make is that you need excellent players in general to win a SB. Having a future HOF QB helps, but the same can ve said of any position. Great teams have great players.

              27. Scooter,

                Yep, great teams have great players, and it’s best when one of those players is a QB.

                One thing that struck me while looking at the list of HOF inductees, is that the non SB winning players are, for the most part, HOFers that can’t be questioned. Not so for some of the HOFers that were on SB winning teams.

    3. Big P not only is it important to have a great QB for SB competition but, I’m sure you know this, the 49ers history and tradition is to have some of the best. Frankie Albert, YA Tittle (HOF, three NFL east championships), Earl Morrall (1969 SB QB), Billy Kilmer (1974 SB QB), John Brodie (definitely should be HOF), Joe Montana (obvious), Steve Young (obvious), Jeff Garcia (at least he was exciting). And even the haters have to admit that Alex and Colin brought us some real excitement at the position. Now we believe that Blaine Gabbert is possibly something more than a backup and we have only him to look to to bring back the excitement the other greats brought us. The absolute best we can hope, and I think that it really is Baalke’s mindset, is that we replicate the current Denver Broncos. Manning might be HOF but last year he was nothing more than we can expect from Gabbert. The Broncos won with a very mediocre QB and a lights out defense. I that Baalke is shooting for that model because he just does not have the ability or the guts to build an offense around a quality QB in the 49er tradition. Good post Big P. What I would like to see is how many run first teams were successful without a hall of fame running back, because, as we all know, there are so many more of them out there than HOF QBs.

      1. Wine,
        Their own history shows the importance of the position. I just don’t see the commitment to the position and it’s frightening considering the correlation between good QB’s and winning championships. That’s all Jed is willing to hoist, right? Championship banners? The scariest thing about Jed is that you know that he really believed that Tomsula would be more successful than Harbaugh. You also know that he realized his mistake two seconds into Tomsula’s pastrami sweat soaked intro press conference, while everybody else realized his mistake months earlier.

    1. That’s kind of cute. Each ESPN reporter picked the team he is covering to beat the 49ers. I suppose it’s based on the status of the team today. Taking the same look at last year’s predictions, the 49ers did better at 4 – 12. Someone must have overlooked the missed field goals.

    1. Rocket,
      You’re awesome and we hail from the same line of thinking. Grant banned me for some reason awhile back, I’m not sure why and I don’t really care. I get tired of his censoring comments to facilitate his trolling viewpoints. He’s a narcissist and a troll, but the community here is great and that is the reason I have been here for 7+ seasons now. I look forward to many more conversations and I hope all is well!

      1. BigP,

        Right back at ya. It’s always more interesting and knowledgeable around here when you contribute. Seems obvious that it would be a good idea to try and find a Franchise QB, but obvious doesn’t always seem to fly on this board.

      2. BigP,

        Don’t feel singled, out he’s banned me several times too. He does that to readers that call him out for his blatant anti-49ers agenda and his painfully obvious, incite the masses to generate hits, method of “writing”. Lately, however, most fans are so stupefied and shell shocked over the results of Trent Baalke’s mind numbing incompetency that every hit piece Grant types kind of falls on deaf ears anyway.

    2. The interesting thing in that article is how it outlines they built the rest of the team first, so they are now in a position they believe they can make such a move. Something perhaps the 49ers would do well to consider.

      1. Nooooooo. The 49er problem is that there are no franchise QBs coming out of college with big hands, long arms and two torn ACLs.

      2. Scooter,

        That is what they are doing now, but only because Bradford didn’t work out. They took Bradford #1 overall and tried to build around him, but injuries prevented it from coming to fruition along with some inconsistent play from Bradford.

        1. My point was that because they have built the rest of the team, they feel they can give up such a bounty now for the ‘missing piece’.

    1. Yes, another Willis type of impact player is the best we can hope for now. Believe me I love it, but until we have a franchise QB, we will not win a super bowl.

  14. My draft crush is Vernon Adams, QB from Oregon. There are a lot of knocks against him: size, blah, blah, size, blah. Whatever the draft gurus with rulers and stop watches say, he does one thing very very well, and it doesn’t show up on their meters or measurables sheets – he wins. I watched him at Oregon. When he was on the field the Ducks won. When he wasn’t they lost. And at the East-West Shrine Game he led his team to 3 touchdowns in 3 possessions. Hmmm. When he’s on the field an entire team is raised to an elevated level and the they win. Look at what happened in their bowl game last year. The Ducks took a commanding lead early on then lost it and the game once Adams went out with injury. He’s got intangibles that are intangible. Amazing how that works! Draft the guy. He wins. And I didn’t even mention that he might be a good fit in Chip Kelly’s offense.

        1. He’s 20 other QB’s that disappear when they get to the NFL. There is nothing remarkable about him.

            1. I beg to differ. CJ will be drafted in the second round, and if he falls to the third round, the Niners should grab him.

              1. Jones lost his starting position, is extremely raw, and has said some things that can make a person’s head hurt. That’s not second or third round talent.

              2. I dont know what he said, but he led the Buckeyes to a national championship in 2014 with talents that Chip could appreciate

              3. And then subsequently lost his starting role during the past season.

          1. I don’t see Vernon Adams as draftable, but he’s worth an invite to camp. Adams certainly would be a good guy to have on the scout team if nothing else.

      1. I tend to agree with that and if someone did. they could always pick him up on cut down day. I see the value of Adams on the practice squad – injury insurance.

          1. He is a decent player I only got to watch him for the one year at Oregon. At first I didn’t care for him but he grew on me. I was too use to watching Marriota. Has a good arm and he can run, the big question is his decision making.

            1. He really was good in that game. But he’s so small, and he isn’t particularly fast, and his arm isn’t strong. Which means he’ll be a priority free agent IMO.

            2. If we want Adams, and WE DO…we’d better be prepared to use a 4th rounder on him….there are other teams hiding in the weeds….

            3. The EW Shrine Game isn’t enough to compensate for his physical shortcomings.

              Vernon Davis screems UDFA.

    1. JAH,
      I am with you and raise that QB gamble pick to two – Vernon Adams and Keenan Reynolds.
      I too saw Vernon in East West Shrine make things offensively happen when they normally don’t.
      Keenan was a touch down machine as QB. Yes he was Navy. And yes, both are on the smallish size. But they make things happen and as you said – “intangibles”.
      But here is where the Niners don’t go wrong, if either or both don’t succeed at QB, and I kind a think at least one of them will, they then move one or both to a skill position. Nothing to loose.

  15. Here is the problem with your logic Grant. On the surface it looks great, BUT if the Rams get the next Brady or Manning or Rodgers or Brees, it’s all worth it. That’s what people forget. The value of the trade depends on the success of the QB. I am not sold on Wentz. However, I absolutely believe Goff is going to be great. Why? For a player to become great at Cal is remarkably difficult. Cal has a tenth of the talent their competition in the Pac 12 has. That’s why their star players blow up in the NFL. They finally have support.

    The Niners can end up with a great player, a great piece, but they are still missing a franchise QB. If the Rams get one, we will be alone the cellar for a while.

    1. Thanks to the Rams, the Niners will end up with a player who has “PRO BOWLER” stamped on his forehead. Wentz doesn’t have that stamp. Neither does Goff.

      1. We will have to agree to disagree on Goff. Goff will be a top 5 QB in 4-5 years. He has all traits the great ones show.

        1. He has some of them. He doesn’t have an elite arm, and until he shows he can command a complex offense, read a full field, not be fooled by disguised coverages, and play his best football against tougher opponents, saying he has all the traits is just hyperbole.

            1. What changed from a few days ago when you had Lynch and Wentz in your top 6 on the 49ers big board?

              1. I realized those rankings were inflated based on need. Wentz and Lynch aren’t even close to being sure things — no getting around that. Can’t possibly rank either one ahead of Ezekiel Elliott, for example.

              2. Glad you’ve seen the light.

                I still think there is a very good chance the 49ers come out of round 1 with a QB though, especially if they trade Kaep.

              3. Not if they stay true to their draft board. No way Cook should get taken before Round 4. That’s the grade PFF gives him and I agree with them.

              4. “I still think there is a very good chance the 49ers come out of round 1 with a QB though, especially if they trade Kaep.”

                One of the rare times I hope your wrong.

              5. I think need will trump value, but more importantly, I think need will do to the 49ers what it had done to you earlier – inflate the value of the QBs in their eyes, thus moving them up their draft board.

                Under, I hope I’m wrong too!

              6. Yeah, Baalke seems infatuated with Cook. Maybe Chip Kelly will push for someone else later in the draft. He waited until Round 4 to pick a QB his first year in Philly.

              7. What changed from a few days ago when you had Lynch and Wentz in your top 6 on the 49ers big board?

                That was so a couple of days ago.

              8. Scooter

                I like Lynch at 2-3; His qualities (build, accuracy, and running ability) match those of Gabbert (and more) perfect to park on the pine for a year behind Blaine and acclimate to NFL speed and pick up some garbage time experience….and pick up the fine points of ‘Chip’s’ offense…

              9. Oregon, that’s fair enough. I place a higher emphasis on what’s between the ears of a QB than most. I trust the NFL potential of guys like Prescott and Hogan more than Lynch, largely based on their mental make up. I honestly think the learning curve for a QB like Lynch, a guy that has gotten by more on his athletic gifts than mental capability, may prove too much to overcome. It has been for Kaep.

          1. stop with elite arm crap. Joe Montana did not have an elite arm. Brady’s arm was not elite coming out of college. Matt Ryan’s arm is not elite. Most important trait in NFL is accuracy, period. You cannot teach it. Goff has elite accuracy, footwork, ability to move through progressions and “it” factor. We will be regretting this for years to come.

        2. Except Goff did not play well against tough competition. He lost to Utah, UCLA, USC, Oregon and Stanford.

          1. Actually that’s wrong. With no offensive line for 4 years, he put up solid numbers against every one of this e teams except Utah. If you watch Utah, 3 interceptions weren’t on him. Moreover, Utah had two weeks to prepare for that game. Lastly, they had better talent, as does almost every team I the pax 12. Cal players who excell do it with a 10th of the talent of use, Oregon, etc.

            1. I think Goff, in the right system, can become a really good QB, but he might be thrown to the wolves and get the Alex Smith treatment.

              1. I agree Seb. If the Rams do what the 49ers did, they’ll put him in against a strong opponent with little to no help and watch him flounder.

              2. You don’t even know what you mean by the “Alex Smith treatment”.

                Of course GOFF is going to be thrown to the wolves. All QB’s drafted top 5 are, and Alex was no exception.

                The Alex Smith treatment would have to describe Alex’s marry-go-round of offensive coordinators. That’s where Alex was ultimately let down.

                But I’vs corrected you on this before Seb, and you simply don’t listen.

              3. 49, you seem to be doubling down. When I say the AS treatment, you cannot accept the fact that he did not do well, while AR sat for a few seasons and had time to learn and grow in the position, enough to win a SB later on.
                Who cares who his OCs were, the fact was that he was installed as the starting QB and failed for years. His whole team was not good enough, and AS was doomed to failure. Just like Gabbert was at Jax.
                I coined the term- the AS treatment, but you should come up with a different term because my definition is how I framed his situation. While you may differ, but you should not steal my terms and define them in a different way.

            2. In the games against tougher opponents he was unable to lead his team to more than 10 points in the first half, or prevent his team from being 14 or more points down by early in the 3rd qtr. His stats in those games are a bit of a mirage. Like Kaep’s stats against the Steelers in week 2.

      2. Grant – I’d love to hear what your source is as to why you think that Baalke would ever, under any circumstances take a QB in the first round. I just don’t see it. See HT’s comment above about the measurables Baalke would use to evaluate a QB. I don’t think he was kidding.

  16. As far as QB’s go I hope we draft Hogan and Vernon Adams later in the draft . I think with a good coaching staff Blaine well play well this next season which will give Time to grow those 2 young QB’s. Baalke will draft a defensive player with that first pick

    1. Yeah, just what every team needs, a stable of serviceable QB’s. If we keep ignoring trying to draft a franchise QB we will just end up the Texans.

      1. there has to be a franchise qb available to draft. just because you need one doesnt mean the qbs in the draft are franchise caliber

  17. Here is my updated 49ers big board, 1 through 10. Disclaimer: This could change in five minutes.

    1. Myles Jack, ILB, UCLA
    2. Jalen Ramsey, DB, Florida State
    3. Laremy Tunsil, OT, Ole Miss
    4. Joey Bosa, EDGE, Ohio State
    5. Jack Conklin, OT, Michigan State
    6. Shaq Lawson, EDGE, Clemson
    7. Darron Lee, ILB, Ohio State
    8. Leonard Floyd, EDGE, Georgia
    9. William Jackson III, CB, Houston
    10. DeForest Buckner, DT, Oregon

    1. Tunsil won’t fall to us. Either the Chargers or someone trading for the draft spot held by the Ravens will pick him. Stanley is a more realistic option at 7.
      Bosa’s tape shows that he’s not an OLB. Too slow out his stance.

    2. Grant, thanks for the big board. I know you liked Lee and Lawson.

      Is this who you think Baalke should have on his big board, or who you think Baalke likes?

      Is Buckner at 10 because they already have Armstead, or do you see him as the 10th best player?

      I hear mixed things about Ronnie Stanley. Some rate him close to Tunsil. Others worry about his stregnth. Marcus Martin had nice agility and footwork for his size at USC, but his lack of power in the pros is holding him back. Maybe some thing Stanley’s like that. Agile. Athletic. But power issues. (he says he’s adding strength)

      Here’s my non QB big board. I’m sure its missing some great players. Its based on players that are on my radar.

      I’d be happy with any of the top five at picks 7. Ramsey and Jack were tied for #1, but Jack’s knee has me concerned.

      1. Ramsey
      2. Tunsil
      3. Buckner
      4. Jack (minor knee re-check concern)
      5. Bosa (top three on a 3-4 team’s big board)

      The stragglers worth trading down/up for…

      6. Stanley
      7. Billings
      8. Lee
      9. Treadwell
      10. Chris Jones

      I value Stanley around picks 10-15, Billings and Lee 15-25, Jones 23-40.

        1. Still think the Niners should trade back twice to get more picks in the first 3 rounds, and bundle later picks to move up into the third round. They should also bundle players to move into the second round.

        2. Grant, that makes me feel better about Armstead. Armstead’s and Buckner are almost clones for the first 2/3rds of a play.

          Buckner has better ball location when finishing plays. Buckner has a bigger variety of techniques pressuring.

          Armstead’s made ball location improvements. He still needs to work on that. Pressured better than I thought he would. Armstead’s a very fluid mover, and has amazing ability to act like a giant spring, boinging O-linemen backwards.

          Armstead could be a monster this year.

          1. I agree, but that’s just another way of saying Buckner is more experienced. Armstead wasn’t a full-time football player until 2014. I think he actually has a higher ceiling than Buckner.

            Boinging. I love it.

        3. Grant

          I just saw some film clips of the Oregon Spring practice the other day and it showed Buckner w/o pads working on his moves….he may not be stronger than Armstead, but MAN…he is smooth. I just drool imagining a Dline of Armstead, Dial, and Buckner…’some giant wingspan there….

            1. Would that really be a problem since the defense is expected to have a continuous rotation of players in and out?

      1. I agree and I don’t think it changed one bit because of the Rams move. HT I liked your comment about how QBs are evaluated. I thought it was funny but then thought that you’re probably serious.

        1. You’re right. I was “trying” to be funny, and then when I read it, it seemed to me to be the real deal.

  18. I think your article boils down to this:
    The Rams’ move is good for the 49ers if they were not set on drafting one of those two QBs. And to take that one step further, the Rams’ move is good for the 49ers because it forces them to draft a better match at the 7th pick – if indeed they were feeling the QB pressure.

    Are we painting a smiley face over a bummer face? Or are we getting a reality check on that annual draft QB elevator ride through the QB ceiling after seeing the Rams take that trip all the way through that ceiling and onto the very costly penthouse over looking Milinium Park?

  19. Can we assume that in this QB frenzy, that the Rams have now sent into overdrive, that both Wentz and Goff will go before the Niner pick? It seems likely that the Browns, though needing a Laremy Tunsil tackle will end up trading down to some one caught up in the QB draft frenzy.

    Will that be the Niners trading with Browns? – not likely knowing this manager’s M.O. – and not a good idea.

  20. Why did the Rams do this two weeks before the draft when deals are more favorable at the last minute.
    One reason is that they got a bit spooked that another team or two were interested. But another reason that may play into this is that they are undecided on which QB to take. They have just guaranteed themselves one of those top two QBs and will be taking their sweet time deciding on the which one part. Their communique more than hints at getting that final piece to win now. That would favor Goff. But Wentz fits the Fisher QB mold from past years.

    I actually don’t think they have decided yet!

    My wife is from North Dakota and was / is a Bison and, yes, we followed them this year. So she is pretty exited about a Bison player being called first in 2016 draft.

    Me, I kinda wanted to see him in Red and Gold.

    1. When I was a young “warrior”, I spent two years in Rapid City having North Dakota snow blown in my face. At least that’s where the locals said it was coming from.

      All I want from North Dakota is more “Fargo”. ;-}

  21. Tackle is good place for the 49ers to go this year at number 7. Or maybe defense if – but certainly best player on the board.
    Or maybe trade down a bit to take further advantage of the 20 through 70 talent depth this year. That latter would be Typical Trent.
    As for QB I want to see them draft, in latter rounds, Keenan Reynolds and Vernon Adams. Keenan was beyond productive at lower level and Vernon impressed me at East West Shrine and beyond – was a work horse at combine.
    They would be picked up for a song and played in minor $. Try them as QBs and if they don’t work out as QBs, fit either or both into other positions. Talking WIN or win situation.

  22. Let me also be one to say good to have Big P back in the fold. I also missed CFCs and was worried he was done with this site. As along time fan of the red and gold I am tired of the negative chatter of this team. The dysfunction seems well earned by balke and dork. So many other teams do not seem to be surrounded by chaos and dysfunction. I hate the negative Nellie attitude but I am slipping fast. I liked chips news conference but if he is all ready butting heads with Trent this may get uglier. This is so much like the dysfunctional warriors of the past run by chris Cohan and robin Rowe. I am kind of hoping for the tackle from Norte dame or jack from ucla. We need building blocks so when a real plan or leader emerges a quick turn around will take place. I sure appreciate the positive spin and hopefulness that exists! Also lots of mashing of teeth and will timed expletives! Hope springs eternal!

    1. Grant sez:

      …. If the Niners want a new quarterback, the best one available probably is Nick Foles, the guy the Rams don’t want…..

      This gave me a chuckle, Grant .. but, actually… I do agree,
      that, this move by the Lambs does .. take the pressure
      off the Niners, in the pursuit of a 1st round QB .. especially
      if the consensus is correct.. and neither of the top two prospects
      are, indeed, worth a top 5 pick …

      Love to see Myles Jack there at #7 … but, as I eluded to
      in an earlier thread … I doubt.. Baalke has the gonads
      to pull the trigger on him …

      There have been some really good players
      the regulars (here) have suggested.. as a “consolation”
      and I’d probably be happy with most of them… and besides ..

      Like Scooter says (above) … if ..there still is
      a QB on the Niners big board …

      Hogan can be had later in the draft ..

      1. Miles Jack did not fully and completely pass his physical this week. Should the 49ers still consider him at 7 if he falls – which now looks more likely?

        1. wonder just how far he’ll fall ? … but,
          I bet the knee injury will have garnered
          (maybe) a second look from Baalke

  23. Grant, I am sorry, but I totally disagree with your whole premise. The Rams trade is not good for the Niners. They only lack a good QB to be a serious contender in the division. The Rams have Gurley as a legit running threat, and a defense stocked with first round picks.
    This trade has doomed the Niners to be the cellar dweller again.
    Even the notion that losing draft picks will hurt the Rams is debatable, especially if they become a playoff team and pick towards the end of the round.
    I expected that the Rams would have traded their first and second to the Ravens for their 6th pick, but this new trade gave them the best QB in the draft.

    1. Seb… Agree and disagree. Agree that the rams have a d stocked with 1st rounders, but to automatically dismiss Hyde is very premature. Gurley is good no doubt, but Hyde proved he could thrive behind a terrible oline. His oline will no doubt be better this year barring injury. As for cellar dwellers, that’s also up for debate. As bad as our staff was, those boys only finished 2 games ahead of us. And with a superior coaching staff. If they only lacked a qb and we lacked an entire team, they should have been 4 to 5 games better. Our team is better than you think. We are young, but with an entire year under their belt, and no doubtba better offense, we should be better. I’m not afraid of the rams. Even with Carson Wentz.

      1. Past 2nd, 3rd, 4th and 5th round swings and misses by Baalke have added up to no depth like the dynasty front office of the eighties FO had to deal with. Except when that FO drafted mid round, they hit bulls eyes, and remember, winning year in and out they were faced with something Trent’s not faced. 20 years of drafting from the bottom of the draft, because that’s where good teams draft, even before the salary cap years.
        In order for the 49ers to be successful here are a few notes I’ve compiled for Baalke to right the ship, and if he follows them, the 49ers could have a good year, this year!

        1. Hire a QB whisperer/guru—Kelly is supposed to be that man, meaning he should be able to find QB’s mid Like ( Bill Walsh did) round and develop them .

        2. Not spending high on a QB allows you to draft the trench players higher so the
        49ers can select talented DL and OL players.

        3. Hit on your mid round selections (Do Tim Mckeyer and Don Griffin ring a bell)?

        4. Draft your QB and WR with Kelly whispering into your ear—ie, be open to advice.

        5. Trent, finally, you manipulate the draft boards under pressure as well as anyone to acquire more picks and this year you have Bethea, Anthony Davis, and Kap. as trading chips….Make them count.

      2. Steele, I like your optimism. Just wish there was more good news instead of the steady drip of calamities and catastrophes.
        I agree, Hyde is good, but if he keeps struggling to gain extra yards, he may become injured again.
        I am glad that the temptation to draft a QB in the first round is over and the Niners can get a pass rusher.

    2. Carson Wentz is less pro-ready than Paxton Lynch. I think this move sets back L.A. in the short term and long term.

      1. You should consider a future in politics. I’ve never known anyone that could reverse and flip-flop on positions from one week to the next quite like you have been regarding your take on the QB’s in this draft.

        Who’s the flavor of the week next; Hackenberg? There aren’t too many names left you’ve pretty much mocked all of them to us at this point.

          1. Poorly, I expect it would do poorly which is why I haven’t started the tv/movie themed one that I’ve been rolling around in the back of my head for sometime now.

            At least I have the luxury of it only being a hobby. Imagine if it this was one’s job?

              1. You’re acting childish and your attack is ridiculous, just stop before you make yourself look worse.

              2. Maybe attack wasn’t the right word. The foundation on which you were basing your commentary.

              3. If I was to setup a tv/movie blog I’d probably call it Coffee’s for Closers, I think it’s catchy and in terms of a name for that genre of conversation it would be considered original. For a nobody that is only doing it as a hobby I would have no expectation that anybody is going to know who Bret Osborne is but the name CFC is instantly recognizable to most anyone who appreciates good movies. You recognized it and commented on it being one of your favorite movies. Others will do the same and it will drop them to the blog.

                However, I’m just not that good of a writer nor am I consistently creative or interesting enough in my writing. I doubt that I would be able to maintain an active readership given the unevenness of my weekly contributions.

                Anyway as you can see, it’s been considered and I don’t think a lack of originality to my chosen name is the biggest hurdle if it even is one.

          1. Frankly, I am astonished that I have not been banned. Guess Grant likes my spirited defenses of his writing style.;p

            1. Seb,
              Don’t take being banned by Grant lightly. Some around these parts have come to look at it as having “street cred.”
              Just look at it like this, you’ve reached tough gangster status by being banned. All that’s left is facial tattoos and don’t forget the teardrops tats while you’re at it (lol).

              1. AES, believe me, with my writing style, I have been banned on many a blog site. Just goes with the territory. I have also conjured up new names and continued posting for months. However, I am content to post solely on this site and have used only this name for over a year now.

              2. So you have openly admitted to being a disturber and d bag?
                What I have said all along!

              3. Prime, maybe you have not noticed, but I have scrupulously avoided you for a while, and many see me as a civil and polite poster. I do not disparage others like you do ad nauseum, and can accept criticism without becoming hysterical. I get on this site to discuss the Niners. You just attack. It is not your private fiefdom to inflict your personal screeds upon others in an unctuous and bombastic manner. I may throw out long shot scenarios, but I at least SAY something, unlike others who just parrot what they see, or post 20 links in a row.
                Have a nice day.

      2. Do you think it s Wentz to the Titans? I’m hoping so. He’s the only one of the projected top 7 I’d be ho-hum about. If Wentz fell there are three trades I’d like…

        Trade 7 for Jets 20+51+2017 2nd

        Trade 7 for Jets 20+51+Wilkerson (I’m getting greedy. Shake em down Titans style.)

        Trade 7 for Titans 15+43. (they like Ronnie Stanley)

        1. I think the Rams will take Wentz. I think the Niners should trade down with the Bears, then trade down again with the Titans. Two trade downs.

          1. I agree that the Niners should trade back with the Bears, but I think that Stanley may last til the 15 for Titans so the Niners should trade back to the Colts, Bills or Jets.

            1. That works, too. If Stanley doesn’t last and Buckner is there at 11 and the Titans want him, trade back with Tennessee. I think the Giants will take Stanley, though. Good fit.

              Here’s how I see the top 10 playing out.

              1. LA: Wentz
              2. CLE: Goff
              3. SD: Ramsey
              4. DAL: Jack
              5. JAX: Bosa
              6. BLT: Tunsil
              7. CHI (from SF): Elliott
              8. PHI: Stanley
              9. TB: Lawson
              10. NYG: Conklin

              1. Ah, good point, but I wonder if the Giants select a defender to upgrade their dreadful defense.

              2. They spent big money on two defenders during free agency. They may go offense in Round 1.

              3. It would be good if Stanley and Buckner fell to 11. The Niners could get a lot in a trade down.

              4. I’d stand pat for Buckner. I like Buckner, but I also think the talent in round two is really good this draft.

                7 to 15 would fetch one of the Titans 43.

                7 to 11, and 11 back to 17 would fetch two 3rd rounders.

                Grant, if you really like Lee of Lawson, trading back makes sense weather its the 15+Titans pick 41 or 15+two 3rd rounders.

              5. 7 plus Bethea would fetch 11 and 41. Then 11 would fetch 15 and 76. Which would give the Niners 15, 37, 41, 68, 76 and 105.

              6. If it was just based on his talent, then you’d be right Grant. But Bethea is on the wrong side of 30 and is coming off a season-ending injury. No GM will exchange a third round pick for him.

              7. It’s not like he hurt his knee. He was a Pro Bowler just a season ago under Vic Fangio, whom he’d be reuniting with.

              8. Since the Rams broke the ice on multi pick deals, maybe the Niners could do the same. Since the Browns lost O linemen and cut Whitner, Maybe the Niners could offer Bethea, Devey and Brandon Thomas for their second round pick. Of course, I want Devey long gone, but Thomas has potential, but I think that Silberman may fit better in a Chip Kelly offense. Maybe even accept a third round pick for them.

              9. Boldin just came off a Super Bowl campaign and an excellent postseason yet was only traded for a sixth round pick. Bethea won’t net a second round pick.

              10. Grant, my guess is if the 49ers were wanting to make those trade downs, it would include one or more high round 2017 picks. If they miss out on one of the top QBs, look for them to try and load up for next year to make sure they have the ammo to get who they want.

              11. B2W, would you consider losing out on Buckner if you could trade back and get Billings?
                Or maybe go bold like OldCoach and trade back even farther and pick up Nkemdiche?

              12. I would not trade out on Buckner unless the compensation was really high. If the 49ers did trade back, Billings would be one of my targets.

              13. If any team can afford to trade out on Buckner, it’s the 49ers, in my opinion. I actually prefer Floyd.

              14. According to WF, a few teams picking at the end of the top 10 really like Floyd. He might well be gone by 15.

              15. Hmm, I don’t see TB or NYG wanting him. Of course Chicago could be interested, but I have them trading up for Elliott.

              16. Apparently the Bucs could look at him as a Sam backer ala Barr, that plays down in nickel. Giants could as well. There are also other teams before pick 15 that could like him in a similar role.

              17. Interesting. Could happen. I think it plays out like this:

                LA: Wentz
                Cle: Goff
                SD: Ramsey
                Dal: Jack
                Jax: Bosa
                Blt: Tunsil
                Chi: Elliott
                Phi: Stanley
                TB: Lawson
                NYG: Conklin
                Tenn: Buckner
                NO: Rankins
                Mia: Jackson III
                Oak: Lee
                SF: Floyd

              18. 49ers might be able to make out like bandits in a tug of war for Elliott. Bears, Eagles and Dolphins could all be in play.

              19. Exactly. Say they trade back with the Bears. The Niners could include Bethea in the deal, and get back Chicago’s first-rounder this year, their third-rounder this year and potentially their second-rounder next year.

              20. I don’t think it would get them that much… Bethea is good but old and coming off an injury. Won’t get the third you believe he is worth. However, #7 could potentially get them the Bears 1st and next years 2nd.

                I wouldn’t rule out a trade with the Eagles though if other teams are sniffing around #7 for Elliott. #7 for #8 and their 4th rounder + Ryan Mathews. Can then still use #8 as trade bait for teams after a pass rusher or OT.

              21. The Bears’ second-rounder next year currently is worth about the same as their third-rounder this year. Maybe the Niners could get the Bears first-rounder this year, their third-rounder this year and their third-rounder next year. Not because Bethea is worth so much — because Elliott is.

              22. I think the Bears would end any trade talk if Baalke became that greedy.

              23. Don’t get me wrong. Elliott is going to be a great NFL RB, but no team will trade that much capital to move up four spots.

              24. The No. 7 pick is worth 1500 points, but Elliott should boost the value significantly. The Bears 1st, third and 2017 third would add up to 1595. Niners could get that for Elliott and Bethea.

              25. A more likely trade would be the Bears first, third, and sixth round picks for the 49ers first round pick. They’d break even with that trade.

              26. The Niners will get more than 1500 points for Elliott, especially if a few teams bid for him.

            2. Bethea plus 2 offensive linemen, with one that has potential to be really good, or at least was considered a first round pick until his workout injury years ago.
              Rams are offering 4 picks for one player. Why not 3 players for a second or third round pick.
              Yes, Boldin was a steal at 6, but then RGIII was for 3 firsts and two seconds. Goff or Wentz for 2 firsts, 2 seconds and a third. Trading is an inexact science.

              1. Take the Eagles out of the equation because there’s no way they’d move up just one spot.

              2. They would if they felt another team might trade one spot ahead of them and take Elliott.

              3. Yep, what Grant said. The Eagles are reported to want him bad. If they get wind that a team is looking to gazump them for Elliott, then they are definitely in play for trading up. Even just one spot. If I was the 49ers in that situation, I’d be telling the Eagles that they are fielding offers from the Bears and Dolphins for Elliott, even if they aren’t.

              4. That’s not a realistic scenario. If the Eagles are that enthralled with Elliott, then it would make more sense for them to trade with one of the teams picking ahead of the 49ers. Trading up one spot would be sheer foolishness.

              5. No, its really not. They could trade to 6 or higher, but it would cost more. But if it gets to pick 7 and teams are looking to move up to take Elliott, the Eagles either join that coversation or lose him. Its that simple.

                It happened in 2012 in a trade for the 3rd and 4th picks, so the Browns could draft Richardson and prevent the Bucs from trading with the Vikings and taking him.

          1. I trust his mental makeup and accuity. Smart, resilient guy. Add his athletic qualities and I honestly think he’s got a higher floor than most of the QBs in this class. I don’t think he’s going to be great, but I do think he’ll be a pretty good game manager QB, and by earlier in his career than most think.

            You’ve compared him to Alex Smith, so I assume you see the same thing. I think he’ll be a bit more like early career Ben Roethlisberger – a game manager that is capable of finding ways to win games when you need it from him.

              1. Hmmm, I thought you were comparing him to Smith today more so than his career arc. I don’t think he’ll struggle as badly as Smith early. Smith came out too young.

            1. He takes so long to deliver the football, though. He’s going to have to learn to pull the trigger quicker in the NFL.

              1. A smart team will build the offense around him early on that allows for a lot of play action and QB keepers, to hold up the pass rush and give him more time while he adjusts to the speed of the NFL.

      3. Carson Wentz is less pro-ready than Paxton Lynch.

        The Rams prefer Goff from what I understand.

              1. I don’t think that has much to do with whether they like Goff or Wentz.

              2. If past history regarding the type of QB Fisher likes doesn’t have much to do with which QB they may like, what does?

              3. Wentz was one of the most accurate college QBs on short to intermediate routes last year.

                I think they will take Goff too, but saying Fisher’s history in taking QBs is not relevant is ridiculous. Of course it is. But when its all said and done, I think they’ll take Goff because he meets Fisher’s criteria of being a quick decision maker that is capable of hitting players accurately deep. Basically Case Keenum with a better arm.

              4. This is where we differ strongly. I think Fisher loves what Goff brings. He will be like Keenum, but way more accurate.

              5. The Rams traded a seventh-round pick for Keenum. Look at the QBs Fisher has drafted in the top three.

              6. Goff played behind a subpar OL, so he has the toughness. I’ll give you mobility, but I doubt that would really matter.

              7. Goff isn’t an imposing athlete. McNair was. Wentz is. They’re like strong safeties.

              8. Yes, it is a valid argument. You just disagree with it. Big difference.

                You fall back on the “that’s not a valid argument” a lot when you can’t think of a good reason why a statement that disagrees with your thoughts is wrong. You may as well be saying “you got me”

              9. I’ve noticed you use that argument most often when you’ve dug your heels in on something (so, often) and then someone makes a good argument as to why your position may be flawed. Good way to shut down an argument without having to come up with a counter argument of any worth.

              10. That was two very stupid posts by you Scooter.
                Who Fisher drafted when he was with the Titans is pointless because his preferences at the position could have changed since then, which could lend credence to reports saying the Rams are leaning towards Goff. But it’s more likely Snead’s call since he’s in the last year of his contract and has been as working on an extension as is the case with Fisher.
                In regards to your inane second post, I am taking college courses right now and one of my assignments this week was creating a definition essay. I was having trouble trying to word it correctly, so I put my phone down in order to concentrate on it better. But go ahead and beleive what you want as to why I had stopped posting for a little bit.

              11. And I’ve seen most reports saying they prefer Goff. I guess we’ll have to wait until the draft to see who they prefer.

              12. Fisher has had many different types of QB’s. McNair was his longest serving QB, but McNair became a pocket QB and only ran when pressured for much of his career. Fisher didn’t want Vince Young and at one point benched him for Kerry Collins. The QB’s he’s had with the Rams have all been pocket QB’s without a lot of mobility, so my guess is he’s looking for a passer who can play from the pocket.

                As far as who the Rams take, I think it will be Goff. Wentz is all potential at this point. He hasn’t taken enough snaps in College and his accuracy suffers the further downfield he has to throw it. Goff in contrast has started for 3 years and is accurate at all levels of the field. The biggest factor in Goff’s favor is probably the fact he is much more ready to start than Wentz. I wouldn’t start either one of them, but that is likely what the Rams are looking to do and Goff is way ahead of Wentz in that respect.

              13. ” McNair was his longest serving QB, but McNair became a pocket QB and only ran when pressured for much of his career.”
                Sounds familiar doesn’t it?

                I’ve always compared the late great McNair to Young. The biggest differences between those two players was that Young was surrounded by elite talent and coaches and McNair…not so much.

                I’d even go so far to suggest that McNair was possibly even the better QB.

              14. CFC,

                There’s definitely a comparison to be made. McNair is so underrated for how good of a complete QB he eventually became. Tough guy as well. He played with a bad back for a lot of his career.

              15. Ah, see Mid, I knew if given time you’d be able to come up with a good, err, reason why it wasn’t a valid argument. Makes one wonder why you just went with the coversation killer of ‘that’s not a valid argument’ in the first place! :-P

                To understand better, you are saying Fisher’s desire in a QB will have little bearing on who the GM will choose (because that always ends well), and that Fisher has probably changed in terms of what he likes in a QB anyway. So because of that, the type of QB Fisher has liked previously is of no matter. And whats more, it lends credibility to them wanting Goff instead of Wentz. Correct?

                Lets say that is correct. How is it you know they value accuracy and Goff over Wentz? Is it simply because you’ve seen some reports saying so? For every report saying Goff, there is one saying Wentz. Or do you have some other magic way of knowing this? Because if its just your hunch, your belief, then that is a far more ‘invalid argument’ than what Grant said, which is based on something tangible. Making this entire coversation pointless.

                FYI, I didn’t say anything about why you had stopped posting for a bit.

              16. Ah, see Mid, I knew if given time you’d be able to come up with a good, err, reason why it wasn’t a valid argument. Makes one wonder why you just went with the coversation killer of ‘that’s not a valid argument’ in the first place! :-P

                Seriously Scooter?! I had a college assignment that required my full attention. My comment had absolutely nothing to do with trying to “kill the conversation”. You made a baseless assumption of me that had no merit.
                I’m not going to post every report that talks about the Rams leaning towards drafting Goff because it would be pointless and a waste of time since Goff and Wentz will probably not fall past the Browns. I’m also not going to take the time to look them up and post them because I have several other things I am doing a balancing act with. I only come on here for a small reprieve from that madness.

              17. First off, kudos on furthering education mate.

                Second, there was no need to comment at all if you were busy. Everyone understands that. You can come back to it later. We all do that. But the ‘argument’ you made (saying Grant’s argument was invalid) was the only invalid argument made in the thread. It is indeed a conversation killer, as it leaves the first person with no recourse for debate but to reiterate what they just said, or try and explain why it is, which they shouldn’t have to do. In this case, it seems pretty obvious why using the past as a guide to the future is a valid argument. Even if it is proven inaccurate, it is a valid line of reasoning.

                Third, nobody is asking you to look up the reports. We’ve all seen them, and if not, are probably willing to believe you have. However, as Grant has pointed out, and as I point out in my last post, there are at least as many reports saying they like Wentz.

                Fourth, I see you didn’t respond to the rest of my last comment. Where are you getting your inside information that is making your argument so much more valid than Grant’s?

  24. Question to anyone – Is it still legal to draft a player, the trade the rights to him later in the same round?

    For example: If the 49ers took Stanley at 7, could they trade him to the Titans before pick 15 is up? Or if If the 49ers took Wentz at 7, could they trade him to the Jets before pick 20 is up?


    The most exciting prospects are the ones with coachable flaws. Calhoun’s mistakes are the type that can be fixed with experience and good teaching of fundamentals. He exhibits a lot of the traits that can’t commonly be coached or taught to a player. He’s shown a multi-faceted repertoire of pass rush moves proving he’s more then a lot of the one trick ponies we see going high in the draft only to be shut down by experienced and more talented NFL lineman.

    He’s not the most physically gifted pass rusher but again we’ve seen far too many edge rushers go high that follow the storyline of looking like Tarzan only to play like Jane. He’ll need to add a little beef to fully adapt to the next level but not so much that you’ll have to worry about it effecting his athleticism.

    Big boards have him as a second rounder. I’ll be pretty surprised if he makes it out of the first.

      1. I’d rank the top players I see as true weakside 3-4 rush LB’s as:


            1. Good – Agile, fast, agile, tall (but still sets the edge and packs a punch).
              Can be a true OLB that can drop into coverage once in a while. Good closing speed on QBs or ball carriers. Will turn and chase down fast running backs.

              Needs to improve – Needs coaching up. Needs to show he’s more than a workout wonder. His sacks from from athleticism and good hand punch. Needs to develop swim, rip, spin and other classic moves.

              His pro day

            2. I like Kaufusi on day two, but he’d be a good day three alternative. A Baalke type. Small-ish school. I can’t find his combine stats, but his arms look long.

          1. Without knowing more about the team I’d have to wonder why he couldn’t produce more in College. For a guy his size he should have had a lot more production versus the talent he was facing.

            He’s a 6th-UDFA. He has value with high upside versus the cost in that range. Anything sooner and you’re using a high pick on a player that’s most likely going to top out as a good depth player.

            1. Great breakdown. I marvel at his athleticism, but wonder about his lack of sacks production. Funny thing, he’s very disruptive in the run game, causing or getting TFLs. That usually translates to sacks too, but not with him.

              I see him as an athletic gamble pick. His existing run defense and disruption jacks him up a round. I was thinking the early 6th round.

              If I were a scout I’d want to see how he responded to coaching. Is he a slow learner of did he just over rely on athleticism?

              Also, pass rushers have to be a little bit nuts. Nothing kills a pass rusher’s productivity like a well balanced mind. Does he have that edginess and desire to routinely blow through guys 60lbs larger?

              1. Dadi Nicolas and Travis Feeny of Washington are very similar in size and athleticism, but I would take Feeny because he has a better production track record.

        1. Nice list CfC. I think the 49ers will rank Ogbah higher, but as far as true weakside rushers go you put together a good list.

    1. I really like Calhoun, I think he’s one of the safest edge rusher picks available. However, I don’t see him ever being an elite player. I see him as a good starting calibre OLB for a long time, best suited as being the complementary edge rusher opposite a star edge rusher. I think he’d be a good complement to Lynch.

    2. CBS has him at 51, and Draftek had him fall 42, and he is now at 62.
      Calhoun may have been the beneficiary of having good team mates around him. I still want the Niners to draft him, but with a second or third round pick.

  26. It puzzles me so many were assuming the Niners even had Goff or Wentz at the top of their draft board. It’s virtually impossible to know for sure what QB Kelly likes in this draft. But, I agree, this is a weak QB class…both Goff and Wentz have been severely over-hyped, which makes me believe the Rams are crazy for giving up so much to get one of them. I’ve felt all along that Baalke would grab the BPA, hoping that it’ll be Buckner. I see no way he makes it out of the top 10. I don’t see the Rams trading up having any impact on Baalke’s pick, whatsoever.

  27. Just curious if there is a consensus among the college game experts here on who they want the most and who they think the 49ers will take- ie, if Buckner is there do they take him over Stanley? Bosa over Buckner? Jack over Ramsey?
    * I am happy w the Rams move as I would prefer to get either speed at LB or an impact edge rusher, and while I like Goff, I think Baalke would prefer to build w defense first and ride w Gabbert- provided Chip sees enough in him.

    1. I’m no kind of football expert, but I’m a dedicated fan. I’d take…
      – Buckner over Stanley
      – Buckner – Bosa Tie (Buckner the better scheme fit, but Bosa is the much needed edge rusher.)
      – Ramsey over Jack, only because of knee concerns.

        1. Stanley and Buckner are two kinds of trade bait with the Titans. 7 should fetch 15+43. If the Titans are over eager and feeling rich, 7+142 for their15+33. (I’m greedy)

      1. I think our secondary is fairly solid, but w Hodges being a major question mark, and even Bowman’s longevity to a certain extent, I am surprised by taking Ramsey over Jack.

        Thx for the reply. Perhaps Grant should consider a poll on this topic.

    1. Silver is one of the national reporters I put the most stock in, especially anything that effects the Browns. That’s one of the reasons I’m thinking its Goff at pick 1.

      1. I concur. The level of competition makes Goff a superior choice, and the lower level of competition makes Wentz more of a gamble.

        1. But Goff didn’t play well against good competition. Please explain how he is a better prospect than Paxton Lynch.

          1. Like what may other posters have said, the Cal defense sucked. It takes a whole team to succeed, and Cal was paper thin in depth. Once their pass rusher went down, they were doomed.
            Lynch played against teams like Bowling Green, Tulsa, Missouri St and South Fla. Against teams like Navy, Houston, Temple and Auburn, he did not do as well. Auburn made him look bad.

            1. Cal was a better team than Memphis. Goff won 14 games in three seasons. Lynch won 19 games the past two seasons.

              1. Apples and oranges there Grant. Goff played in a tougher conference.

              2. And he didn’t play that well against the good teams in that conference. Lynch destroyed Ole Miss.

              3. Sorry, Grant, I beg to differ. Cal was 1-11 three years ago. It was not very good at all. Even Goff could not make it better. If Lynch played at Cal, he probably would have had the same record.

              4. Grant, you can point out Ol. Miss, I counter with Auburn.
                In the Auburn game, Lynch was 16-37 for 106 yards, 2.9 yard ave.,one Int, no TDs and he had a 14.7 QBR.

              5. I mentioned the 5 picks in a previous post, but Daniners pointed out that 3 picks were due to the receiver lapses.

          2. I could give my reasons for preferring Goff, but it would take too long and I’m almost OTD for the morning. A quick list…

            – Goff’s 21. If (a big if) Lynch develops the pocket, footwork, vision, release Goff currently has, it will be at around 25-27. The earlier a skill is developed, the more it holds up under fatigue and pressure.

            Even if there are no changes in Goff’s conditioning routine, he should fill out a little, and gain a little more zip on the ball (not that he needs it).

            How do Lynch and Wentz stack up at 21 years old?

            There’s a “sweet spot” in a pro athletes life, when their knowledge+technique+physical abilities are all at their peak. For most, its painfully brief.

            Goff has the “hard to teach” stuff down already. Even if Wentz and Lynch go on to have stellar careers, Goff’s sweet spot will be at least three seasons longer.

            1. Different sports use different measuring sticks. For valid reasons, because they measure both experience and performance benchmarks relative to age.

              Football is all about performance relative to freshman, sophomore, junior, senior, rookie, etc. (Age becomes a bigger concern later in a players career)

              Other sports are all about age brackets. Under 16, Under 21 and so on.

              I’m somewhere in the middle. To me, Goff is a Greg Lemond. A fresh faced kid goes to Europe and takes the Junior worlds. He wasn’t near the best, be clearly one of the top talents in cycling. If not for a hunting accident, he would have at least equaled the Badgers TDF wins.

              And then there’s Goff. 19, fresh out of Marin Catholic, already a better drop back than Wentz-Lynch has, playing Pac 12 defenses on a talent depleted team.

              Goff in a runaway. I’ll laugh my head off if the Rams take Wentz (and that’s not a knock on Wentz, who I think will also be very good)

              1. Correction – “He wasn’t near the best, be clearly one of the top talents in cycling [at that time]”

              1. With Gurley as the RB, they want Goff to hand off the ball. He will fit the Fisher scheme nicely, and Goffs had great pocket skills. His accuracy while on the run was impressive last year, and he constantly could find the third option.

              2. Guess we will find out in a couple weeks if you or I am correct.
                Still think Goff goes to the Rams, and from what I can gather, Cleveland wanted Wentz because he is bigger and can take the punishment from the Steeler, Bengal and Raven pass rushers.

              3. If La Canfora is correct its good news for the 49ers. It means a stud defensive player will drop to 7.

  28. My mock after the Rams trade still entails 2 moves back.
    First, trade back with the Bears and get their first and third for them moving up 4 spots to select Elliot, who the Eagles covet since they traded away Murray. Then move back to the 20 spot and garner the Jets first and second for the 11th pick. Maybe deal with Atlanta, Buffalo or the Colts if the Jets balk. With that 20th pick, the Niners can select Floyd if he falls to them, or Billings. A dark horse might be Kevin Dodd, Spence or Nkemdiche. Conklin or Taylor Decker could also be options.
    Getting those second and third round picks might be nice, but I am greedy and want more. Maybe trade with San Diego. Offer Brandon Thomas, Quinton Patton and Bethea for their second round pick. Maybe go all in with Kaep and trade Gabbert to Denver for their first or second.
    Target getting as many picks as possible in the second round. Maybe offer the Niner third fourth and fifth for a second.

      1. Yep, therein lies the fatal flaw with this scenario. Seb has ID’ed where he’d like to trade back to from, but not why the Jets (or any of the other options for trading up) would wish to do so.

        I think there is a real chance of finding a trade partner for teams interested in Elliott, or if one of the top QBs falls (though you’d have to think the 49ers would just take the QB in that scenario). I think the best bet for a trade partner after that would be the Titans, if they want to get a top 10 talent. They now have plenty of ammunition, and I think they could look to move up for an OT.

        1. That is why I also postulated those other teams. They may covet a player at 11 that would not last until 18 or 21.

          1. Might being the operative word. As it stands I think the most likely trade down targets are the Eagles, Bears and Dolphins (for Elliott) and Titans for an OT. I don’t see any team in the late teens or early 20s being willing to give up too much in a trade up unless an exceptional talent falls to the early teens. I think for those trades you’d have to accept you might lose in terms of traditional trade value charts.

            1. Scooter_McG – Good list of potential trade partners. If Wentz fell to 7 I’d include the Jets as a potential trade back partner.

              By chart if would cost the Jets two about a 2nd + 2017 2nd. And then there’s the Wilkerson factor.

              1. Agreed Brodie. Rumour is they tried hard to get to #1. If the QB they wanted at 1 isn’t taken by the Rams then the Jets become a realistic trade partner for any team so long as that player stays available. For the Jets to move up, Wilkerson is most likely used as part of the trade. I think #20 + Wilkerson + perhaps a mid rounder is enough to move up to #7.

              2. Wilkerson’s valuation is tricky. There’s good depth at interior defensive line, and the Jets need cap space.

                I wish I knew more about how sign-n-trades worked. I wouldn’t want to trade for him without a long term deal in place. Can contracts be signed and forwarded to the league office within the 15 minute time frame it takes to draft a player?

                I’m guessing it (might) work like this…
                – The new team and Wilkerson agree to a new deal.
                – Contacts are drawn up in advance, but with the Jets name instead of the new team.
                – If the new team and the Jets agree to a trade, the Jets+Wilkerson sign the new deal just before the trade is executed.

              3. Brodie,

                The Jets can just give the team trading for Wilkerson permission to negotiate a new contract with him.

              4. Rocket – I understand the permission part, and that contracts can be negotiated in advance. Its the timing that interests me.

                Lets say the trade’s happens. The Jets picked Wentz at 7. Its a done deal. But suddenly Wilkerson refuses to sign the new contract. He wants more. Lots more.

                A team would want shakedown protection in case a player refuses to sign the new contract after the trade’s executed.

              5. Brodie,

                If Wilkerson agreeing to a new deal is part of the trade agreement then the trade isn’t going to be completed without an idea of what it’s going to take to sign him. I guess he could change his mind, but nobody would ever trust his agent again. Ultimately a trade can be revoked if all terms of the agreement aren’t met, but that would be pretty messy in this context considering it revolves around drafted players.

            2. Atlanta wants more LB and DE help. Colts need a pass rusher and O line help. Bills may target a QB and D line. Jets could want a QB or O line help.
              Moving up 8-12 spots may allow them to get the player they have targeted.

        2. Scooter, you may be right about the Titans, and they could easily afford a second rounder.
          Both Stanley and Conklin may be available at 11, so maybe the Niners could still move back with Chicago.

      2. Even with the Clady deal, with his injury history, they should target Stanley, Conklin or Decker.
        Who knows, they may even select Paxton Lynch.

  29. Why I think we should draft defense with at least the first two picks.

    1. Regardless if Kelly’s offense becomes magical or if it sucks the Niners defense is going to be on the field a lot.

    2. This might be the modern world of football but defenses still win championships.

    3. Talent depleted.

    4. Defenses are more transferable between changes of HC’s.

    5. Failure rate of the draft prospects ‘seems’ to be lower on defense then offense.

      1. It wouldn’t surprise me if the 49wrs went into the season with just Brown and Pears competing at RT.

  30. Tell that to Baalke. He thought RT was so important, he put Boone in at LG, and inserted pathetic Pears as the RT.

      1. Yet Boone played tackle in college, and he is light years better than Pears.
        If Pears was better at guard, why did Baalke put him in at RT?

      2. Also, when Davis went down in 2014, Boone was shifted to RT, so he had played RT and did well. Baalke let his emotions dictate his decisions, to the detriment of the team.

          1. And where is JM now? Baalke was so emo stubborn, he refused to play the best player at a critical position.

          2. Grant Cohn April 17, 2016 at 9:25 am
            Jonathan Martin played right tackle in 2014.
            I’d say, that’s where he lined up on the field. Saying he played the position is giving him a bit more credit then he deserves.

  31. I agree with Grant; and want to offer another perspective about how much the Rams overpaid.

    The difference between Goff or Wentz is not big enough to justify going all the way up to No. 1 pick. If they did not have to go to number one to be assured of getting one of those two, they went way too far.

    If the Rams just have a strong preference, they should have put together a cheaper bundle to get their choice of the two. Wentz and our number ___ for your Goff? Or Goff and our number ___ for your Wentz?

    If they went to No. 3 (no guarantee they would get there, I know), the “worst” they could do is not get a QB and make dole out bruises with Tunsil and Gurley drilling everybody for four years; and still have five more defensive picks to solidify the NFC West the real black and blue division.

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